Brian Flores suing NFL, NY Giants, Dolphins, Broncos.

[YoloinOhio]

Just now, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I don't know about anyone saying the ratio should be equal or close, but when there are 32 head coaches and only 1 is black, despite a fairly large number of long-time black assistant coaches, it does make most people go "hmmmmm".

 

Then there are two recent cases where a black coach who was hired seems to have been given a mightly short leash (Culley, Vance Joseph).

 

I thought based on the team's record and development, Flores did not deserve to be fired.  It sounds as though it was a case of "pissed in bosses wheaties", not coaching competence (but of course, that will get you fired from any job).

I love how the nfl statement yesterday, a whole 2 hours after the lawsuit broke, said it was without merit and they would defend it. So, not even an investigation needed? 

[loveorhatembillsfan4life]

50 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I don't know about anyone saying the ratio should be equal or close, but when there are 32 head coaches and only 1 is black, despite a fairly large number of long-time black assistant coaches, it does make most people go "hmmmmm".

 

Then there are two recent cases where a black coach who was hired seems to have been given a mightly short leash (Culley, Vance Joseph).

 

I thought based on the team's record and development, Flores did not deserve to be fired.  It sounds as though it was a case of "pissed in bosses wheaties", not coaching competence (but of course, that will get you fired from any job).

Culley is weird one for me. It seems in my eyes he was setup to fail   Houston was a crap show and Culley actually had them playing respectably

Edited February 2, 2022 by loveorhatembillsfan4life

[BuffaloRebound]

Just now, loveorhatembillsfan4life said:

Culley is weird one for me. It seems in my eyes he was setup to fail   Houston was a crap show and Culley actually had them playing respectfully.  

Yes.  And now they’re gonna hire a white former player with zero coaching experience.  Bad look.  

[Buffalo Bills Fan]

Just now, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I don't know about anyone saying the ratio should be equal or close, but when there are 32 head coaches and only 1 is black, despite a fairly large number of long-time black assistant coaches, it does make most people go "hmmmmm".

 

Then there are two recent cases where a black coach who was hired seems to have been given a mightly short leash (Culley, Vance Joseph).

 

I thought based on the team's record and development, Flores did not deserve to be fired.  It sounds as though it was a case of "pissed in bosses wheaties", not coaching competence (but of course, that will get you fired from any job).

 

Agree Flores didn't deserve to be fired. Understand his and everyone point of view.  The thing makes it hard like Ken Dorsey for Bills (example per say). Allen wanted to keep him. Rules they had to interview others. Besides Dee Martin and Edgar Bennett publicly announced who else Bill's interviewed for OC? The rules is really flawed They can come with something better.

[colin]

10 hours ago, major said:

What if - and believe me this is hypothetical - but if you were offered $100,000 to tank a game by an owner, how much do you think a serious gambler would be willing to pay you to lose a game, throw an interception, fumble a ball, etc.  Would that do anything for you? #officespace

 

Seriously, this rabbit hole has the potential to open up all kind of dirty laundry. All

thanks to Bill Belicheat and technology (how poetic)

 

poetic indeed.

 

someone has to come up w some kind of meme about bill saying he only thought dabol got the job ahead of time due to a technical issue he had with one of his cameras in the giants facility.

[Coffeesforclosers]

1 minute ago, loveorhatembillsfan4life said:

Culley is weird one for me. It seems in my eyes he was setup to fail   Houston was a crap show and Culley actually had them playing respectfully.  

 

It's ok to feel like Culley got jobbed, because Culley got jobbed.   

 

 

[mikemac2001]

Just now, Coffeesforclosers said:

 

It's ok to feel like Culley got jobbed, because Culley got jobbed.   

 

 

Ya that was the biggest BS ever 

 

Houston was a tough towards the end of the year and actually playing decent with not much talent 

 

[Coffeesforclosers]

5 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

See above text from Marcel L-J asserting Flores has "corroborating evidence" and witnesses.

 

This is what actually has the NFL worried.  Flores having proof of want amounts to a point shaving/match fixing scandal.

 

Ross is so ***** dumb I'm honestly wondering how I'm not a billionaire.  It's got to be easier than it sounds if he can pull it off.

Just now, Coffeesforclosers said:

 

This is what actually has the NFL worried.  Flores having proof of what amounts to a point shaving/match fixing scandal.

 

Ross is so ***** dumb I'm honestly wondering how I'm not a billionaire.  It's got to be easier than it sounds if he can pull it off.

 

[BuffaloRebound]

Roger Goodell and NFL owners right now figuring out which team is gonna hire Flores to make this go away.  

[BuffaloBillyG]

31 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

 

Flores says he was never going to stand for it. Proceeds to coach the team for 2 years while concealing the fact that he was being offered a bribe to tank games.

 

That's one thing that doesn't sit right with me. Understandable, guy just wanted to do his job and do forth. However at minimum, he suppressed the information while continuing to collect millions of dollars in salary from the guy that just tried to talk him into some pretty serious illegal and unethical deeds. Had he come forward to the league or media or anything public before I could get on board that he had a high character and morals. Waiting until after he gets canned just makes it look like jilted lover syndrome.

Edited February 2, 2022 by BuffaloBillyG

[The Wiz]

1 minute ago, BuffaloRebound said:

Roger Goodell and NFL owners right now figuring out which team is gonna hire Flores to make this go away.  

The old Michael Vick maneuver 

[HamSandwhich]

2 minutes ago, BuffaloRebound said:

Roger Goodell and NFL owners right now figuring out which team is gonna hire Flores to make this go away.  

Why, he doesn’t really have much from what I see. 
 

Really hope they fight this and win. This is out of hand.

Edited February 2, 2022 by HamSandwhich

[MJS]

12 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said:

 

This part all amazes me.  So Ross was pissed at Flores for screwing up the tank - but (1) they still went 5-11, (2) they still were in a position to draft the QB Ross initially wanted (Tua), (3) they were also in position to draft Herbert, (4) the Dolphins' GM, who is Black, picked Tua over Herbert, and (5) IIRC the Dolphins were the only team in the league last year with a Black coach, GM, and QB.  Yet Flores is claiming that Ross held it all against him for over a year and ultimately fired him, because racism.

 

That part of the narrative makes no sense and tells me it was only included in an effort to destroy Ross/the NFL and to bring maximum attention and settlement leverage.

Well it is pretty clear that the stuff with the Dolphins has nothing to do with racism. It's a huge corruption scandal though. Flores was clearly mistreated and asked to do some bad stuff by the owner if everything he is claiming is true.

 

Sounds like there was some real tension between Flores and Ross and it makes sense that Ross would want to move on. Any coach interviewing for that job should take notice and think twice about accepting it. And when this is all over I wonder if Ross will even be allowed to keep the team.

 

Again, none of this Dolphins stuff seems to have to do with racism to me.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

10 hours ago, TheFunPolice said:

So Flores was willing to circumvent the Rooney Rule when it suited him, because he knew a guy from NE.

 

Well, we don't know how Flores reacted to that suggestion. 

But: His 2019 OC was Chad O'Shea, who he knew in NE as WR coach.

In 2020 his OC was Chan Gailey - I'm not sure what Chan's connections to Flores may be, but he would certainly count as an "old white retread"

In 2021, he promoted 2 internal assistant coaches to co-offensive coordinator

 

So one wonders just how open-ended and inclusive Flores own coordinator searches might have been, and whether anyone had an interview after the staff identified a preferred candidate, because in general, Flores hiring practices look like retread/cronyism hires.

 

 

[RoyBatty is alive]

14 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

I love how the nfl statement yesterday, a whole 2 hours after the lawsuit broke, said it was without merit and they would defend it. So, not even an investigation needed? 

Kneejerk legal response.  I think they made a mistake with that, they are going to have to investigate these allegations, if you can spend millions investigating deflated footballs you damn sure have to investigate this.

[Bob in STL]

19 minutes ago, Fan in Chicago said:

This timeline does not sit well with me. Coordinators should not be interviewing for new jobs in the days leading up to playoff games. I am aware that this is within the rules, but I dont like it. I dont want the coordinators distracted. 

This happens literally every single season.  

[colin]

im kinda 50/50 on the rooney rule.  it feels like a forced mandate, a wrong to correct a wrong if you will, but given that it's only interviews, it's also kinda practical and may well lead to better results.  net net i think it's fine.

 

in terms of is it a sham, or is it working, does the nfl not have many more minority coordinators than it did just a little while ago?  if that's true, then i'd say it's doing the job as intended.  head coaching might not be up to snuff in the representation regard, but i think you have to give it time and see how hiring goes.  firing happens so often in the nfl that it's kinda hard to take a snap shot, you have to look at it over time.

 

the next question to me is, how many minority coaches should there be?  black nfl players are obviously over represented (vs pop) but is that where head coaches even come from?  do they come from college coaches, general pop, etc?  i think obviously it's a mix, but if the interviews are happening it's got to be a good thing for those who want more minority coaches, even if they seem like sham interviews sometimes, cuz you gotta be in it to win it/miss 100% of the shots you don't take etc.

 

if flores has evidence of ross asking for tanking, that's a massive bombshell, and should cost ross the team, and probably create some new rules.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

25 minutes ago, Buffalo Bills Fan said:

 

Agree Flores didn't deserve to be fired. Understand his and everyone point of view.  The thing makes it hard like Ken Dorsey for Bills (example per say). Allen wanted to keep him. Rules they had to interview others. Besides Dee Martin and Edgar Bennett publicly announced who else Bill's interviewed for OC? The rules is really flawed They can come with something better.

 

When one looks around at the result of only one black HC in the NFL, despite numerous long-time black assistants, it's hard to feel that hiring is equitable.

 

That said: it's not uncommon in every job that the hiring manager(s) may have an internal candidate who they prefer, and who will likely get the job unless an external candidate just overwhelmingly wows the interview panel, or the internal candidate has some dirty laundry that gets uncovered and a Really Bad Interview Day, or the internal candidate turns down the job offer to take a different position.

 

It's usually not overt "-ism" that's the reason for this: when you know someone and know 100% for sure how they treat people and how they behave OTJ, you feel more confident that if you hire them, they'll do a good job.

 

And it's not a "sham" to interview other people anyway, because they may knock your socks off, or the top candidate may go elsewhere.

 

10 minutes ago, Bob in STL said:

This happens literally every single season.  

 

And it doesn't sit well with many of us, every single season.

[Ross Murdock]

Sounds like Flores has a slam dunk case. Beleihick all but confirmed the scam. Every poster here knows the Rooney roll was a sham. I don't like the idea of quotas at all, but if you look at the NBA which is 74% black, and the coaching is about 45% black, Vs. the NFL which is 71% black, but head coaching is now 2% black, something's not right. I just don't believe that blacks can't be solid head coaches. Even the coordinator positions are only 20% black. Plus according to todays NYT's black coaches are 75% more likely to be fired after a WINNING season Vs. white coaches. You don't have to wonder if Dolphin's owner Ross would have made the ridiculous offer of paying a "$100K bonus" for each additional loss in 2020 if Flores was white.. I think not.  

[dave mcbride]

9 minutes ago, colin said:

im kinda 50/50 on the rooney rule.  it feels like a forced mandate, a wrong to correct a wrong if you will, but given that it's only interviews, it's also kinda practical and may well lead to better results.  net net i think it's fine.

 

in terms of is it a sham, or is it working, does the nfl not have many more minority coordinators than it did just a little while ago?  if that's true, then i'd say it's doing the job as intended.  head coaching might not be up to snuff in the representation regard, but i think you have to give it time and see how hiring goes.  firing happens so often in the nfl that it's kinda hard to take a snap shot, you have to look at it over time.

 

the next question to me is, how many minority coaches should there be?  black nfl players are obviously over represented (vs pop) but is that where head coaches even come from?  do they come from college coaches, general pop, etc?  i think obviously it's a mix, but if the interviews are happening it's got to be a good thing for those who want more minority coaches, even if they seem like sham interviews sometimes, cuz you gotta be in it to win it/miss 100% of the shots you don't take etc.

 

if flores has evidence of ross asking for tanking, that's a massive bombshell, and should cost ross the team, and probably create some new rules.

The obvious solution is a draft lottery for, say, the worst 6-7 teams. And I wouldn't do it like the NHL, where the worst team has an advantage. Moreover, you could make so that only round 1 has a lottery, with rounds 2-7 following the current order of worst to best. Seems like a solution to me. Ross isn't the first to do this; the Browns apparently did it too.