Are we over-reacting to the 13 seconds?

[LABILLBACKER]

7 hours ago, vincec said:

The defense was a disgrace most of that night, not just the last 13 seconds of regulation. They gave up 552 yards of offense and 7.6 yards per play. They gave up the go ahead TD to Hill inside of two minutes and the losing TD in OT like they weren’t even on the field.

 

I do think people are focusing too much on those 13 seconds and should actually look at it as just a piece of how horrible they were overall, especially when you see how the Bengals less touted defense did in the subsequent game.

I go a step further. 80 points in our last 2 playoff games w/ KC.  We'll never be "built to beat KC" until Kelce retires. 

[out]

can you play defense and special teams for 13 sec. WT@

[Success]

8 hours ago, LABILLBACKER said:

I go a step further. 80 points in our last 2 playoff games w/ KC.  We'll never be "built to beat KC" until Kelce retires. 

 

I mean, the last game came down to a coin flip - at THEIR place.  

 

It's not like we're miles away from beating them.

 

[Billsfan1972]

Though I swore I was done with the site until September, just think how much needs to go right to make, much less win a Superbowl.  Heck until last year even Tom Brady's SB's were almost all decided by a FG and the last minute (or the games leading up to it).

 

The next # of years could be a real challenge when you look at the QB's in the AFC and those rumored to be coming (i.e. Rodgers, Wilson....).

 

So no absolutely not over-reacting and just think how many bad decisions went into those last three plays (kickoff and two passes).  

 

A physical error is one thing, but coaching or a lousy flag is another.

 

I point out NO, one years a complete brainf@rt and Diggs reception and then the next the non-call.....  Then last year both Brees and Brady were terrible (Brady less so) and now NO's window probably closed. 

Edited February 7, 2022 by Billsfan1972

[billsfan1959]

8 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

Though I swore I was done with the site until September, just think how much needs to go right to make, much less win a Superbowl.  Heck until last year even Tom Brady's SB's were almost all decided by a FG and the last minute (or the games leading up to it).

 

The next # of years could be a real challenge when you look at the QB's in the AFC and those rumored to be coming (i.e. Rodgers, Wilson....).

 

So no absolutely not over-reacting and just think how many bad decisions went into those last three plays (kickoff and two passes).  

 

A physical error is one thing, but coaching or a lousy flag is another.

 

I point out NO, one years a complete brainf@rt and Diggs reception and then the next the non-call.....  Then last year both Brees and Brady were terrible (Brady less so) and now NO's window probably closed. 

 

Good to see you finally had an opinion on this topic... 

[zow2]

Definitely not overreacting.  As you see Bills coaches leave due to success, Davis Webb, etc.. all guys instrumental in Josh Allen's development, you realize how everything lined up so perfectly.   The team was mostly healthy, they were peaking, coaches were in sync, all set to host the AFCCG against the upstart but underdog Bengals.  The Bills have the better roster, they really do.  Doesn't mean they would've won the game, but they had a great shot.

Then the inexplicable 13 seconds that will haunt us forever.  I think the AFC will be even harder to crack through next season.  

Cincinnati did what we were supposed to do last year or this year.  Take advantage of the window when it's open now.  No guarantees it will line up again next year.

[Buffalo716]

23 hours ago, LABILLBACKER said:

What's absolutely nuts is Bass has successfully performed that exact pop up to the 10 yard line probably 15x this season. And maybe the return guy (Hardman) panics and calls a fair catch.  Obviously Sean's defensive scheme was a disgrace on those last 2 plays, but as SVP said on espn that night, "I'd give up a 20 yard return to shave off 5 seconds all day". Pure stupidity by Clappy.

Yeah but as I've said hardman 95% doesn't panic and he will let it go over his head at the 10 yard line 

 

I don't see a scenario where they don't get it at least at the 20-25.. except if you're right and he panics... But your coached not to panic in that situation

1 hour ago, zow2 said:

Definitely not overreacting.  As you see Bills coaches leave due to success, Davis Webb, etc.. all guys instrumental in Josh Allen's development, you realize how everything lined up so perfectly.   The team was mostly healthy, they were peaking, coaches were in sync, all set to host the AFCCG against the upstart but underdog Bengals.  The Bills have the better roster, they really do.  Doesn't mean they would've won the game, but they had a great shot.

Then the inexplicable 13 seconds that will haunt us forever.  I think the AFC will be even harder to crack through next season.  

Cincinnati did what we were supposed to do last year or this year.  Take advantage of the window when it's open now.  No guarantees it will line up again next year.

Davis Webb was not that instrumental in Josh Allen's growth

 

Allen himself, Palmer , daboll , Barkley, Dorsey , are all ahead of Webb.. Webb and Allen are friends and they work out together.. he's not Allen's quarterback guru

Edited February 7, 2022 by Buffalo716

[Success]

28 minutes ago, zow2 said:

Definitely not overreacting.  As you see Bills coaches leave due to success, Davis Webb, etc.. all guys instrumental in Josh Allen's development, you realize how everything lined up so perfectly.   The team was mostly healthy, they were peaking, coaches were in sync, all set to host the AFCCG against the upstart but underdog Bengals.  The Bills have the better roster, they really do.  Doesn't mean they would've won the game, but they had a great shot.

Then the inexplicable 13 seconds that will haunt us forever.  I think the AFC will be even harder to crack through next season.  

Cincinnati did what we were supposed to do last year or this year.  Take advantage of the window when it's open now.  No guarantees it will line up again next year.

 

I don't think the Bills are a better overall team than the Bengals. I think the Bengals are more balanced, and have a better D.

 

Allen carried the Bills too much this season. If we want to truly compete for a Super Bowl, we need a team that can win some games w/ D, special teams, running, etc.

 

I think we'll look back on the 13 seconds and see it as a vital catalyst in making the moves that we needed for finally getting the Lombardi & going on a multi-year run.

 

[TBBills]

If it was a regular season game yes.... but it wasn’t. 

[Billsfan1972]

22 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Yeah but as I've said hardman 99% doesn't panic and he will let it go over his head at the 10 yard line 

 

I don't see a scenario where they don't get it at least at the 20-25.. you can fair catch a short one and let a long one roll out

Davis Webb was not that instrumental in Josh Allen's growth

 

Allen himself, Palmer , daboll , Barkley, Dorsey , are all ahead of Webb.. Webb and Allen are friends and they work out together.. he's not Allen's quarterback guru

You don't let a pop-up drop on the 10 as there is a very good chance it doesn't go into the endzone, which is the point of the popup.  Actually I've never seen it fall to the ground.  

 

BTW look at the squibb Cincy did.  That was not going through the endzone.

[Buffalo716]

13 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

You don't let a pop-up drop on the 10 as there is a very good chance it doesn't go into the endzone, which is the point of the popup.  Actually I've never seen it fall to the ground.  

 

BTW look at the squibb Cincy did.  That was not going through the endzone.

 

I have practiced this scenario in practice over my 30 years in the game

 

Week 5 of a regular season a team will catch that pop up on the 10.. in the playoffs with minimal time.. the returner is absolutely instructed if it goes over the 10 to let it bounce into the end zone 

 

95 out of 100 times that ball rolls into the end zone.. very very rarely have I ever seen it take a weird kick and stay in play .. the bounce that keeps it in is an anomaly

 

I've ran this scenario in practice a hundred times over the years..  a squib kick you could down and no time is lost... A super high pop-up at the 20 won't roll into the end zone..  but you can fair catch it

 

And a standard pop up that's going to the 10 yard line you can absolutely just let it roll into the end zone.. you just don't see it because teams return it week five regular season... but that ball does roll out 90 out of 100 times.. so in that scenario you absolutely let it roll out

Edited February 7, 2022 by Buffalo716

[Nihilarian]

NO!

And, It's not about the kick at all.

 

It's all about the defensive strategy while allowing the best receiver's in the NFL to be wide open while covering the sidelines. Even reading other teams sites as those fans acknowledge it was a complete and utter defensive failure on the Buffalo Bills defensive coaching staff.

 

Buffalo had a 94.3 chance of winning that game at the kickoff. The defense snatched defeat out of the jaws of victory! Buffalo should have had an AFC Championship game in Buffalo in 2022.

 

I'm hoping Brian Daboll needs a DC for his NY Giants team. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Success]

56 minutes ago, Nihilarian said:

NO!

And, It's not about the kick at all.

 

It's all about the defensive strategy while allowing the best receiver's in the NFL to be wide open while covering the sidelines. Even reading other teams sites as those fans acknowledge it was a complete and utter defensive failure on the Buffalo Bills defensive coaching staff.

 

Buffalo had a 94.3 chance of winning that game at the kickoff. The defense snatched defeat out of the jaws of victory! Buffalo should have had an AFC Championship game in Buffalo in 2022.

 

I'm hoping Brian Daboll needs a DC for his NY Giants team. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The worst aspect, imo, was rushing 4.

 

That is something I'll never understand.  Rush 3 at most, but 2 would have sufficed. I saw one former player argue that they should have rushed no one.  Mahomes running there was no big threat, especially if you layered the depth of the defenders w/ the extra players dropping back in coverage.

 

I hate to think this - but I think the coaches had a lapse because they were as exhilirated as we were and lost sight of the game for a bit.  

 

[Coffeesforclosers]

I don't care how you argue it.  No loss compares to an SB loss.  

[LABILLBACKER]

1 hour ago, Buffalo716 said:

 

I have practiced this scenario in practice over my 30 years in the game

 

Week 5 of a regular season a team will catch that pop up on the 10.. in the playoffs with minimal time.. the returner is absolutely instructed if it goes over the 10 to let it bounce into the end zone 

 

95 out of 100 times that ball rolls into the end zone.. very very rarely have I ever seen it take a weird kick and stay in play .. the bounce that keeps it in is an anomaly

 

I've ran this scenario in practice a hundred times over the years..  a squib kick you could down and no time is lost... A super high pop-up at the 20 won't roll into the end zone..  but you can fair catch it

 

And a standard pop up that's going to the 10 yard line you can absolutely just let it roll into the end zone.. you just don't see it because teams return it week five regular season... but that ball does roll out 90 out of 100 times.. so in that scenario you absolutely let it roll out

First you say 95 out of 100, then 90 out of 100. So in other words probably 50-50. You're also forgetting if its kicked high enough and the returner decides to let it bounce on the 15 or 10, the coverage team can jump on it for an onside recovery before it bounces in. There's alot of things that can go wrong for the recieving team (Hardman).

[Buffalo716]

Just now, LABILLBACKER said:

First you say 95 out of 100, then 90 out of 100. So in other words probably 50-50. You're also forgetting if its kicked high enough and the returner decides to let it bounce on the 15 or 10, the coverage team can jump on it for an onside recovery before it bounces in. There's alot of things that can go wrong for the recieving team (Hardman).

I wrote a pretty long post.. I didn't go back and read to see if I wrote 95 or 90 percent 

 

Now if I would have said 95% and the second time I wrote 60% I'd be waffling.. I truly believe that they were starting at the 20 or 25 regardless of the kick 

 

The average pooch kick goes to about the 18-20 yard line... So a super high one is going to the 25.. you can fair catch that

 

A lower one is going to the 10-13.. I don't believe the kicking team will be able to get to the ball before it rolls in the end zone

 

Unless the returner let it go over his head and it takes a backwards bounce and stops rolling.. which is again possible but like I said not probable.. I have seen it happen I'm just being honest when I say the odds are unlikely 

 

You are right things go wrong

[Gugny]

11 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

First you say 95 out of 100, then 90 out of 100. So in other words probably 50-50. 

 

I'm not sure that's how math works.

[Ethan in Cleveland]

On 2/4/2022 at 7:53 PM, Sammy Watkins' Rib said:

I finally for the first time watched the 13 seconds in it's entirety.  Watching live I couldn't take the suspense and walked out of the room for the Kelsey play hoping to hear cheers rather than "f***!". My take is that McDermott was completely out coached. Same as everyone else has concluded. They were playing to not give up a 30+ yard completion while failing to realize how terrible the defensive alignment was from the snap. We literally conceded 20 yards on each play at the snap. There was nothing our players could have done post snap to prevent a 20 yard gain by either Kelsey or Hill.

 

As to the OP's question, this is a big deal because of the Bills incompetence here on back to back plays. The 5% chance of the Chiefs winning was supposed to come by penalty on a 35 yard pass play, a hail mary catch or Tyreek Hill just being Tyreek Hill and taking a 5 yard pass for a 70 yard TD. If either of those three scenarios happened it would still be as heart breaking but not as humiliating as the fact that the coaches put the players in a position to lose two straight plays. Somehow they didn't learn their lesson after the Hill play and gave a free 15 yards to Kelce on the next one before he even catches the ball.

 

The 2021 Bills defense feasted on below average QB's and below average offenses all year. They ate it them up so well they finished as both the #1 yardage and scoring defense. But that came back to bite them in the butt. No doubt the terrible defensive formations they were in during the 13 seconds likely would have prevented the Jets, Panthers or Texans from crossing midfield. But the Chiefs and Andy Ried? Come on.

McDermott cost Buffalo a SuperBowl. There is no defending him. He either was directly responsible for the strategy or did nothing to stop Frazier.  The defense was never as good as the ranking but Allen won the game. McDermott lost it. Anything less than a SB appearance next season and he should be gone. I’d rather take my chances with a hot shot young coordinator than process guy that chokes in the moment.

[TheFunPolice]

We're not overreacting at all. I still cannot imagine how the Chiefs ran 2 plays for 40 yards in 10 seconds. 

[Patrick Duffy]

Some have only recently just had their stitches removed from slitting their wrist....

 

 

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