Ed Oliver 5th year option

[Malazan]

3 hours ago, BarleyNY said:

I understood your question.  I just thought it was a dumb way to think about the situation.  There are much better ways to spend $12.7M than on one season of Edmunds.  And there are better values at the position.  while the FA market at ILB isn’t loaded, it’s not like Edmunds is a good player.  Just because some fans have massively overrated him or continue to believe that his potential will be realized someday doesn’t mean it’s true.  Reality says otherwise. 

 

Your two suggestions were completely awful though and far worse than Edmunds. So you have yet to provide the better ways to spend 12.7 *in* one year. You also seem confused again here because they can't spend the 12.7M they paid Edmunds over 2 years. 

 

I can point you to some articles on how it works, but if sign a player to a 2 year contract then you have to pay him both years which counts against the cap in both years. The player also has to agree.. this isn't some little fantasy world where a player is going to accept a 1 year deal from the Bills when he has longer term offers on the table. 

 

I should never have mentioned Edmunds in an Oliver thread. Some people can't help themselves. 

Edited January 27, 2022 by Malazan

[Thurman#1]

12 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

 

 

 

Yeah, hard to imagine them doing otherwise.

[Thurman#1]

4 hours ago, BarleyNY said:

I understood your question.  I just thought it was a dumb way to think about the situation.  There are much better ways to spend $12.7M than on one season of Edmunds.  And there are better values at the position.  while the FA market at ILB isn’t loaded, it’s not like Edmunds is a good player.  Just because some fans have massively overrated him or continue to believe that his potential will be realized someday doesn’t mean it’s true.  Reality says otherwise. 

 

 

Thing is ... it really very much IS like Edmunds is a good player. Very good.

 

That ain't reality saying otherwise, it's people who think they're way smarter than McDermott.

 

Plenty of fans don't like the guy's playing style. And he certainly isn't elite or top five or anything. Just very good and an excellent fit for the McDermott defense. They love the guy.

[Thurman#1]

6 hours ago, ScottLaw said:

The rotation did them a lot of good in that 4th quarter…. The rotation nonsense should be scraped in favor of more cap towards a dominating rusher. Maybe McD could adopt some of that “growth mindset” and get away from the 8 man rotation. It’s hurting his team. 

 

 

Get used to it. He likes it, and it makes sense.

 

Did we have a massive letdown? Yeah. Was the rotation the reason for that? No particular reason to think so. They didn't look exhausted so much as frustrated that whenever a guy or two got close, Mahomes had the transcendent talent to be able to run away. 

 

Saying "the rotation did them a lot of good in that 4th quarter" is just ridiculous logic. It was a loss. Nothing did them a lot of good in that 4th quarter. Might as well say that having Oliver didn't do them a lot of good then so we should get rid of him and every single other person on the defense. None of them did a lot of good there. That doesn't mean the problem is on whichever group or guy of them you are feeling like blaming.

 

 

[GunnerBill]

7 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

What are your thoughts on Jordan Davis?

 

Good player. Doesn't make much sense in Buffalo. 

6 hours ago, ScottLaw said:

The rotation did them a lot of good in that 4th quarter…. The rotation nonsense should be scraped in favor of more cap towards a dominating rusher. Maybe McD could adopt some of that “growth mindset” and get away from the 8 man rotation. It’s hurting his team. 

 

I don't think it is hurting as such but not totally sold that it helps. Ed needs to stay on the field more. 

[QCity]

In other news, Beane predicts the sun will rise in the east. Check out the 20 page TSW thread arguing about it. 

[1ManRaid]

14 hours ago, Nextmanup said:

He probably was, but he's still utterly replaceable.

 

 

 

Wow, I believe this is what the kids on Twitter call a "ratio".  Maybe even a "big L" to take.

[YoloinOhio]

 

[BarleyNY]

13 hours ago, Malazan said:

 

Your two suggestions were completely awful though and far worse than Edmunds. So you have yet to provide the better ways to spend 12.7 *in* one year. You also seem confused again here because they can't spend the 12.7M they paid Edmunds over 2 years. 

 

I can point you to some articles on how it works, but if sign a player to a 2 year contract then you have to pay him both years which counts against the cap in both years. The player also has to agree.. this isn't some little fantasy world where a player is going to accept a 1 year deal from the Bills when he has longer term offers on the table. 

 

I should never have mentioned Edmunds in an Oliver thread. Some people can't help themselves. 

I’m not getting into a petty snark war with you. You’re wrong about a lot here.  I’ll cover some of that and leave it there.

 

You keep talking about the FAs available last year and spending $12.7M on one of them.  That’s wrong.  Edmunds had his fully guaranteed, $12.7M fifth year option picked up last offseason, but it is not in effect until 2022.  That’s when the money will be available to spend.  As I said, I only posted the link to players signed in 2021 to show you what the ILB FA market looks like in general.

 

Your statement that the $12.7M would have to be spent in one year is wrong too. Carryover allows for unspent cap to easily be moved forward.  (There are also some ways to defer cap hits and spend future space earlier.)  There are countless ways to use $12.7M and many of them would be better than on 1 more season of Edmunds. 

 

You are correct when you state that FA players would have to agree to a deal with the Bills, but you don’t give a reason why that would be a problem.  Good teams rarely have trouble finding FAs at market value.  It’s the bad teams that have to overpay for FAs.  You’re wrong if you think it would be a problem to find players to agree to contracts here.

 

His salary of $12.7M ranks 7th in AAV for ILBs in 2022.  I don’t see him close to the 7th best ILB.  In general, it’s not a high paying position except for a handful of difference makers.  Edmunds has too many issues with his game to be in that pay range.  I’d have been okay if the team had declined his option and signed him to a more reasonable contract.  But $12.7M is his floor now. 

 

If someone wants to argue that Edmunds is a better player than I think he is (I’m looking at you @Thurman#1), then I’ll just say that I disagree and leave it at that.  You are entitled to your opinion.  I would point out that there team hasn’t signed him to an extension yet though.  Not even a whisper about it.  Allen’s deal has been done for some time now so there has been plenty of time and he’d be next in line for one if that’s the direction they wanted to go.

 

Thel lack of an extension for Edmunds and the fact that his option wasn’t picked up until the last minute leads me to believe that the team tried to extend him to a longer term, but lower AAV deal last off-season.  He didn’t bite so they picked up the option.  That’s just an educated guess, but it makes sense.  Now we just have to sit back, watch him play this season and see what the team does.

[Royale with Cheese]

8 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

I hope he’s not talking about coke.

[ArtVandalay]

On 1/26/2022 at 2:35 PM, Mark Vader said:

Do people on this board still think that Ed Oliver is a bust?

Not a bust but certainly disappointing considering his draft position and expectations.

 

9th overall pick expected to be a pro bowl caliber, penetrating, impact defensive player. 

 

He struggled bad his first year, struggled but better his second year.  Then this year he was a solid contributor. Average/solid player. Certainly not a high producing,  impact player you would expect. And he's been massively outperformed by a couple players drafted on the DLine immediately after him in Wilkins and Burns. 

 

He's still young and play has been improving, so he can still end up meeting his draft status and expectations, just not there yet. 

 

Personally, I'd like to see him take his physical shape more seriously and firm up. If he does it could propel him with a little more explosiveness and strength in his play to penetrate better. 

[John from Riverside]

On 1/26/2022 at 11:21 AM, Nextmanup said:

He probably was, but he's still utterly replaceable.

 

 

............................

[LABILLBACKER]

3 hours ago, BarleyNY said:

I’m not getting into a petty snark war with you. You’re wrong about a lot here.  I’ll cover some of that and leave it there.

 

You keep talking about the FAs available last year and spending $12.7M on one of them.  That’s wrong.  Edmunds had his fully guaranteed, $12.7M fifth year option picked up last offseason, but it is not in effect until 2022.  That’s when the money will be available to spend.  As I said, I only posted the link to players signed in 2021 to show you what the ILB FA market looks like in general.

 

Your statement that the $12.7M would have to be spent in one year is wrong too. Carryover allows for unspent cap to easily be moved forward.  (There are also some ways to defer cap hits and spend future space earlier.)  There are countless ways to use $12.7M and many of them would be better than on 1 more season of Edmunds. 

 

You are correct when you state that FA players would have to agree to a deal with the Bills, but you don’t give a reason why that would be a problem.  Good teams rarely have trouble finding FAs at market value.  It’s the bad teams that have to overpay for FAs.  You’re wrong if you think it would be a problem to find players to agree to contracts here.

 

His salary of $12.7M ranks 7th in AAV for ILBs in 2022.  I don’t see him close to the 7th best ILB.  In general, it’s not a high paying position except for a handful of difference makers.  Edmunds has too many issues with his game to be in that pay range.  I’d have been okay if the team had declined his option and signed him to a more reasonable contract.  But $12.7M is his floor now. 

 

If someone wants to argue that Edmunds is a better player than I think he is (I’m looking at you @Thurman#1), then I’ll just say that I disagree and leave it at that.  You are entitled to your opinion.  I would point out that there team hasn’t signed him to an extension yet though.  Not even a whisper about it.  Allen’s deal has been done for some time now so there has been plenty of time and he’d be next in line for one if that’s the direction they wanted to go.

 

Thel lack of an extension for Edmunds and the fact that his option wasn’t picked up until the last minute leads me to believe that the team tried to extend him to a longer term, but lower AAV deal last off-season.  He didn’t bite so they picked up the option.  That’s just an educated guess, but it makes sense.  Now we just have to sit back, watch him play this season and see what the team does.

I wouldn't pay him $12.70. Listen the last few remaining Edmunds lovers are just hanging on to a rationalization that he's not elite but great at what McD asks of him. We all know his ONLY strength is pass coverage. So why in Gods name wasn't his raw 6-5 frame guarding Kelce man to man on that last play?  Was this just another mistake by McD, long after the 13 second debacle.

[JDubya76]

Pick up is option, start talks on a 4 to 5 year deal, lowering the cap hit for the next five to six years…..wizard

[Brand J]

3 hours ago, LABILLBACKER said:

I wouldn't pay him $12.70. Listen the last few remaining Edmunds lovers are just hanging on to a rationalization that he's not elite but great at what McD asks of him. We all know his ONLY strength is pass coverage. So why in Gods name wasn't his raw 6-5 frame guarding Kelce man to man on that last play?  Was this just another mistake by McD, long after the 13 second debacle.

I question how much of a strength it really is. It certainly isn’t a strength because he’s getting in passing lanes and deflecting and/or intercepting passes. I’d love for someone to crunch the numbers for when Edmunds is in coverage, I’d guess the opposing QB’s rating - when playing a competent QB - is actually fairly high. 

[DCofNC]

On 1/26/2022 at 5:09 PM, Malazan said:

 

Name the player that would sign a 1 year deal for it that was available last offseason.

What does last offseason have to do with anything?  5th year option screws us for NEXT season.

[oldmanfan]

They’d be idiots to not pick up Oliver’s 5th year.

[Malazan]

22 minutes ago, DCofNC said:

What does last offseason have to do with anything?  5th year option screws us for NEXT season.

 

They had to pick it up last year..

[BuffaloBillsGospel]

I never thought for a second that they wouldn't now hopefully we can get a solid veteran next to him. 

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

Brandon Beane: Bills plan to exercise fifth-year option on DT Ed Oliver
 

 

https://www.buffalorumblings.com/2022/2/3/22914635/brandon-beane-buffalo-bills-plan-to-exercise-fifth-year-option-on-dt-ed-oliver
 

 

Edited February 3, 2022 by SlimShady'sSpaceForce