We took our best 2 defenders out of the game on last 2 plays. It was 11 vs 5.. here's the strategy that would have worked

[TheFunPolice]

Poyer and Hyde.. our best 2 defenders, were taken out of position to have any effect on the last 2 plays. They basically watched from 40 yards away. 

 

We also took 4 D linemen out of the play by having them do close to nothing. 

 

The game was decided on that 1st and 10 with 13 seconds. You cause issues there and they have half the time on the next play and not much to show for it. Now it's desperation heave time. 

 

Here's what I would do: ball is snapped and all 4 DL run backwards 10-15 yards. Nobody rushes at all. Normally a bad idea, but there are no super deep routes. 

 

What does Mahomes do? Does he run? tick..tick..tick 13, 12, 11, 10...

 

Fine! go ahead. 9, 8, 7 ,6,5 and we tackle you at the 35-40. 

 

Meanwhile, what do the OL do? They can't run downfield or he cannot pass. So they stand there doing nothing, not sure what to do. Probably someone goes go downfield.

 

It totally throws the offense off. That's not supposed to happen. It's also a non-hail mary play so the WR aren't running super deep routes, so there's really no danger of letting Mahomes just stand there for 5 seconds or 6 seconds to find the open man. The more time it takes, the better. 

Edited January 26, 2022 by TheFunPolice

[Ramza86]

At 1st i thought....why do we have 4 pass rushers and two LBs out there on the 1st play....

 

2nd play......why the eff do we STILL have 4 pass rushers and two LBs out there?

 

After the game obviously...i was like...wtf man...we couldnt jam kelce or hill with the ends?

[Mat68]

Ok everyone needs to stop.  Fraizer and Mcdermott were not going to lose the game with 13 secs left.  Hill at all times is a threat to take it to the house.  The last time they were on the fielded he went 65.  There is no amount of cushion Wallace or Jackson could have on Hill and I would be comfortable.

[TheFunPolice]

Just now, Ramza86 said:

At 1st i thought....why do we have 4 pass rushers and two LBs out there on the 1st play....

 

2nd play......why the eff do we STILL have 4 pass rushers and two LBs out there?

 

After the game obviously...i was like...wtf man...we couldnt jam kelce or hill with the ends?

 

Normally my suggestion wouldn't work, because it would give Mahomes all day and the WR would just run down the field. 

 

However, the Chiefs had a strategy and it had to be a quick hitter. So maybe you go 2 DL just to keep things honest and have a line of guys ready 10 yards downfield and another deep. The DL aren't getting there anyway, so you use those chess pieces in a smarter way to clog the middle. 

 

If Mahomes takes off and runs his WR aren't going to be in position to block and nobody would have expected that, because the ball needs to come out quick and it needs to be a throw. 

 

AT LEAST you pressure them to make a decision, instead of it looking like catch in the park. 

[Ramza86]

1 minute ago, TheFunPolice said:

 

Normally my suggestion wouldn't work, because it would give Mahomes all day and the WR would just run down the field. 

 

However, the Chiefs had a strategy and it had to be a quick hitter. So maybe you go 2 DL just to keep things honest and have a line of guys ready 10 yards downfield and another deep. The DL aren't getting there anyway, so you use those chess pieces in a smarter way to clog the middle. 

 

If Mahomes takes off and runs his WR aren't going to be in position to block and nobody would have expected that, because the ball needs to come out quick and it needs to be a throw. 

 

AT LEAST you pressure them to make a decision, instead of it looking like catch in the park. 

I personally thought we should be rushing 2 guys and drop everyone back.

 

I like the jam better now that i think about it lol.

[RyanC883]

23 minutes ago, TheFunPolice said:

Poyer and Hyde.. our best 2 defenders, were taken out of position to have any effect on the last 2 plays. They basically watched from 40 yards away. 

 

We also took 4 D linemen out of the play by having them do close to nothing. 

 

The game was decided on that 1st and 10 with 13 seconds. You cause issues there and they have half the time on the next play and not much to show for it. Now it's desperation heave time. 

 

Here's what I would do: ball is snapped and all 4 DL run backwards 10-15 yards. Nobody rushes at all. Normally a bad idea, but there are no super deep routes. 

 

What does Mahomes do? Does he run? tick..tick..tick 13, 12, 11, 10...

 

Fine! go ahead. 9, 8, 7 ,6,5 and we tackle you at the 35-40. 

 

Meanwhile, what do the OL do? They can't run downfield or he cannot pass. So they stand there doing nothing, not sure what to do. Probably someone goes go downfield.

 

It totally throws the offense off. That's not supposed to happen. It's also a non-hail mary play so the WR aren't running super deep routes, so there's really no danger of letting Mahomes just stand there for 5 seconds or 6 seconds to find the open man. The more time it takes, the better. 

 

I like this, it also allows players like Groot to inhibit passing plays into the middle of the field.  

[TheFunPolice]

1 minute ago, Mat68 said:

Ok everyone needs to stop.  Fraizer and Mcdermott were not going to lose the game with 13 secs left.  Hill at all times is a threat to take it to the house.  The last time they were on the fielded he went 65.  There is no amount of cushion Wallace or Jackson could have on Hill and I would be comfortable.

 

That makes sense, but the Chiefs were never going to throw deep to anyone, because if it went wrong the game is basically over. Now you burned 7-8 seconds and there's 6 seconds left and you're still at your 25. Now it's desperation hail mark from 75 yards away. 

 

You know that's not their plan. Their plan is going to be to get a quick hitter out to the 40-45 so that a hail mary is possible. Whoever catches it is instructed to go down immediately to avoid running out the clock. 

 

That's the big difference between the series before and the 13 second series. IF Tyreek catches it and starts running the game is over unless he scores a TD. As it was, they kicked the FG with 3 seconds left. They almost ran out of time immediately going down. Run around and it's game over. 

[RyanC883]

5 minutes ago, Ramza86 said:

At 1st i thought....why do we have 4 pass rushers and two LBs out there on the 1st play....

 

2nd play......why the eff do we STILL have 4 pass rushers and two LBs out there?

 

After the game obviously...i was like...wtf man...we couldnt jam kelce or hill with the ends?

 

not jamming Kelcie and/or Hill was ridiculous.  That in itself burns a few seconds for them to get into the routes.  

[TheFunPolice]

Just now, RyanC883 said:

 

not jamming Kelcie and/or Hill was ridiculous.  That in itself burns a few seconds for them to get into the routes.  

 

Exactly! They only had 3 seconds for the FG. So find a way to make them take 3 more seconds over the course of 2 plays. A jam costs at least a second. 

[st pete gogolak]

1 minute ago, Mat68 said:

Ok everyone needs to stop.  Fraizer and Mcdermott were not going to lose the game with 13 secs left.  Hill at all times is a threat to take it to the house.  The last time they were on the fielded he went 65.  There is no amount of cushion Wallace or Jackson could have on Hill and I would be comfortable.

Right.  They played to prevent a touchdown.  Everyone is acting like KC had to get to our 32 to get a FG attempt.  They didn't.  Anywhere around our 42 - 43 is going to give Butker, who has a big leg, at least a shot at a FG.  I'm guessing that was what KC was thinking.  Get to somewhere around the BIlls ' 40.  The key to the last 13 seconds was Hill's 64 yard touchdown.  It had us scared ####less that Hill would win the game with a TD.  Which of course is nuts.  The last thing you wanted was the game to go into overtime and be decided by a coin flip.  

[KOKBILLS]

26 minutes ago, TheFunPolice said:

Poyer and Hyde.. our best 2 defenders, were taken out of position to have any effect on the last 2 plays. They basically watched from 40 yards away. 

 

We also took 4 D linemen out of the play by having them do close to nothing. 

 

The game was decided on that 1st and 10 with 13 seconds. You cause issues there and they have half the time on the next play and not much to show for it. Now it's desperation heave time. 

 

Here's what I would do: ball is snapped and all 4 DL run backwards 10-15 yards. Nobody rushes at all. Normally a bad idea, but there are no super deep routes. 

 

What does Mahomes do? Does he run? tick..tick..tick 13, 12, 11, 10...

 

Fine! go ahead. 9, 8, 7 ,6,5 and we tackle you at the 35-40. 

 

Meanwhile, what do the OL do? They can't run downfield or he cannot pass. So they stand there doing nothing, not sure what to do. Probably someone goes go downfield.

 

It totally throws the offense off. That's not supposed to happen. It's also a non-hail mary play so the WR aren't running super deep routes, so there's really no danger of letting Mahomes just stand there for 5 seconds or 6 seconds to find the open man. The more time it takes, the better. 

 

The way I look at those 2 plays in the 13 seconds is that KC needed at least 40 yards...The Bills were playing 10 yds off the line (minimum) on both plays...So...They literally gave the Chiefs 20 of the 40 yards free before they ever put their foot in the ground and turned up field for more...Just stupid...

[Rock-A-Bye Beasley]

6 minutes ago, Mat68 said:

Ok everyone needs to stop.  Fraizer and Mcdermott were not going to lose the game with 13 secs left.  Hill at all times is a threat to take it to the house.  The last time they were on the fielded he went 65.  There is no amount of cushion Wallace or Jackson could have on Hill and I would be comfortable.

This isn’t stopping for a looooong time. Better get used to it. 

[MJS]

We all know what happened and we all know what should have been done. It's just beating a dead horse at this point.

[ngbills]

7 minutes ago, Mat68 said:

Ok everyone needs to stop.  Fraizer and Mcdermott were not going to lose the game with 13 secs left.  Hill at all times is a threat to take it to the house.  The last time they were on the fielded he went 65.  There is no amount of cushion Wallace or Jackson could have on Hill and I would be comfortable.

What is Hill like some 8 foot tall guy that runs a 1.4 40? He could whizz past everyone jump 15 feet in the air catch the ball and only 2 seconds come off the clock? Not likely. You have 11 defenders back I just dont see how he makes a play other than a hail mary type play which is not the strong point for the chiefs short wr's. 

[TheFunPolice]

Fearing Tyreek scoring a TD there is just crazy. 

 

If he starts trying to be a hero after catching the ball the game is over is he is tackled. That's GREAT!

 

If Kelce gets a little greedy after catching the second one the clock runs out. 

 

KC was NEVER going to go for a TD. Both Hill and Kelce got what they could and immediately went down. That's not a team that is trying to get 7. 

 

So the defense made no sense. 

[SCBills]

I'd still believe we could get in Bass FG range with Josh Allen, 13 seconds and 3 timeouts.  

 

Especially when the ball is booted out of the end zone and we get it on the 25 with no time off the clock. 

 

Honestly, my worry was that they'd get close enough to have Butker try a 65ish yard FG and he'd somehow make it.   Never in my wildest imagination did I think we'd just give them 45 yards with no resistance. 

 

[Mat68]

2 minutes ago, ngbills said:

What is Hill like some 8 foot tall guy that runs a 1.4 40? He could whizz past everyone jump 15 feet in the air catch the ball and only 2 seconds come off the clock? Not likely. You have 11 defenders back I just dont see how he makes a play other than a hail mary type play which is not the strong point for the chiefs short wr's. 

Correct.  That is why I wouldnt change the defense imo.  You change that and now Hill becomes a real problem.  A tweak here or there doesnt change the issue at hand.  Not letting Hill behind you and not having anyone who can man up Kelce.  The end of the game White was finally missed imo.  

[TheFunPolice]

But Hill was never going to go deep, that's the part people don't seem to get. 

 

Their plan was to get into FG range in those 13 seconds. Hill's route was to get yards and GET DOWN! 

 

Same with Kelce. They were never going up top, because if they did it's game over with an incomplete. 

[Niagara Dude]

1 hour ago, TheFunPolice said:

Poyer and Hyde.. our best 2 defenders, were taken out of position to have any effect on the last 2 plays. They basically watched from 40 yards away. 

 

We also took 4 D linemen out of the play by having them do close to nothing. 

 

The game was decided on that 1st and 10 with 13 seconds. You cause issues there and they have half the time on the next play and not much to show for it. Now it's desperation heave time. 

 

Here's what I would do: ball is snapped and all 4 DL run backwards 10-15 yards. Nobody rushes at all. Normally a bad idea, but there are no super deep routes. 

 

What does Mahomes do? Does he run? tick..tick..tick 13, 12, 11, 10...

 

Fine! go ahead. 9, 8, 7 ,6,5 and we tackle you at the 35-40. 

 

Meanwhile, what do the OL do? They can't run downfield or he cannot pass. So they stand there doing nothing, not sure what to do. Probably someone goes go downfield.

 

It totally throws the offense off. That's not supposed to happen. It's also a non-hail mary play so the WR aren't running super deep routes, so there's really no danger of letting Mahomes just stand there for 5 seconds or 6 seconds to find the open man. The more time it takes, the better. 

This is why you need a new defensive cordinator,  we need someone smart enough to play chess with the top QB'S in this league and crunch time situations like Sunday.  When have we seen Frazier come up with some complex innovative plan to stop a team or elite QB?

 

I just hope Bills are waiting for all HC positions to be filled before announcing they are moving on from this guy.  This is one way the Bills can improve for next season beyond free agency and draft.  Frazier is not playoff material defensive cordinator,  as I said I guarantee no team hires him as a HC

[Einstein]

1 hour ago, TheFunPolice said:

Here's what I would do: ball is snapped and all 4 DL run backwards 10-15 yards. Nobody rushes at all. Normally a bad idea, but there are no super deep routes. 

 

Dropping 4 defensive lineman is putting them into positions that they are not equipped for.

 

You might as well skip the 4 linemen and go 8 DB, 3 LB.