Reviewing Beane

[Milanos Milano]

3 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

This line and your other posts about service members has earned the "ignore" button from me.

Shame on you.

 

 

"Ignore" is your friend.  This guy is not worth my time anymore.

Why do you guys get so bent out of shape over this? It’s like handing out participation trophies. Winners win. There is great honor of dying in battle and people who protect their countries are heroes. But I reserve the monicker of elite for those that stand through the great tests of life and win against their opponents. Consistent victory is eliteness. 

[Ya Digg?]

53 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

Did I say the dead soldier shouldn’t be honored? No I didn’t, every solider who sacrifices is a hero. But let’s not lie to ourselves, the elite of the elite find a way to stay alive and accomplish a goal. Elite by definition means superiority, how can you be superior if you were killed by a competitor? 
 

 

You seriously need to stop. You’re out of control right now and it’s disgusting. It’s one thing to keep making your point about football, but seriously stop trying to defend yourself about the awful comments you are making about soldiers who are KIA

[Royale with Cheese]

5 minutes ago, Ya Digg? said:

You seriously need to stop. You’re out of control right now and it’s disgusting. It’s one thing to keep making your point about football, but seriously stop trying to defend yourself about the awful comments you are making about soldiers who are KIA

 

He needs to be removed from this board. 

[GunnerBill]

1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Just to clarify on Darby, I didnt say he was a malcontent, just that he wasn't a fit clearly for what McD wanted.  And they replaced him with Gaines, who did play well opposite Tre for the 11 games he started.  So Darby was a scheme fit decision, at least as far as we all heard and know.

 

Who made chose the final 53 roster?  Beane.  

Who traded multiple starters prior and during the season?  Beane.

Who made an in season acquistion?  Beane.

 

And we were a 7 win team.  To think that a shift in culture didn't have anything to do with our improvement as a team is short sighted IMO.  I mean we won 2 more games with essentially less talent than the season before.  And had McD not tried the Peterman experiment out against the lowly Chargers who were sub .500, on a losing streak, and only had narrow wins against the worst teams...then we probably win that game and finish with 10 wins instead of 9.  

 

Its not all Beane, I mean McD is a huge part of that, and even a bigger factor.  I am just saying, its short sighted to think Beane didn't have his stamp on that roster himself and the shift in culture that helped get the most out of our roster.  

 

I even remember multiple veteran players even commented after the KB trade that they appreciated the fact Beane was supporting what they were doing on the field by trying to add pieces to help their payoff push despite clearly in the process of rebuilding. 

 

All good...we agree on most things, but don't have to agree on everything.  I just think Beane is being a bit short changed to say he didn't impact that season or roster much.  

 

The culture change was McDermott IMO. I don't think Beane really gets credit for that. And as I say this isn't a Beane exclusive view. I think if a GM arrives post draft that record should not go to him. 

[ColoradoBills]

35 minutes ago, Ya Digg? said:

You seriously need to stop. You’re out of control right now and it’s disgusting. It’s one thing to keep making your point about football, but seriously stop trying to defend yourself about the awful comments you are making about soldiers who are KIA

 

I literally just heard the news that Bradford Freeman the last living member of the "Band of Brothers" passed away.

My "Libra Balance" is needed.   I will let Major Winters say it for me.

 

 

[Einstein]

2 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Ahhhh...the cherry picking formula.  "I will only accept opinions that I agree with!"  That always works well lol.

 

No. More comprehension issues. 

 

One is a statistic, and another is an objective opinion. There is a large difference, no smaller than the Atlantic Ocean. PFF publishing a pass-rush-win-rate percentage is a statistic. A PFF journalist posting a ranking of what they believe to be the best roster, player, etc is an opinion. 

 

I used a statistic. You used an opinion.

 

2 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

He's barely in the top 10 just for interior lineman.  

 

Simmons was an All-Pro last season. Certainly you understand how that would not be possible if he was barely in the top 10 for his position group. 

 

2 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

The general consensus for all the rankings is that Simmons isn't the 2nd best behind Donald or even close to it. 

 

Whose consensus?

 

Certainly not CBS, who lists Simmons as the 10th best defensive player (overall, not just at his position group) in the NFL and 31st best OVERALL (including QB's, WR's, etc). 

 

Nor the ESPN coaches/executives poll (where they surveyed more than 50 league executives, coaches, scouts and players), in which Simmons was 2nd only to Aaron Donald. 

 

“One of the best defenders in football,” an NFL scouting director said. 

 

“Game-wrecker,” an AFC scout said. 

 

And certainly not by these people, nor myself:

 

 

 

 

 

[Chaos]

A -

winning AFC championship moves to A

winning super bowl moves to A+

[Einstein]

48 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

The culture change was McDermott IMO. I don't think Beane really gets credit for that. 

 

There is a lot of paint being mixed together in this thread. To the point that colors are beginning to become unrecognizable. Beane is being given credit for plenty that he did not do. 

 

The Bills have had 5 players named All-Pro in the last two seasons and only 2 of the 5 have been a Beane addition. 

[Royale with Cheese]

2 hours ago, Einstein said:

 

No. More comprehension issues. 

 

One is a statistic, and another is an objective opinion. There is a large difference, no smaller than the Atlantic Ocean. PFF publishing a pass-rush-win-rate percentage is a statistic. A PFF journalist posting a ranking of what they believe to be the best roster, player, etc is an opinion. 

 

I used a statistic. You used an opinion.

 

 

Simmons was an All-Pro last season. Certainly you understand how that would not be possible if he was barely in the top 10 for his position group. 

 

 

Whose consensus?

 

Certainly not CBS, who lists Simmons as the 10th best defensive player (overall, not just at his position group) in the NFL and 31st best OVERALL (including QB's, WR's, etc). 

 

Nor the ESPN coaches/executives poll (where they surveyed more than 50 league executives, coaches, scouts and players), in which Simmons was 2nd only to Aaron Donald. 

 

“One of the best defenders in football,” an NFL scouting director said. 

 

“Game-wrecker,” an AFC scout said. 

 

And certainly not by these people, nor myself:

 

 

 

 

 

 

Oh man....

 

First, PFF win/rate percentage is not an official statistic.  It's a PFF journalist who is watching the play and determining whether or not they "won" the pass rush.

Amazing how you say sacks aren't a measure of DT but then cite PFF pass rush win rate lol.

 

Not only that, PFF bases their player rankings on the total data they collected and then rank after they grade them.  It's not just some PFF journalist randomly coming up with his own rankings. 

 

https://www.pff.com/grades

 

PLAYER RANKINGS

The grades allow for easy player comparisons, whether using an overall grade or a facet grade. While we believe the grade is an excellent baseline for how well a player performed his given role, we also believe the using the entire context is crucial when evaluating players.

 

 

GRADES VS. STATS

We aren’t grading players based on the yardage they rack up or the stats they collect. Statistics can be indicative of performance but don’t tell the whole story and can often lie badly.

 

 

WHO IS DOING THE GRADING?

PFF employs over 600 full or part-time analysts, but less than 10% of analysts are trained to the level that they can grade plays. Only the top two to three percent of analysts are on the team of “senior analysts” in charge of finalizing each grade after review. Our graders have been training for months, and sometimes years, in order to learn, understand and show mastery of our process that includes our 300-page training manual and video playbook. We have analysts from all walks of life, including former players, coaches and scouts. We don’t care if you played.

 

Well lets take a look at their grades which is how they rank the players.  I'm not paying for PFF's site to get the total rankings but here, based on their formula measuring all the DT's....they just give the top 4.  Aaron Donald being number 1.  Where's Jeffrey Simmons?  Well, he's on page 2.

https://www.pff.com/nfl/grades/position/di

 

Oh CBS who you keep citing as gospel has him the 7th best defensive player in the league.  How is him being the 7th best defensive player in the league mean he's the 2nd best in all the league?

 

"Game-wrecker" and "One of the best defensive players in football" means he's the second best defensive player?  Did all 50 of them say it?  Send me the link where the consensus is Simmons is only behind Aaron Donald.  

 

Great, you posted the tweets again.  I guess those opinions are the only one that matters.

 

But Matt LaFleur, said the best defensive players are TJ Watt or Aaron Donald with a honorable mention to Cam Hayward.  

 

Let me guess Einstein....Kevin Cole from PFF opinion means more than LaFleur.

 

 

[Alphadawg7]

4 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

The culture change was McDermott IMO. I don't think Beane really gets credit for that. And as I say this isn't a Beane exclusive view. I think if a GM arrives post draft that record should not go to him. 

All good, I see it similar but different.  McD absolutely has a bigger role in the culture change, don’t disagree with you.  But when the GM comes in and decides not to pick up the rookie 5th year option and then trades what is widely considered your most talented, and young, offensive player in Watkins because he no longer fits into the long term plans…well that sends a message immediately about the culture.  Along with the other moves I discussed prior.  
 

But all this is splitting hairs.  We are only even discussing this because Einstein foolishly has been trying discredit Beanes success overall and the first playoff run got mentioned.  
 

At this point, who cares about 2017…this is about a few people here who are foolishly trying to slam Beane and minimize the job he’s done since arriving in Buffalo.  
 

Which quite frankly is one of the most ridiculous and dumbest things I’ve ever seen on this board.  

[Royale with Cheese]

3 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

All good, I see it similar but different.  McD absolutely has a bigger role in the culture change, don’t disagree with you.  But when the GM comes in and decides not to pick up the rookie 5th year option and then trades what is widely considered your most talented, and young, offensive player in Watkins because he no longer fits into the long term plans…well that sends a message immediately about the culture.  Along with the other moves I discussed prior.  
 

But all this is splitting hairs.  We are only even discussing this because Einstein foolishly has been trying discredit Beanes success overall and the first playoff run got mentioned.  
 

At this point, who cares about 2017…this is about a few people here who are foolishly trying to slam Beane and minimize the job he’s done since arriving in Buffalo.  
 

Which quite frankly is one of the most ridiculous and dumbest things I’ve ever seen on this board.  

Isn’t Beane also responsible for the Front Office staff and Scouting Department?  He’s responsible for developing that team too right?

 

I am not behind the scenes or know what happens inside those closed doors but I would imagine Beane from day 1 had strong input.

[Einstein]

1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said:

First, PFF win/rate percentage is not an official statistic. 

 

Official statistic according to whom? Who decides what statistics  are official? Even the NFL doesn’t compute their own statistics. They rely on companies such as Genius Sports and Zebra Technologies. Others use STATS inc and a few more.

 

1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said:

It's a PFF journalist who is watching the play and determining whether or not they "won" the pass rush.

 

Journalists do not grade plays for PFF. Analysts and Senior Analysts do. Their analysts include former players, coaches and scouts. 

 

1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said:

Amazing how you say sacks aren't a measure of DT but then cite PFF pass rush win rate lol.

 

The fact that players can rank high in pass rush win rate and lower in sacks is exactly why you don’t measure an interior linemens utility by sacks.

 

1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said:

Oh CBS who you keep citing as gospel

 

I never claimed CBS to be gospel. I simply used them as an example to show that it is not only I that think highly of Simmons to the extent that he is one of the best defensive players in all of football.

 

1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said:

How is him being the 7th best defensive player in the league mean he's the 2nd best in all the league?

 

Reading comprehension again. I wrote that I believe their ranking of him was low, but still shows how highly he is viewed. 

 

1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said:

"Game-wrecker" and "One of the best defensive players in football" means he's the second best defensive player?  Did all 50 of them say it?  Send me the link where the consensus is Simmons is only behind Aaron Donald.  

 

If you have ESPN + you can read it for yourself. It’s behind a paywall. No, not all said it. The rankings are an aggregate of the 50+.
 

1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said:

Great, you posted the tweets again.  I guess those opinions are the only one that matters.

 

The point of the additional sources is to show that Simmons is thought about as one of the best defenders in all of football by many people - not just myself.

 

1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 Let me guess Einstein....Kevin Cole from PFF opinion means more than LaFleur.

 

 

I don’t engage in strawman fallacies.

[Richard Noggin]

6 hours ago, IronMaidenBills said:

Why do you guys get so bent out of shape over this? It’s like handing out participation trophies. Winners win. There is great honor of dying in battle and people who protect their countries are heroes. But I reserve the monicker of elite for those that stand through the great tests of life and win against their opponents. Consistent victory is eliteness. 

 

Soldiering isn't an individual competition, you absolute chucklehead. It's the ultimate TEAM sport. Risking one's own wellbeing for the protection/benefit of the larger whole is, in fact, ELITE SOLDIERING. And I'm usually the last person to celebrate warfare. But your take, wow...truly embarrassing.  

[34-78-83]

For the slower thickheaded ones that start or linger on in threads just like this one for weeks on end (or more) trying to be uber critical or "real" in evaluating the Bills staff such as Beane , you're missing one very simple truth in the NFL. Having a top roster, GM , coach and staff will almost always get you a ticket to the dance (say, a deep playoff run) but it does not guarantee you a dance with the queen. That goes to just one team and to go with that great roster and staff, there are a hundred uncontrollable variables that affect who gets to do that on a year to year basis. (Cincinnati made the Super Bowl over BOTH BUF AND KC)

 

With that said seeing a topic "Reviewing Beane" just brings me to a giggle when I think how far the entire Bills franchise has come under he and McD in so many ways.

 

As a fan or evaluator of your team, what you want is a roster and staff that can get you there consistently. They get you there every time they are "supposed to" (barring QB season ending injury, etc.) and even a time or two when they weren't expected to. We have that. Don't forget to enjoy it for an unsure amount of remaining years while Allen is in the very good to elite range.

Edited July 14, 2022 by 34-78-83

[Royale with Cheese]

9 hours ago, Einstein said:

 

Official statistic according to whom? Who decides what statistics  are official? Even the NFL doesn’t compute their own statistics. They rely on companies such as Genius Sports and Zebra Technologies. Others use STATS inc and a few more.

 

 

Journalists do not grade plays for PFF. Analysts and Senior Analysts do. Their analysts include former players, coaches and scouts. 

 

 

The fact that players can rank high in pass rush win rate and lower in sacks is exactly why you don’t measure an interior linemens utility by sacks.

 

 

I never claimed CBS to be gospel. I simply used them as an example to show that it is not only I that think highly of Simmons to the extent that he is one of the best defensive players in all of football.

 

 

Reading comprehension again. I wrote that I believe their ranking of him was low, but still shows how highly he is viewed. 

 

 

If you have ESPN + you can read it for yourself. It’s behind a paywall. No, not all said it. The rankings are an aggregate of the 50+.
 

 

The point of the additional sources is to show that Simmons is thought about as one of the best defenders in all of football by many people - not just myself.

 

 

I don’t engage in strawman fallacies.

 

What makes the stat official?  The NFL actually provides a guide for it.  You can also just look on their website and they'll show you the official statistics.  They don't recognize "pass rush win rate" as that's a subjective "stat" only used by PFF.

https://www.nflgsis.com › gsis › stadiumguides

 

7 of 38
Chief Statistician
The chief statistician is selected by the NFL League Office, subject to the Commissioner’s approval and shall have the responsibility to make decisions involving judgment, i.e., yardage on all plays, etc., subject to review by the League’s official statistician. The chief statistician at each game is to provide the news media with a halftime summary score sheet and at the conclusion of the game with a final summary score sheet. These forms are generated by the Game Statistics and Information System (GSIS) and the home club is responsible for duplicating the reports and distributing to all working media in the press box.
In addition, the chief statistician shall, within an hour after the game, phone the League’s official statistician to answer any questions. The chief statistician shall compare the GSIS-generated statistics against any manually recorded play-by-play and/or statistics and notify the League’s official statisticians of any areas of disagreement between the manual statistics and GSIS (official) statistics; such notification shall occur within 24 hours after the completion of the game.

 

What do these statisticians hired by the NFL do all day if they don't compute stats?

 

Again, I think Simmons is a great player.  I have never disputed that.  If he was a FA and we signed him, I would be thrilled.  What I disputed is your firm stance that he is the second best defensive player in the league.  Your evidence is all subjective and you argue as in you can't be wrong.  I mean you are still standing firm that the Titans have a better roster than the Bills.  Yes, it's all subjective but the overwhelming consensus is that the Bills have a much, much better roster.  You like to do research, show me any ranking from any site (except of course a Titans message board) where they the Titans above the Bills.  It's not even close and you just want to be the only one standing on this hill.    

 

You forgot one important piece of PFF Analysts...they hire people from "all walks of life" and people who have never played before.  That's an analyst you trust?  I've never played cricket so does that mean if I can read a guide and teach me how to analyst a play?  And yes, journalists also grade plays too.

And to be honest, I think PFF is trash.  I just used them because you were trying to use that as sufficient evidence.

 

Eric Wood was on WGR talking about PFF and how it's not very reliable and suffers from context.  He talked about a specific play where he was graded negatively.  He said his job was to pull but the DT pushed the RG so far back into the backfield causing a traffic jam.  Wood got tripped up and couldn't get to his spot to execute the block.  PFF graded Wood negatively for not getting to the block but the RG wasn't graded negatively.  

 

Also the famous one.  Some dude, possibly from England watched this Packers game and said "I don't think that's a good throw or a tough enough throw" LOL.

 

https://www.cbsnews.com/boston/news/pro-football-focus-gives-aaron-rodgers-negative-grade-after-5-touchdown-performance/

 

On Monday night, Aaron Rodgers completed 24 of 35 passes (68.6 percent) for 333 yards, five touchdowns and zero interceptions. He did this against the impressive Kansas City defense, which had given up an average of 277 yards over the first two weeks, allowing five touchdowns, making two interceptions and sacking the quarterback eight times. Rodgers rightfully had all of the ESPN analysts fawning over his abilities, because, let's face it -- he's 31 years and is the best quarterback in the league right now.

But not everybody was impressed. The folks at Pro Football Focus, who grade every single player on every single play on a scale from negative-2.0 to plus-2.0, ended up giving Rodgers a -0.8 rating on the night.

Yes, a negative grade.

Say what?

 

PFF's Ben Stockwell tried to explain.

Stockewell wrote that only two of Rodgers' touchdowns came after good throws.

"The other three touchdowns, however, were passes thrown short of the end zone on speed outs to Randall Cobb. Were they bad throws? No, they were expected throws with the credit going to Cobb for fighting through contact or defeating the coverage with speed to the edge. That makes these zero-graded throws: Three passes that have a massive effect on Rodgers' statistical performance but do not increase his grade," Stockwell wrote.

PFF also harshly graded Rodgers for a play on which he fumbled in the second quarter, as well as a third-quarter pass that should have been intercepted but wasn't.

In fact, much of the "criticism" of Rodgers sounds incredibly similar to what PFF said about Brady when the website ranked as the 33rd best player in the NFL for the 2010 season. (That 2010 season, you might remember, was the one when Brady became the first-ever player to win the MVP by a unanimous vote.)

Back in 2010, PFF wrote: "It's not that Brady (who isn't that far off from Drew Brees) isn't capable of making these [spectacular] plays, or isn't even making them, he's just not being asked to do it as regularly as Aaron Rodgers and others were. Consider it a compliment to the New England system that it doesn't put Brady in a situation where he has to constantly make breathtaking throws."

And today, PFF wrote of Rodgers: "Rodgers did his job last night, but his job was executing simple throws, putting the ball quickly in the hands of receivers like Randall Cobb in favorable matchups on short throws, and allowing others to do the heavy lifting."

(Brady, by the way, earned a 4.6 grade for his shredding of the Jaguars on Sunday.)

 

[Einstein]

51 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

What makes the stat official?  The NFL actually provides a guide for it. 

 

No they don’t. They simply explain who the chief statistician is. By the way, it’s an outside company. 

 

51 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

You can also just look on their website and they'll show you the official statistics. 

 

Again, the NFL doesn’t compute the stats. An outside company (similar to PFF), that has a contract with the NFL does it.

 

51 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

They don't recognize "pass rush win rate" as that's a subjective "stat" only used by PFF.

https://www.nflgsis.com › gsis › stadiumguides

 

They also didn’t have sacks as an “official” (I still chuckle at that) statistic until fairly recently. It doesn’t make the statistic any less useful.

 

51 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

What do these statisticians hired by the NFL do all day if they don't compute stats?

 

Again, It’s an outside company and a mix of them. It used to be Sportsradar but now it’s Genius Sports (for data push). They’re contracted out. The next contract may be with PFF for all we know (then a lot of people will lose their mind).

 

Zebra technologies does the Next Gen Stats. I think it used to be STATS Inc if I remember correctly.

 

51 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

Again, I think Simmons is a great player.  I have never disputed that.  If he was a FA and we signed him, I would be thrilled.  What I disputed is your firm stance that he is the second best defensive player in the league. 

 

You have the right to have that stance. I’m not sure why you’re trying so hard to change my mind, but it’s not happening. I see Simmons as a DPOY candidate this year and a top 3 defensive player. That isn’t changing unless something changes on the field.

 

51 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

Your evidence is all subjective

 

Not a single piece of statistical evidence i’ve shown has been subjective. 

 

The tweets I posted were simply showing that i’m not alone in thinking Simmons is one of the top defensive players in the NFL. They were never meant to be evidence of anything more than there are others like me.

 

51 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

and you argue as in you can't be wrong. 

 

I didn’t start this argument. You did. I didn’t quote myself and tell myself that I was wrong that he was 2nd best. That was you 

 

51 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

I mean you are still standing firm that the Titans have a better roster than the Bills.

 

Outside of QB, they absolutely do.

 

And they’ve proven it twice in a row. One of those times being in humiliating fashion.

 

51 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

Yes, it's all subjective but the overwhelming consensus is that the Bills have a much, much better roster.  You like to do research, show me any ranking from any site (except of course a Titans message board) where they the Titans above the Bills.  It's not even close and you just want to be the only one standing on this hill.    

 

National pre-rankings mean nothing to me. There is always a Super Bowl favorite that does nothing. I understand that there are others like you who see the Bills roster as best in the NFL. I acknowledge that you’re not alone in that thought.

 

51 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

You forgot one important piece of PFF Analysts...they hire people from "all walks of life" and people who have never played before.

 

Yes. There are NFL coaches and scouts and GM’s who have never played before either.

 

51 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

That's an analyst you trust?

 

Do you not trust Vince Lombardi or Bill Walsh because they never played professional football?

 

51 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

And to be honest, I think PFF is trash. 

 

You’re allowed to be wrong.

Edited July 7, 2022 by Einstein

[Royale with Cheese]

12 minutes ago, Einstein said:

 

No they don’t. They simply explain who the chief statistician is. By the way, it’s an outside company. 

 

 

Again, the NFL doesn’t compute the stats. An outside company (similar to PFF), that has a contract with the NFL does it.

 

 

They also didn’t have sacks as an “official” (I still chuckle at that) statistic until fairly recently. It doesn’t make the statistic any less useful.

 

 

Again, It’s an outside company and a mix of them. It used to be Sportsradar but now it’s Genius Sports (for data push). They’re contracted out. The next contract may be with PFF for all we know (then a lot of people will lose their mind).

 

Zebra technologies does the Next Gen Stats. I think it used to be STATS Inc if I remember correctly.

 

 

You have the right to have that stance. I’m not sure why you’re trying so hard to change my mind, but it’s not happening. I see Simmons as a DPOY candidate this year and a top 3 defensive player. That isn’t changing unless something changes on the field.

 

 

Not a single piece of statistical evidence i’ve shown has been subjective. 

 

The tweets I posted were simply showing that i’m not alone in thinking Simmons is one of the top defensive players in the NFL. They were never meant to be evidence of anything more than there are others like me.

 

 

I didn’t start this argument. You did. I didn’t quote myself and tell myself that I was wrong that he was 2nd best. That was you 

 

 

Outside of QB, they absolutely do.

 

And they’ve proven it twice in a row. One of those times being in humiliating fashion.

 

 

National pre-rankings mean nothing to me. There is always a Super Bowl favorite that does nothing. I understand that there are others like you who see the Bills roster as best in the NFL. I acknowledge that you’re not alone in that thought.

 

 

Yes. There are NFL coaches and scouts and GM’s who have never played before either.

 

 

Do you not trust Vince Lombardi or Bill Walsh because they never played professional football?

 

 

You’re allowed to be wrong.

 

They also explain what the Chief Statistician does as well.  Did you miss the part where they describe what he's responsible for?  What do you think he does then?

 

Oh, the Titans absolutely do and proven it the last two years?  Since the Jets beat the Titans last year, I guess that means they have a better roster lol. You think the better roster wins every time?  If that's your philosophy, there should be undefeated teams all the time if they have the best roster.  Jags have a better roster than us too I guess.  If Josh Allen doesn't slip at the goaline, would that mean the Bills have the better roster?

 

You're allowed to be wrong about the Titans having a better roster than the Bills.  You're definitely alone with this thinking.

If the argument is the Rams, Bucs, 

 

The only coach that I know of that didn't play any football was Todd Haley.  But he also grew up in an NFL family where he learned from them.

 

Yes I trust Bill Walsh and Vince Lombardi because they played football.  I didn't specify NFL, I said played the game.  Both Lombardi and Walsh played college football.  I'm talking about some PFF guy who never, ever played the game.

 

https://247sports.com/nfl/detroit-lions/Article/Detroit-Lions-TJ-Lang-Most-NFL-players-think-Pro-Football-Focus-is-garbage-107401154/

 

Is TJ Lang allowed to be wrong too? 

 

“My opinion is there’s no way you can possibly accurately grade offensive linemen if you haven’t done that job before in your life. A lot of these guys, they’re not qualified to be grading NFL players,” Lang told the Valenti Show on 97.1 The Ticket. “A lot of the stuff I realize is pretty basic, obvious information. If I clearly just get whooped and let up a sack, you can say, ‘Yeah, that guy let up a sack.'”

“But they don’t know anything about identification, what offensive linemen are supposed to do. They think if a guy blitzes off the edge, that’s automatically the tackle’s block, but a lot of times that’s not the case. They’ve always graded me well, which I don’t mind, but I still don’t respect it,” Lang said.

 

“I know most of the guys that I’ve played with absolutely hate it, just because it’s started to gain so much steam now where Sunday Night Football, Thursday Night Football, they’re actually showing stats up there for the players,” said Lang. “I think it’s absolute garbage and I think most players do.”

 

“If a guy clearly gets beat, that’s one thing. But if you’re going to say, ‘This guy didn’t pick up the linebacker, this guy missed a blitz,’ there’s no possible way that you can know that unless you know what the offensive linemen’s responsibilities are. And nobody else knows that,” Lang said. “I don’t know what Arizona’s offensive line does. They might do something completely different than what we do.

“Especially a guy sitting on the outside behind his computer looking at the game, there’s no way he knows what the hell’s going on either. It’s a total joke, in my opinion, as far as it goes grading offensive linemen.”

 

[todd]

23 hours ago, IronMaidenBills said:

When it comes to elite and superiority, decision making should be factored in. Not only elite physically, but elite mentally. Who is smarter? The sniper well hidden in a secret location, or a brute warrior charging into a well fortified position? The goal is to stay alive and win. Beating your opponents, it’s hard to do that when you’ve been stopped. I’m not sure you understand what it means to be elite. 

 

Keep digging, man.

[DCofNC]

I stop read the minute somebody gives Beane credit for White. 

[Einstein]

11 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

They also explain what the Chief Statistician does as well.  Did you miss the part where they describe what he's responsible for?  What do you think he does then?

 

Oh, the Titans absolutely do and proven it the last two years?  Since the Jets beat the Titans last year, I guess that means they have a better roster lol. You think the better roster wins every time?  If that's your philosophy, there should be undefeated teams all the time if they have the best roster.  Jags have a better roster than us too I guess.  If Josh Allen doesn't slip at the goaline, would that mean the Bills have the better roster?

 

You're allowed to be wrong about the Titans having a better roster than the Bills.  You're definitely alone with this thinking.

If the argument is the Rams, Bucs, 

 

The only coach that I know of that didn't play any football was Todd Haley.  But he also grew up in an NFL family where he learned from them.

 

Yes I trust Bill Walsh and Vince Lombardi because they played football.  I didn't specify NFL, I said played the game.  Both Lombardi and Walsh played college football.  I'm talking about some PFF guy who never, ever played the game.

 

https://247sports.com/nfl/detroit-lions/Article/Detroit-Lions-TJ-Lang-Most-NFL-players-think-Pro-Football-Focus-is-garbage-107401154/

 

Is TJ Lang allowed to be wrong too? 

 

“My opinion is there’s no way you can possibly accurately grade offensive linemen if you haven’t done that job before in your life. A lot of these guys, they’re not qualified to be grading NFL players,” Lang told the Valenti Show on 97.1 The Ticket. “A lot of the stuff I realize is pretty basic, obvious information. If I clearly just get whooped and let up a sack, you can say, ‘Yeah, that guy let up a sack.'”

“But they don’t know anything about identification, what offensive linemen are supposed to do. They think if a guy blitzes off the edge, that’s automatically the tackle’s block, but a lot of times that’s not the case. They’ve always graded me well, which I don’t mind, but I still don’t respect it,” Lang said.

 

“I know most of the guys that I’ve played with absolutely hate it, just because it’s started to gain so much steam now where Sunday Night Football, Thursday Night Football, they’re actually showing stats up there for the players,” said Lang. “I think it’s absolute garbage and I think most players do.”

 

“If a guy clearly gets beat, that’s one thing. But if you’re going to say, ‘This guy didn’t pick up the linebacker, this guy missed a blitz,’ there’s no possible way that you can know that unless you know what the offensive linemen’s responsibilities are. And nobody else knows that,” Lang said. “I don’t know what Arizona’s offensive line does. They might do something completely different than what we do.

“Especially a guy sitting on the outside behind his computer looking at the game, there’s no way he knows what the hell’s going on either. It’s a total joke, in my opinion, as far as it goes grading offensive linemen.”

 

 

We both simply keep regurgitating the same things. There is no point in continuing - One of us has to be the bigger person and stop the back and forth - that’ll be me. Cheers!