Hughes (non-) roughing penalty

[Merle]

Forgive me if I missed it, but I couldn't find any discussion of this play.   I simply could not believe that they picked up that flag when Hughes put his hands on Mac out of bounds.   He clearly wasn't trying to hit him (looked like he was actually trying to hold him up), but the fact that the refs picked up that flag, especially since it was against Hughes who many think is on some sort of NFL "blacklist", was amazing to me ... and in Gillette Stadium no less!   When asked after the game if the refs gave him an explanation for that, Belicheat just referred them to the officials.   Curious if anyone heard the explanation?

[Doc Brown]

Could be a case of the official upstairs seeing the replay where Hughes actually tried to prevent him from falling over and relaying it down to the refs on the field.  Pry trying to make up for the "just give it to them" bs call there in '98.

[Saxum]

He clearly was trying to hold him up and that is hilarious.  It is like he felt sorry for him.

 

 

[MJS]

So, I think two things played into it. First, almost all of the contact from Hughes was him attempting to hold Jones up. Second, to me it was kind of obvious that Mac Jones flopped when he felt Hughes touch him, and with refs close by watching the same thing, they could have easily come to the same conclusion, that he flopped to try and get a penalty.

 

I was pretty shocked they picked it up too. I think doing so was good for the game. Hughes was dumb to touch him, but I think we need to get away from penalties for simply touching the QB and drawing a flop. QB's get enough help.

 

And, BTW, I would expect Josh to do the same thing. It's smart and in this case it almost worked. Josh has flopped and gotten calls in his favor in the past.

[Motorin']

5 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

Could be a case of the official upstairs seeing the replay where Hughes actually tried to prevent him from falling over and relaying it down to the refs on the field.  Pry trying to make up for the "just give it to them" bs call there in '98.

 

I swear, I couldn't help but think of that call right then too. 

 

The "just give it to them" game seemed to mark the a major shift in the balance of power in the AFC East, from the Bills to the Pats. And that call felt like the balance had swung back to the Bills. 

[stevewin]

3 minutes ago, MJS said:

So, I think two things played into it. First, almost all of the contact from Hughes was him attempting to hold Jones up. Second, to me it was kind of obvious that Mac Jones flopped when he felt Hughes touch him, and with refs close by watching the same thing, they could have easily come to the same conclusion, that he flopped to try and get a penalty.

Yep - was waiting for the call 2 mins for embellishment

[Warcodered]

Could of seen it go either way not really a big deal, the penalty the Pats got themselves when it got picked up just made it seem worse to them.

[Dan Darragh]

It's proof positive that the Brady era is over in New England.

[Brand J]

It was dumb for Hughes to touch him given the way the game is called nowadays, but I had no issue with them picking up the flag - and still wouldn’t if it was Josh Allen on the other end.
I think initially Hughes was going to push Mac, but realized where he was on the field and tried to hold him up. He didn’t drag him down or throw him into the bench, so simply grabbing a QB who’s a step out of bounds shouldn’t constitute a roughing the passer penalty. On a related note, roughing the passer really needs to get back to “roughing the passer.” I’ve seen too many calls where the flag is thrown just for literally touching a QB. It’s insane.

[LeGOATski]

I was surprised as hell. He pushed a QB going out of bounds. I thought it was a total gift from the refs and was very thankful.

[Saxum]

13 minutes ago, JayBaller10 said:

It was dumb for Hughes to touch him given the way the game is called nowadays, but I had no issue with them picking up the flag - and still wouldn’t if it was Josh Allen on the other end.
I think initially Hughes was going to push Mac, but realized where he was on the field and tried to hold him up. He didn’t drag him down or throw him into the bench, so simply grabbing a QB who’s a step out of bounds shouldn’t constitute a roughing the passer penalty. On a related note, roughing the passer really needs to get back to “roughing the passer.” I’ve seen too many calls where the flag is thrown just for literally touching a QB. It’s insane.

 

And the standard needs to be same for all QBs whether they are small built or large and pocket passer or scrambler.

[CA OC Bills Fan]

See explanation in link:

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/referee-explains-why-flag-was-picked-up-on-late-hit-to-mac-jones-in-patriots-loss-to-bills/

 

[MJS]

46 minutes ago, Warcodered said:

Could of seen it go either way not really a big deal, the penalty the Pats got themselves when it got picked up just made it seem worse to them.

That was on the Milano penalty. They were offsetting penalties.

 

I bet Pats fans were really mad about that one especially since Davis went on to say it shouldn't have been called. But he's an idiot. The Pats player was aggressively pushing Milano back while walking into him and shoving his facemask into Milano's. I don't know if taunting is what I would have called it, but it was certainly unsportsmanlike conduct or something similar.

 

The Milano penalty was valid, but it's not like he hit him hard. Just slid over the top of him. There's no need to "protect your QB" in that situation.

 

We also can't hear what these players are saying in these situations. What they say to one another goes into it as well.

Edited December 27, 2021 by MJS

[Matt_In_NH]

I was shocked because it looked like a clear penalty based on the rule and the way we have seen it called before.  I think the fact he then grabbed the jersey to hold him up is what caused them to pick it up.  

[JimKelly12]

It was funny, the refs made the right call but the announcer (Ian Eagle?) didn't get the memo and was all in for trying to kill the Bills momentum.

[Wayne Cubed]

Jerry also actually got a holding call go for him. Unbelievable.

[entropyrules]

I thought it possibly was a make-up call for the somewhat ticky-tack call on a previous roughing the passer penalty (Obada?). Hughes deserved to be flagged but after the 3E+12 undeserved penalties called on the Bills during previous  games against the Pats getting one our way  just seems Meh!

[DCOrange]

3 hours ago, MJS said:

That was on the Milano penalty. They were offsetting penalties.

 

I bet Pats fans were really mad about that one especially since Davis went on to say it shouldn't have been called. But he's an idiot. The Pats player was aggressively pushing Milano back while walking into him and shoving his facemask into Milano's. I don't know if taunting is what I would have called it, but it was certainly unsportsmanlike conduct or something similar.

 

The Milano penalty was valid, but it's not like he hit him hard. Just slid over the top of him. There's no need to "protect your QB" in that situation.

 

We also can't hear what these players are saying in these situations. What they say to one another goes into it as well.

It was both. New England got penalized on the Mac play too for taunting; Trent Brown. I really couldn’t believe that all went our way. After seeing so many penalties called where the QB isn’t even out of bounds yet, to push Mac after he was already out of bounds and have it be a penalty on New England was unbelievable. 

[JoshAllin]

Heads up play from Hughes after a major screwup in touching him in the first place, I mean why not make it look completely harmless so there's a possibility of a no call

[Not at the table Karlos]

3 hours ago, MJS said:

That was on the Milano penalty. They were offsetting penalties.

 

I bet Pats fans were really mad about that one especially since Davis went on to say it shouldn't have been called. But he's an idiot. The Pats player was aggressively pushing Milano back while walking into him and shoving his facemask into Milano's. I don't know if taunting is what I would have called it, but it was certainly unsportsmanlike conduct or something similar.

 

The Milano penalty was valid, but it's not like he hit him hard. Just slid over the top of him. There's no need to "protect your QB" in that situation.

 

We also can't hear what these players are saying in these situations. What they say to one another goes into it as well.

The * got a 15 yard penalty immediately after the Hughes flag was picked up. The fans were going crazy for a while.  Milanos play was much later in the game.