All_Pro_Bills Posted February 25, 2022 Posted February 25, 2022 33 minutes ago, Tiberius said: Sorry Putin, they are not throwing down their arms. The free world is not afraid of you Ukrainians have pushed back Russians on bridge to Kherson From CNN's Nick Paton Walsh in Kherson A CNN team visited a bridge that crosses from Russian-held areas into Kherson, southern Ukraine. There had been fighting around it, with our team witnessing four large shell craters, 10 discarded Ukrainian armored vehicles and several dead, but the Ukrainians seems to have been able to push them back. On Friday morning the team also witnessed low-flying jets. Russian forces are said to be just on the other side of the bridge in hidden positions. Meanwhile, civilians are still driving back and forth over the bridge. CNN's team is also hearing air raid sirens in Kherson Friday morning. Maybe events will prove me wrong or maybe they'll prove me right. But my read of the Russian objective is not some fight to the last man scenario. It's to roll back the clock to pre-2014. Before the Maiden revolt. And it looks like both Putin and Zelensky are receptive to talks to discuss the invasion and among other things "neutral status" for Ukraine. What's Putin's pitch going to be? I expect something like this (Using mafia boss protection racket lingo): "Look, we (Russia) don't have anything against the government or people of Ukraine. Our quarrel is with the Americans over various issues that don't concern your country. But they came to Kiev, whispered promises in your ear, and sent all kinds of weapons and urged your countrymen to take an adversarial approach to Russia. All while their President and his administration made belligerent statements and threats towards us. Interfering in the affairs between our two countries. Sticking their noses in our business between each other. But when the fighting started what did they do? They split. They abandoned you. And they're response has been to impose sanctions that honestly we could care less about at the moment. I'm not looking to replace your government or replace you as President. Our countries have co-existing for a long time and have a long history together. All I'm asking is you be agreeable to taking a neutral stance and not to take one side or the other in our disagreements with the Americans. If we can agree to that then we can end this conflict as quickly as possible". If I'm right then the Washington establishment, the deep state, or whoever is calling the shoots screwed the pooch once more by severely miscalculating and playing the game two or three steps behind the curve. Putin got what he wanted, neutralizing the NATO threat or the threat of American forces parked next door for the cost of some useless sanctions. Either we need some more effective thinking and strategies out of Washington or some fresh eyes and minds on the problem. I'm sure their are competent and capable people in the intelligence services and Pentagon that understand exactly what is going on here but they are most certainly being ignored. Ignored by the idiots in charge. Now the usual characters may read this and suggest I'm "blaming America" or siding with Putin. Frankly I wish those that interpret my assessment this way weren't so clueless about the main themes in play here. Our strategies and tactics for dealing with Russia are totally dysfunctional and we better fix it quick. If anybody wants to believe all is well and good and just invoking this good vs. evil ideology and cheering on over-matched Ukrainian forces from 8,000 miles away is going to bring out the tooth fairy to sprinkle magic dust on the American position and make it all work then fine. They way it stands now its like Dick Jauron vs. Bill Belichick. Remember how that went most of the time? 1 1
Tiberius Posted February 25, 2022 Author Posted February 25, 2022 3 minutes ago, HamSandwhich said: I sincerely hope Biden proves us wrong and becomes a leader. He can start by making us energy independent. Ramp up the production, make sure our gas prices here go down, and then sell excess to European countries to ease their pain and make them more willing to fight against Russia. This groveling to other countries for energy is pathetic and can be easily solved. He won't green new deal doesn't allow that, now we're being taken advantage of as many opponents to the green energy push have predicted. Biden is trying to end around the concern by getting in front of it and stating there will be pain, it won't matter when American's are feeling the pinch at the gas pumps and the cost of goods go up. Take the necessary steps as outlined above and that will SEVERELY weaken Russia's power and potentially increase his chances of reelection, not to mention help his cronies in the house and senate. I do not want him to be reelected and or his cronies but I put America and it's needs ahead of political needs and have never been one that said I hope the President fails, I always hope he succeeds. Do it Biden, unleash the energy potential of America, cut the red tape and watch Putin and China kick and scream. Russia can enforce their will, there's no doubt. Russia’s already having more trouble than they dreamed of. This will fail! Putin will fail 1
Doc Posted February 25, 2022 Posted February 25, 2022 20 minutes ago, BillsFanNC said: 80 million votes! 80 million suckers. And yeah, it looks like Putin wants a pro-Russian government in there.
HamSandwhich Posted February 25, 2022 Posted February 25, 2022 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Tiberius said: Russia’s already having more trouble than they dreamed of. This will fail! Putin will fail Doesn't look like it to me. They are moving pretty swiftly. Speaking of SWIFT .... Edited February 25, 2022 by HamSandwhich 1
wnyguy Posted February 25, 2022 Posted February 25, 2022 1 minute ago, HamSandwhich said: Doesn't look like it to me. They are moving pretty swiftly. Reports I'm seeing is of a very strong and very defiant resistance by the Ukrainian forces. How long they can keep it up is the question.
aristocrat Posted February 25, 2022 Posted February 25, 2022 5 minutes ago, wnyguy said: Reports I'm seeing is of a very strong and very defiant resistance by the Ukrainian forces. How long they can keep it up is the question. The issue Russia will have is occupation. If the people fight for their homes russia will never hold the occupation.
HamSandwhich Posted February 25, 2022 Posted February 25, 2022 7 minutes ago, wnyguy said: Reports I'm seeing is of a very strong and very defiant resistance by the Ukrainian forces. How long they can keep it up is the question. Conventionally, Russia is routing them, not sure how you don't see that. Took 2 days to encircle the capital with minimal casualties sadly. It will become a quagmire and bogged down but Russia does not have the scruples the US does. They will exterminate and won't think twice about it. I would not be surprised if they round people are an execute if they don't bend the knee. It's a very sad state of affairs but that's what communist governments do. Pray that it does not go any further than it already has! 7 minutes ago, aristocrat said: The issue Russia will have is occupation. If the people fight for their homes russia will never hold the occupation. Not surprising
Tiberius Posted February 25, 2022 Author Posted February 25, 2022 19 minutes ago, HamSandwhich said: Doesn't look like it to me. They are moving pretty swiftly. Speaking of SWIFT .... Really, you seen any prisoners captured by Russia? Ive seen Russians captured by Ukraine
aristocrat Posted February 25, 2022 Posted February 25, 2022 5 minutes ago, HamSandwhich said: Conventionally, Russia is routing them, not sure how you don't see that. Took 2 days to encircle the capital with minimal casualties sadly. It will become a quagmire and bogged down but Russia does not have the scruples the US does. They will exterminate and won't think twice about it. I would not be surprised if they round people are an execute if they don't bend the knee. It's a very sad state of affairs but that's what communist governments do. Pray that it does not go any further than it already has! Not surprising Russia can't just execute civilians left and right. It's one to shoot into some neighborhoods and have some civilians die but if they round them up Russia will not hold that country and I would imagine the world would shut russia off financially for good. No money in no money out and seize all the assets of the oligarchs and putin outside russia. Start seizing all the soccer clubs, yachts homes etc they own and this thing is over by next week.
HamSandwhich Posted February 25, 2022 Posted February 25, 2022 2 minutes ago, Tiberius said: Really, you seen any prisoners captured by Russia? Ive seen Russians captured by Ukraine Is that the measure for success?
Tiberius Posted February 25, 2022 Author Posted February 25, 2022 13 minutes ago, aristocrat said: The issue Russia will have is occupation. If the people fight for their homes russia will never hold the occupation. Biden’s not afraid to show Putin we are reading their communications, watching their every move and suppling Putin’s enemies with weapons to kill his soldiers. 👍
SCBills Posted February 25, 2022 Posted February 25, 2022 13 minutes ago, aristocrat said: The issue Russia will have is occupation. If the people fight for their homes russia will never hold the occupation. Biden is such a disaster. Absolutely absurd. Can this dude do anything that doesn’t turn into a dumpster fire? I didn’t have high hopes for him, thought maybe we’d have 4 years of normalcy and just kind of recalibrate, but holy ****
HamSandwhich Posted February 25, 2022 Posted February 25, 2022 Just now, aristocrat said: Russia can't just execute civilians left and right. It's one to shoot into some neighborhoods and have some civilians die but if they round them up Russia will not hold that country and I would imagine the world would shut russia off financially for good. No money in no money out and seize all the assets of the oligarchs and putin outside russia. Start seizing all the soccer clubs, yachts homes etc they own and this thing is over by next week. Nothing is off the table for this regime. Putin has proven himself to be irrational, nothing can be assumed anymore.
Tiberius Posted February 25, 2022 Author Posted February 25, 2022 1 minute ago, HamSandwhich said: Is that the measure for success? Just one
HamSandwhich Posted February 25, 2022 Posted February 25, 2022 1 minute ago, Tiberius said: Biden’s not afraid to show Putin we are reading their communications, watching their every move and suppling Putin’s enemies with weapons to kill his soldiers. 👍 The spin
Tiberius Posted February 25, 2022 Author Posted February 25, 2022 2 minutes ago, aristocrat said: Russia can't just execute civilians left and right. It's one to shoot into some neighborhoods and have some civilians die but if they round them up Russia will not hold that country and I would imagine the world would shut russia off financially for good. No money in no money out and seize all the assets of the oligarchs and putin outside russia. Start seizing all the soccer clubs, yachts homes etc they own and this thing is over by next week. Especially with the American media watching!
SCBills Posted February 25, 2022 Posted February 25, 2022 (edited) 1 minute ago, HamSandwhich said: Nothing is off the table for this regime. Putin has proven himself to be irrational, nothing can be assumed anymore. Ukraine is arming citizens and encouraging them to build firebombs.. Russian military/Chechen warriors will attack them. Not much of a stretch to assume this is going to devolve into a level of barbarism that the Western world is not ready to see in a modern city/country. Edited February 25, 2022 by SCBills
HamSandwhich Posted February 25, 2022 Posted February 25, 2022 Just now, Tiberius said: Just one I'll be all the other measures are going well for Russia, unfortunately. I don't want Russia to do well but the media spin is laughable.
Tiberius Posted February 25, 2022 Author Posted February 25, 2022 Just now, HamSandwhich said: The spin Just now, HamSandwhich said: The spin No, he’s doing it. All those things. Spin, lol. Facts are sticky things
HamSandwhich Posted February 25, 2022 Posted February 25, 2022 Just now, SCBills said: Ukraine is arming citizens and encouraging them to build firebombs.. Not much of a stretch to assume this is going to devolve into a level of barbarism that the Western world is not ready to see in a modern city/country. Exactly. Just now, Tiberius said: No, he’s doing it. All those things. Spin, lol. Facts are sticky things He gave it to China and expected it to get to Russia. No way.
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