Democracy’s Fiery Ordeal: The War in Ukraine 🇺🇦

[SoCal Deek]

2 minutes ago, Demongyz said:

I agree with you however I have seen Afghanistan happen, and in time, Ukraine could come back out on top, but that is a long shot for sure.

The west have to speed up the clock and slow it down at the same time and that's not something that can be done.  I think the bed has been made at this point and there isn't much hope.

Don't worry....Joe's got this. I'm sure it's transitory. 

[muppy]

On 2/22/2022 at 12:11 PM, B-Man said:

 

"Because you have crossed this red line, we are going to increase the economic pain on you just a little bit more."

 

Does something like that really make a guy like Putin think twice?

 

 

 

 

 

 

I think vladimir putin is a bully who will  not be reasoned with no matter who does the talking. The only think a guy/BULLY like he understands is a beatdown smack in the mouth. Not that I approve of any scenario that might bring about a World war 3. This whole situation sucks.

 

and since Im here what the heck is donald trump doing trolling the  media for? GEEZ NOT HELPFUL imho just WHO is the enemy here donald? @-@ unbelievable.

 

SMH

Edited February 24, 2022 by muppy

[Demongyz]

1 minute ago, muppy said:

I think vladimir putin is a bully who will  not be reasoned with no matter who does the talking. The only think a guy/BULLY like he understands is a beatdown smack in the mouth. Not that I approve of any scenario that might bring about a World war 3. This whole situation sucks.

 

and since Im here what the heck is donald trump doing trolling the  media for? GEEZ NOT HELPFUL imho just WHO is the enemy here donald? @-@ unbelievable.

 

SMH

6 years of being lied about will do things to a person.  I agree, Trump needs to shut up, but I thought that before he became president.

[SoCal Deek]

1 minute ago, muppy said:

I think vladimir putin is a bully who will  not be reasoned with no matter who does the talking. The only think a guy/BULLY like he understands is a beatdown smack in the mouth. Not that I approve of any scenario that might bring about a World war 3. This whole situation sucks.

 

and since Im here what the heck is donald trump doing trolling the  media for? GEEZ NOT HELPFUL imho just WHO is the enemy here donald? @-@ unbelievable.

 

SMH

Do not blame Trump for this mess. Don't even go there. Get to work Joe! 

[muppy]

20 hours ago, Big Blitz said:

 

 

All I know is nothing but peace and prosperity under Trump.  

 

Then the flu.  

 

And the nazis took over.

 

Now I pay $3.50 for gas.  

 

The rent is to dam high.  

 

And Putin is about to take Ukraine.  

 

$3.50 consider yourself lucky. Here in socal record high  nearly $5.00 a gallon.

[SoCal Deek]

1 minute ago, muppy said:

$3.50 consider yourself lucky. Here in socal record high  nearly $5.00 a gallon.

To quote the Savior....."Elections have consequences."

[John Adams]

17 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

To quote the Savior....."Elections have consequences."

 

Blaming Americans for this? 

 

Nice work Deek. 

1 hour ago, All_Pro_Bills said:

I'm just citing facts here without judgment.  And it's verified by the very recorded words of the then under-secretary of State telling European officials, to paraphrase, "this is how its going down in Ukraine and if you don't like it then F you".  Its not my opinion so why attack me?  Why don't you redirect your anger at the people setting and executing these policies and creating negative consequences for a lot of people instead of attacking powerless citizen (me) just pointing them out?  

 

 

     

 

Blaming Americans for Russia starting this war is ridiculous. 

 

Don't hide behind your BS citing facts without judgment. You are looking at this and blaming America for this. 

 

Reassess what it means to be an American. 

[H2o]

John Kerry: "All of these wars are going to make people lose focus on the real problem, climate change. There will be too many emissions from these tanks, helicopters, missiles, and airplanes. Putin needs to think about that first." 

 

Putin:

[SoCal Deek]

7 minutes ago, John Adams said:

 

Blaming Americans for this? 

 

Nice work Deek. 

 

 

I'm not blaming American(s).  I'm making a simple observation. 

[John Adams]

2 hours ago, John Adams said:

Germany won’t do it. 
 

Maybe not building nuclear power plants was a bad idea?

 

Updating: Italy also won't do it. 

 

The problem with all sanctions is that they take time to bite. Biden is right that it takes time to see them working regrettably. 

 

Russia is "OK" for now. 

1 minute ago, SoCal Deek said:

I'm not blaming American(s).  I'm making a simple observation. 

 

Coward. Own what you said and maybe attack the real bad guy. 

 

Russia started a war today. Your reaction is to attack America. 

 

Sad. 

Edited February 24, 2022 by John Adams

[SoCal Deek]

1 minute ago, John Adams said:

 

Coward. Own what you said and maybe attack the real bad guy. 

 

Russia started a war today. Your reaction is to attack America. 

 

Sad. 

I responded to a comment about the price of gas in California.  How does that have ANYTHING to do with Russia.  

Back off Mr Adams.

[All_Pro_Bills]

20 minutes ago, muppy said:

I think vladimir putin is a bully who will  not be reasoned with no matter who does the talking. The only think a guy/BULLY like he understands is a beatdown smack in the mouth. Not that I approve of any scenario that might bring about a World war 3. This whole situation sucks.

 

and since Im here what the heck is donald trump doing trolling the  media for? GEEZ NOT HELPFUL imho just WHO is the enemy here donald? @-@ unbelievable.

 

SMH

I also wish Trump would keep quiet but among other things he's a narcissistic megalomaniac that loves to toot his own horn.  On the other hand can you blame people that officials, activists, social justice experts, and their party running our government and almost all of our societies economic, social, and political organizations and institutions have pissed all over for 5 years, for being critical of the administration's strategy here.  But just like that, without an apology of any kind or any remorse, the said pissers are suggesting all the people they've targeted as fascist dictatorship-loving scum and other less than flattering terms, should fall into line to support "America" which translated means support Joe Biden.  That might be asking a lot.  Maybe the far-left starting that conversation with an "I'm sorry" would be a good place to start?

 

 

 

   

 

 

[John Adams]

11 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

I responded to a comment about the price of gas in California.  How does that have ANYTHING to do with Russia.  

Back off Mr Adams.

 

The price of gas is because Biden is president...not because Putin has been banging the drums of war and now started one. 

 

Got it. 

 

Good thread to bring that up in if it's just a random observation. 

6 minutes ago, All_Pro_Bills said:

I also wish Trump would keep quiet but among other things he's a narcissistic megalomaniac that loves to toot his own horn.  On the other hand can you blame people that officials, activists, social justice experts, and their party running our government and almost all of our societies economic, social, and political organizations and institutions have pissed all over for 5 years, for being critical of the administration's strategy here.  But just like that, without an apology of any kind or any remorse, the said pissers are suggesting all the people they've targeted as fascist dictatorship-loving scum and other less than flattering terms, should fall into line to support "America" which translated means support Joe Biden.  That might be asking a lot.  Maybe the far-left starting that conversation with an "I'm sorry" would be a good place to start?

 

 

 

   

 

 

 

You don't have to support Biden. Vote him out in 2 years. I certainly hope he loses to pretty much anyone but Trump.

 

But blaming America for this war is absurd. 

[Chef Jim]

18 minutes ago, John Adams said:

 

 

But blaming America for this war is absurd. 

I’m not sure anyone is blaming the US for starting this war but we failed to prevent it. 
 

 

[SoCal Deek]

24 minutes ago, John Adams said:

 

The price of gas is because Biden is president...not because Putin has been banging the drums of war and now started one. 

 

Got it. 

 

 

Dude! I didn’t bring it up! 
Got it??? 

[John Adams]

7 minutes ago, Chef Jim said:

I’m not sure anyone is blaming the US for starting this war but we failed to prevent it. 
 

 

So the war is America’s fault for not preventing it. That’s where your mind is on invasion day. 
 

Putin does enjoy this board, I have no doubt. 

[SoCal Deek]

1 minute ago, John Adams said:

So the war is America’s fault for not preventing it. That’s where your mind is on invasion day. 
 

Putin does enjoy this board, I have no doubt. 

Billsy word…triggered…seems to fit on here today. Nobody is blaming America for Putin attacking Ukraine.

[All_Pro_Bills]

 

 

 

5 minutes ago, John Adams said:

You don't have to support Biden. Vote him out in 2 years. I certainly hope he loses to pretty much anyone but Trump.

 

But blaming America for this war is absurd. 

Honestly, I don't think Biden will have the mental capacity to serve his term through 2024.  But please stop suggesting I'm blaming our country.  I've recapped the nefarious actions of a specific official, supported by evidence.  So I'm blaming one American.  I don't see how you can equate citing the actions of one official to blaming a country.  But if you want to make the argument "America right or wrong" from the Vietnam era then fine.  

 

Like I said, I'm simply stating the actions of un-elected government official running a clandestine unofficial off-the-books operation to destabilize and overthrow an elected government in a foreign country.  How much more un-American can it get than that?  And if you think overthrowing a corrupt government that was sympathetic to Russian interests and replacing it with a corrupt one that was sympathetic to "American" interests had absolutely no bearing on the events that were set in motion event you're either knowingly ignoring reality or oblivious to it.  Why right after that coup Russia invaded and annexed Crimea.  Was that a mere coincidence?  

 

What you're misinterpreting as anti-American is just an attempt to instill into the conversation some awareness and understanding of what might motivate the enemy.  Just thinking we're good and they're evil doesn't provide much guidance and understanding of events or help shape strategy.  Know your friends but know you're enemy better.

 

The other thing I'll say is this.  I don't know about you but in my experience with confrontations in each and every case there was no totally innocent or totally guilty party involved.  Either side could have avoided or de-escalated the confrontation if they desired.  Think about that here.  This is all I've got to say on the blame America tag.

[Motorin']

1 hour ago, B-Man said:

 

 

 

There are any number of reasons that this may be happening.

 

It could just be a head fake designed to bring diplomatic pressure to bear on Kyiv and remove some pressure from Moscow.

 

It could indicate that the oligarchs are nervous about potential sanctions and want this adventure wound down.

 

It is also possible that the Russians have simply overextended themselves and are facing a protracted conflict if Ukraine holds fast.

 

What has struck me about this entire operation is the level of operational sophistication that the Russians are trying to showcase. The Russians are attacking over three widely separated axes of advance. Nothing we’ve seen of the Russian Army in the past thirty years would indicate that the Russian Army can sustain the logistics necessary for this ambitious plan.

 

https://redstate.com/streiff/2022/02/24/report-russia-offers-terms-of-surrender-to-ukraine-n527216

 

 

 

 

Putin is walking a tightrope between proving he's a tough guy to his oligarch friends, and getting all of their billions they've siphoned from the Russian people confiscated here in the west where they've stashed it. 

Edited February 24, 2022 by Motorin'

[Irv]

Here’s to Billstime and Tiberius on behalf of the Ukrainian people. ***** YOU!  What a mess.