Democracy’s Fiery Ordeal: The War in Ukraine 🇺🇦

[JDHillFan]

2 minutes ago, JimmyNoodles said:

People telling other to grow up, lol.  Here's the question.  I'll amend it since apparently sending troops seems to be the dividng line.  Do you suport Ukraine, short of providing troops?  Do you support monetary and weapoins backing?  

If one has supported Ukraine up to this point (a lot of good it does for the people of Ukraine when Average Joe American declares his/her/their support), are they required to support it in perpetuity? Can the longtime supporter step back, recognize Ukraine cannot win, and now prefer a negotiated peace? Is that ok?

[JimmyNoodles]

2 minutes ago, dgrochester55 said:

 

I support the Ukraine over Russia because Putin was the aggressor.  I support working towards ending the war and keeping the Ukraine a sovereign nation which is what yesterday was working towards. I think that all three acted poorly which I have mentioned in other posts and that they should find a way to get back to talks.

again.

 

Zelensky has valid concerns about Russia holding up their end of the bargain and I think that Trump is underestimating Putin's track record of doing this. Other than that I agree with the general direction of the plan.  Three years ago, some people thought that Russia could take over the Ukraine within a month and Europe within a year. Three years later, they are at a stalemate with an extremely depleted army, that is not a victory from their end.

Then you and I agree except for the deal, which was a nondeal.  But that's my opinion.  Russia is in serious trouble or these "talks" wouldn't even be happening.  Keeping Ukraine sovereign means monetray and weapons support.    

[LDD]

6 minutes ago, JDHillFan said:

If one has supported Ukraine up to this point (a lot of good it does for the people of Ukraine when Average Joe American declares his/her/their support), are they required to support it in perpetuity? Can the longtime supporter step back, recognize Ukraine cannot win, and now prefer a negotiated peace? Is that ok?

 

Sure, f-in sure...a negotiated peace with some actual "N-E-G-O-T-I-A-T-I-O-N"...sure...good idea.  I think that's possibly why the president of a small country brutally attacked by on the the top world powers was there...

[JimmyNoodles]

10 minutes ago, Joe Ferguson forever said:

It seems one can’t support Ukraine without supporting the deaths onf hundreds of Ukrainian soldiers a day. I don’t think that’s true. For instance, a truce with 3 rd party security guarantees is an option. 

Yes, but the US won't provide any guarantees and Putin is as reliable as president Bone Spurs.  

[JDHillFan]

6 minutes ago, LDD said:

 

Sure, f-in sure...a negotiated peace with some actual "N-E-G-O-T-I-A-T-I-O-N"...sure...good idea.  I think that's possibly why the president of a small country brutally attacked by on the the top world powers was there...

You seem upset. So much so that your post is incomprehensible. Oh well. 

[JimmyNoodles]

17 minutes ago, JDHillFan said:

If one has supported Ukraine up to this point (a lot of good it does for the people of Ukraine when Average Joe American declares his/her/their support), are they required to support it in perpetuity? Can the longtime supporter step back, recognize Ukraine cannot win, and now prefer a negotiated peace? Is that ok?

A negotiated peace is absolutely ok.  I think Ukraine is asking for the land that is occupied to be returned.  That seems reasonable.  They want Russia to pay for the damage they caused.  There should be reparations since they were the aggressor.  That seems reasonable.  What does Russia want for peace?   

[LDD]

7 minutes ago, JDHillFan said:

You seem upset. So much so that your post is incomprehensible. Oh well. 

 

Correct, I'm upset.  

[JDHillFan]

1 minute ago, JimmyNoodles said:

A negotiated peace is absolutely ok.  I think Ukraine is asking for the land that is occupied to be returned.  That seems reasonable.  They want Russia to pay for the damage they caused.  There should be reparations since they were the aggressor.  That seems reasonable.  What does Russia want for peace?   

I don’t know if anyone has the answer to your last question as of yet. 
 

In the absence of a negotiated peace, is your position that the US should supply weapons and money in perpetuity? 

[Big Blitz]

47 minutes ago, Roundybout said:

Why would we form a coalition with neo-fascists? 

 

20 percent of the voters voted for them.  
 

DeMoCrAcY

[JDHillFan]

2 minutes ago, LDD said:

 

Correct, I'm upset.  

Upset enough to do something other than rage on a message board?

[SCBills]

Zelenskyy just secured a 2.7 billion dollar loan from the UK, so that will help keep this going another 5-10 days. 
 

As for the question above of what does Russia want?  From what I’ve heard, it’s to keep the Donbas & Crimea, along with a reduction in the Ukrainian military and for the West to stop flirting with Ukraine/NATO membership.

 

At which point Russia would then shift efforts towards installing a pro-Russia leader to replace Zelenskyy in their next election. 

[JimmyNoodles]

6 minutes ago, JDHillFan said:

I don’t know if anyone has the answer to your last question as of yet. 
 

In the absence of a negotiated peace, is your position that the US should supply weapons and money in perpetuity? 

Yes, but I don't think it would it come to that.  I think Russia is in serious trouble economically.  Why wouldn't the USA want to break Putin's back whan given the opportunity?  There's an answer.  Let me think......  

Edited Saturday at 09:54 PM by JimmyNoodles

[LDD]

12 minutes ago, JDHillFan said:

Upset enough to do something other than rage on a message board?

 

Um, that wasn't rage and you could have replaced two letters and not been a prick...but, oh well.  Not sure what you're getting at.  You're a Russian.  That's all.  

 

This is becoming a clear time thanks to Donald.  

Edited Saturday at 10:01 PM by LDD

[JimmyNoodles]

4 minutes ago, SCBills said:

Zelenskyy just secured a 2.7 billion dollar loan from the UK, so that will help keep this going another 5-10 days. 
 

As for the question above of what does Russia want?  From what I’ve heard, it’s to keep the Donbas & Crimea, along with a reduction in the Ukrainian military and for the West to stop flirting with Ukraine/NATO membership.

 

At which point Russia would then shift efforts towards installing a pro-Russia leader to replace Zelenskyy in their next election. 

Yes, just give us everything.  That's why they'll be no negotiated peace.  As much as people don't wnat to take sides, sides have to be taken.  

[JDHillFan]

1 minute ago, LDD said:

 

Um, that wasn't rage and you could have replaced two letters and not been a prick...but, oh well.  Not sure what you're getting at.  You're a Russian.  F-y0u.  That's all.  

 

This is becoming a clear time thanks to Donald.  

Sorry about the use of rage. Allow me to re-word - upset enough to do something other than whine on a message board?

[Big Blitz]

4 minutes ago, JimmyNoodles said:

Yes, but I don't think it would it come to that.  I think Russia is in serious trouble economically.  Why wouldn't the USA want to break Putin's back whan given the opportunity?  There's an answer.  Let me think......  

 

 

Yes because destroying the economy of a global nuclear superpower after this 17 year debacle forcing it to get even closer to China is geopolitical brilliance.  
 

 

China and Russia are already laughing their ***es off at the DEI dumpster fire nation we’ve become that can’t get its financial house in order - we try and the fake news and low info libs decide to make DODGE the problem.  

[SCBills]

3 minutes ago, JimmyNoodles said:

Yes, but I don't think it would it come to that.  I think Russia is in serious trouble economically.  Why wouldn't the USA want to break Putin's back whan given the opportunity?  There's an answer.  Let me think......  

 

You seem to operating from a position of how you want this to be, as opposed to how it is.  
 

Russia is slowly making gains and is overwhelming Ukraine with drones that they keep mass producing.  Putin has zero regard for human life and has an almost endless amount of bodies to throw at this war.   Zelenskyy is running out of money and bodies.  
 

The EU can step up and help with his money issue if the US pulls back, but it only prolongs a war they’ll never win unless it becomes WW3.  
 

Eventually Zelenskyy will run out of bodies.  
 

And the longer this goes, the more incremental the Russian gains are, and the more Putin will leverage in peace negotiations. 
 

Thats the reality of this. 
 

Ukraine is currently pulling fathers and sons from their homes by force to speed train them and send them to the front lines weeks later.  

The front lines, where a dystopian hellscape awaits them.  

[ScotSHO]

Ukraine lovers want more gore-porn.  Peace does not get them daily drone footage of human bodies being dismembered.

 

Prove me wrong.

[JimmyNoodles]

1 minute ago, Big Blitz said:

 

 

Yes because destroying the economy of a global nuclear superpower after this 17 year debacle forcing it to get even closer to China is geopolitical brilliance.  
 

 

China and Russia are already laughing their ***es off at the DEI dumpster fire nation we’ve become that can’t get its financial house in order - we try and the fake news and low info libs decide to make DODGE the problem.  

When Doge cuts more than 1/10 of a cent from the budget, let me know.  No one's talking about DEI.  

3 minutes ago, SCBills said:

 

You seem to operating from a position of how you want this to be, as opposed to how it is.  
 

Russia is slowly making gains and is overwhelming Ukraine with drones that they keep mass producing.  Putin has zero regard for human life and has an almost endless amount of bodies to throw at this war.   Zelenskyy is running out of money and bodies.  
 

The EU can step up and help with his money issue if the US pulls back, but it only prolongs a war they’ll never win unless it becomes WW3.  
 

Eventually Zelenskyy will run out of bodies.  
 

And the longer this goes, the more incremental the Russian gains are, and the more Putin will leverage in peace negotiations. 
 

Thats the reality of this. 
 

Ukraine is currently pulling fathers and sons from their homes by force to speed train them and send them to the front lines weeks later.  

The front lines, where a dystopian hellscape awaits them.  

Yes, we do disagree about how things are.  Russia is in the same boat.  That's why this is all the more important.  

[Big Blitz]