Tiberius Posted May 30 Author Posted May 30 2 hours ago, JDHillFan said: Imagine Biden being weaker than a Frenchman. Effing sad. Oh, that hurts...At least Biden is on the right side, you on the other hand are on Putin's side
Biden is Mentally Fit Posted May 30 Posted May 30 3 minutes ago, Tiberius said: Oh, that hurts...At least Biden is on the right side, you on the other hand are on Putin's side In the absence of a set of balls in the White House, I stand with Macron. Together we rue the weakness on display at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue. Join us! 1
All_Pro_Bills Posted May 30 Posted May 30 (edited) 24 minutes ago, JDHillFan said: In the absence of a set of balls in the White House, I stand with Macron. Together we rue the weakness on display at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue. Join us! I think the Europeans should fight and fund their own battles. Its 79 years since WW2 ended. The US military has committed troops and equipment funded almost entirely by the US taxpayer to the tune of trillions of dollars to defend Europe. Let them fund their own defense. I can name a dozen domestic priorities that can use those funds for a better purpose, a purpose to address the needs of Americans. Meanwhile, Congress of both parties obviously doesn't work for the American taxpayer which begs the question who do they work for? Looks like defense contractors, the Pentagon, and the Intelligence community. Time for a new vision. That's why they're crapping their pants over the potential for Trump 2.0. He might derail their gravy train. That's all they care about. Truth is they don't care about Ukraine or Ukrainians or democracy. If they all die its just the business of Empire. We're not doing anything special here. We're just committing capital and resources to producing weapons. The Europeans can do that for themselves. Edited May 30 by All_Pro_Bills
Tiberius Posted May 30 Author Posted May 30 1 hour ago, JDHillFan said: In the absence of a set of balls in the White House, I stand with Macron. Together we rue the weakness on display at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue. Join us! Ok! Let's go Joe! You must really hate Trump's position on this war 1 hour ago, All_Pro_Bills said: I think the Europeans should fight and fund their own battles. Its 79 years since WW2 ended. The US military has committed troops and equipment funded almost entirely by the US taxpayer to the tune of trillions of dollars to defend Europe. Let them fund their own defense. I can name a dozen domestic priorities that can use those funds for a better purpose, a purpose to address the needs of Americans. Meanwhile, Congress of both parties obviously doesn't work for the American taxpayer which begs the question who do they work for? Looks like defense contractors, the Pentagon, and the Intelligence community. Time for a new vision. That's why they're crapping their pants over the potential for Trump 2.0. He might derail their gravy train. That's all they care about. Truth is they don't care about Ukraine or Ukrainians or democracy. If they all die its just the business of Empire. We're not doing anything special here. We're just committing capital and resources to producing weapons. The Europeans can do that for themselves. Putin agrees, He totally wants us to stab our friends in the back Great policy, if you hate freedom
All_Pro_Bills Posted May 30 Posted May 30 29 minutes ago, Tiberius said: Ok! Let's go Joe! You must really hate Trump's position on this war Putin agrees, He totally wants us to stab our friends in the back Great policy, if you hate freedom I'm concerned with what's best for Americans. Our freedoms, our country. I'm not concerned with babysitting every arrangement and dispute between every other country on the planet. They're fully capable of making decisions and holding discussions and handling their affairs without our help or interference. I'm not going to support the approach we base every strategic and tactical decision and policy on what is good or not good for Putin. Its what's good for us that matters. Basing your policies on what's good or not good for a foe and ignoring your own needs is for lack of a better word, STUPID.
BillStime Posted May 30 Posted May 30 3 minutes ago, All_Pro_Bills said: I'm not concerned with babysitting every arrangement and dispute between every other country on the planet. Should the US support Israel?
Tiberius Posted May 30 Author Posted May 30 3 minutes ago, All_Pro_Bills said: I'm concerned with what's best for Americans. Our freedoms, our country. I'm not concerned with babysitting every arrangement and dispute between every other country on the planet. They're fully capable of making decisions and holding discussions and handling their affairs without our help or interference. I'm not going to support the approach we base every strategic and tactical decision and policy on what is good or not good for Putin. Its what's good for us that matters. Basing your policies on what's good or not good for a foe and ignoring your own needs is for lack of a better word, STUPID. So throwing away allies to Russian aggression is what's best for us? No, that's what is best for Putin. United we stand, and you understand, divided we fall. That's your position
All_Pro_Bills Posted May 30 Posted May 30 (edited) 1 hour ago, Tiberius said: So throwing away allies to Russian aggression is what's best for us? No, that's what is best for Putin. United we stand, and you understand, divided we fall. That's your position You're not seeing it right. You lack the ability to see the situation objectively. My minding your own business approach is better because our meddling and interference in Ukraine's internal affairs through the efforts of Nuland created the conditions for the conflict. Once she resumed her duties at State in 2021 to pick up where they left off when Obama left office it was clearly telegraphed, at least to me, that a conflict was coming. You can disagree, and I'm sure you will, but that's only because you refuse to accept the first punch was thrown before the Russians made their move. The conditions for war started when the Maidan coup removed the President. I guess doing it differently and allowing 500K people that are now dead to live their lives doesn't appeal to you. Edited May 30 by All_Pro_Bills 1
Tiberius Posted May 30 Author Posted May 30 2 minutes ago, All_Pro_Bills said: You're not seeing it right. You lack the ability to see the situation objectively. My minding your own business approach is better because our meddling and interference in Ukraine's internal affairs through the efforts of Nuland created the conditions for the conflict. Once she resumed her duties at State in 2021 to pick up where they left off when Obama left office it was clearly telegraphed, at least to me, that a conflict was coming. You can disagree, and I'm sure you will, but that's only because you refuse to accept the first punch was thrown before the Russians made their move. The conditions for war started when the Maidan coup removed the President. I guess doing it differently and allowing 500K people that are now dead to live their lives doesn't appeal to you. Like Putin, you want us to ditch our allies. What else is there to get?
All_Pro_Bills Posted May 30 Posted May 30 Just now, Tiberius said: Like Putin, you want us to ditch our allies. What else is there to get? Ukraine isn't and never was our ally. Its a paid bribe to the country's leaders for an arrangement of convenience and a pawn to be sacrificed in an effort against Russia with a goal of inhibiting any economic and political integration of Western Europe and Russia. A failed effort. Its severely damaged the economies of western Europe and overall done more to weaken our side than the enemy. Its facilitated an arrangement of necessity between China and Russia. 2 against 1. You tell me where in the world our influence is greater now than when Biden took office? Africa, Asia,the Middle East, South America? None of those places. You better wake up from your obsession with Putin and take a look around. We're screwed and this crew of Democrats and Republicans in Washington have no clue. 3
Tiberius Posted May 30 Author Posted May 30 3 minutes ago, All_Pro_Bills said: Ukraine isn't and never was our ally. Its a paid bribe to the country's leaders for an arrangement of convenience and a pawn to be sacrificed in an effort against Russia with a goal of inhibiting any economic and political integration of Western Europe and Russia. A failed effort. Its severely damaged the economies of western Europe and overall done more to weaken our side than the enemy. Its facilitated an arrangement of necessity between China and Russia. 2 against 1. You tell me where in the world our influence is greater now than when Biden took office? Africa, Asia,the Middle East, South America? None of those places. You better wake up from your obsession with Putin and take a look around. We're screwed and this crew of Democrats and Republicans in Washington have no clue. No, the free nations are by definition, our friends. I get you want republics crushed to make it easier for Putin. But appeasement failed in the 1930's and the lesson was learned. 1
All_Pro_Bills Posted May 30 Posted May 30 10 minutes ago, Tiberius said: No, the free nations are by definition, our friends. I get you want republics crushed to make it easier for Putin. But appeasement failed in the 1930's and the lesson was learned. If you want to define "appeasement" as negotiation and compromise vs. getting your way with everything while demanding everyone follow your rules or else then go ahead. And this isn't the depression era 1930's. Its the 2020's and there are far more differences between that time and today than there are similarities. So its a false comparison that leads to incorrect choices. 3
Tiberius Posted May 30 Author Posted May 30 1 hour ago, All_Pro_Bills said: If you want to define "appeasement" as negotiation and compromise vs. getting your way with everything while demanding everyone follow your rules or else then go ahead. And this isn't the depression era 1930's. Its the 2020's and there are far more differences between that time and today than there are similarities. So its a false comparison that leads to incorrect choices. Letting Russia keep Uk's territory? What's to negotiate with an aggressor? How much land they can take? Russia is attacking, that's the only issue. Your pro-Kremlin position is how much Russia can steal No thank you 1
SCBills Posted June 2 Posted June 2 Wave those Ukrainian flags from the comfort of your living rooms as you send innocent men to the wood chipper so you can feel better about yourself... 1 1
Tenhigh Posted June 3 Posted June 3 On 5/30/2024 at 2:58 PM, Tiberius said: Letting Russia keep Uk's territory? What's to negotiate with an aggressor? How much land they can take? Russia is attacking, that's the only issue. Your pro-Kremlin position is how much Russia can steal No thank you Am I really the first person to fact check you in this megathread? What has made you so violently change your tune here, Tibsy? Why all the blood lust 10 years later? Or is it that you feel guilty about your earlier position? 1 1
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