All_Pro_Bills Posted March 9, 2023 Posted March 9, 2023 16 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: Honest Question: What is it that makes him a “terrorist” in your eyes? I’m not saying I disagree with you Tibs, but we need to share a common language if we’re all going to have a conversation. I think it boils down to one thing, perspective.
SoCal Deek Posted March 9, 2023 Posted March 9, 2023 Just now, Tiberius said: Terrorising people with missiles Thanks Tibs. Missiles are fired in all modern conflicts…as you obviously know. Is it the pictures of shelled apartment buildings that makes the distinction for you? (Again, I’m not disagreeing. Just trying to see if you’ll clarify your position.)
Tiberius Posted March 9, 2023 Author Posted March 9, 2023 1 minute ago, SoCal Deek said: Thanks Tibs. Missiles are fired in all modern conflicts…as you obviously know. Is it the pictures of shelled apartment buildings that makes the distinction for you? (Again, I’m not disagreeing. Just trying to see if you’ll clarify your position.) No, it's just terrorism, period
Niagara Bill Posted March 9, 2023 Posted March 9, 2023 2 minutes ago, Tiberius said: Terrorising people with missiles What is the point. Was Hitler a terrorist. He invaded Georgia 2014? Still kept part of that country and nobody cared.
Joe Ferguson forever Posted March 9, 2023 Posted March 9, 2023 14 hours ago, SoCal Deek said: Is the small incursion over yet? I think I dosed off. i certainly hope you didn't dose off. I enjoy debating with you. If you did, get some Narcan, quickly!😄
Tiberius Posted March 9, 2023 Author Posted March 9, 2023 2 minutes ago, All_Pro_Bills said: I think it boils down to one thing, perspective. And what perspective do you have on Putin being a terrorist, which he obviously is? 1 minute ago, Niagara Bill said: What is the point. Was Hitler a terrorist. He invaded Georgia 2014? Still kept part of that country and nobody cared. The point is they are blaming people for not doing enough to appease Putin, and I'm saying you really can't negotiate with a guy raining terror down on people. You want to negotiate with a terrorist like that? 1
Niagara Bill Posted March 9, 2023 Posted March 9, 2023 Just now, Tiberius said: No, it's just terrorism, period Putin is a war mongering ass, intent on recreating USSR in his own image. His hatred of certain cultures is obvious. He is far more than a terrorist, he is far more than Osama bin,
SoCal Deek Posted March 9, 2023 Posted March 9, 2023 1 minute ago, redtail hawk said: i certainly hope you didn't dose off. I enjoy debating with you. If you did, get some Narcan, quickly!😄 Just kidding, as usual, Hawk. (This place needs a serious dose of levity.) But I do marvel at how the current administration brushed away this entire conflict just a year ago…and we somehow went from overlooking a ‘small incursion’ to ‘as long as it takes’ (their words not mine) in that same span. There simply has to be a better way to run a civilized world. To quote George Costanza: “We’re trying to have a society here!” 2
Niagara Bill Posted March 9, 2023 Posted March 9, 2023 3 minutes ago, Tiberius said: And what perspective do you have on Putin being a terrorist, which he obviously is? The point is they are blaming people for not doing enough to appease Putin, and I'm saying you really can't negotiate with a guy raining terror down on people. You want to negotiate with a terrorist like that? You cannot negotiate until he is ready. He will gladly kill millions of his own people, it is cultural, it is historic, the Russian people do not care until the opera is interrupted. He is not Kruschev? In 1962, he is Stalin 1
SoCal Deek Posted March 9, 2023 Posted March 9, 2023 1 minute ago, Niagara Bill said: You cannot negotiate until he is ready. He will gladly kill millions of his own people, it is cultural, it is historic, the Russian people do not care until the opera is interrupted. He is not Kruschev? In 1962, he is Stalin I’m not going to disagree with here, but didn’t the world know all of that BEFORE he amassed troops and tanks at the Ukrainian border? (rhetorical question) 1
Tiberius Posted March 9, 2023 Author Posted March 9, 2023 8 minutes ago, Niagara Bill said: Putin is a war mongering ass, intent on recreating USSR in his own image. His hatred of certain cultures is obvious. He is far more than a terrorist, he is far more than Osama bin, Super terrorist and menace to world order
SoCal Deek Posted March 9, 2023 Posted March 9, 2023 Just now, Tiberius said: Super terrorist and menace to world order World order? There’s an order? Since when exactly? There’s been a nonstop armed conflict going on somewhere in the world throughout my considerable lifetime. I’d love to see what disorder looks like. 😉 1
Tiberius Posted March 9, 2023 Author Posted March 9, 2023 1 minute ago, SoCal Deek said: World order? There’s an order? Since when exactly? There’s been a nonstop armed conflict going on somewhere in the world throughout my considerable lifetime. I’d love to see what disorder looks like. 😉 Violence of all kinds has been steadily decreasing the world over for centuries. No going backwards
LDD Posted March 9, 2023 Posted March 9, 2023 2 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: World order? There’s an order? Since when exactly? There’s been a nonstop armed conflict going on somewhere in the world throughout my considerable lifetime. I’d love to see what disorder looks like. 😉 Unfortunately I think that is the order and it is established by those that carry the biggest sticks. 1
SoCal Deek Posted March 9, 2023 Posted March 9, 2023 Just now, Tiberius said: Violence of all kinds has been steadily decreasing the world over for centuries. No going backwards That’s a good thing if true, but we’re far, far from there yet.
All_Pro_Bills Posted March 9, 2023 Posted March 9, 2023 Just now, Tiberius said: And what perspective do you have on Putin being a terrorist, which he obviously is? You seem to think our enemies are immoral and merciless savages bent on destruction while we on the other hand are noble and principled civilized people acting to uphold peace and tranquility while the objective truth is the major difference in the two is where you stand. Perspective.
Tiberius Posted March 9, 2023 Author Posted March 9, 2023 1 minute ago, SoCal Deek said: That’s a good thing if true, but we’re far, far from there yet. Way better than just three decades ago and way way better than 100 years ago Just now, All_Pro_Bills said: You seem to think our enemies are immoral and merciless savages bent on destruction while we on the other hand are noble and principled civilized people acting to uphold peace and tranquility while the objective truth is the major difference in the two is where you stand. Perspective. Yes You don't see a difference between Putin and our leaders?
SoCal Deek Posted March 9, 2023 Posted March 9, 2023 1 minute ago, Tiberius said: Way better than just three decades ago and way way better than 100 years ago I’m not so sure I agree. It’s all in just how you measure it I guess. Sure, we haven’t seen a third World War, but instead we have these proxy wars being fought in second and third world countries all over the planet. Seems to me that the people in charge have just decided it’s better to hash things out in countries that no one has ever heard of or had plans to visit on summer vacation. 😉
All_Pro_Bills Posted March 9, 2023 Posted March 9, 2023 5 minutes ago, Tiberius said: You don't see a difference between Putin and our leaders? When it comes to war? No, I see no difference. Lots of people die, mostly for nothing. Just a couple: Do you think Bush a terrorists for killing over 400,000 Iraqi civilians in the course of pursing the war in Iraq? Do you think Obama a terrorist for killing civilians in drone strikes into Pakistan? Do you think Churchill was terrorist for authorizing the firebombing of Dresden? Do you think Truman was a terrorist for dropping the H-Bomb on Hiroshima? Leaders make decisions that can be debated to be either good or bad that lead to terrible consequences.
Tiberius Posted March 9, 2023 Author Posted March 9, 2023 3 minutes ago, All_Pro_Bills said: When it comes to war? No, I see no difference. Lots of people die, mostly for nothing. Just a couple: Do you think Bush a terrorists for killing over 400,000 Iraqi civilians in the course of pursing the war in Iraq? (Could make a good argument, especially with the torture taking place) Do you think Obama a terrorist for killing civilians in drone strikes into Pakistan? (Not deliberatly targeting them, so that's way different than Putin targeting civilians) Do you think Churchill was terrorist for authorizing the firebombing of Dresden? (Ya, terrorism to stop German war production, so probably more excusable) Do you think Truman was a terrorist for dropping the H-Bomb on Hiroshima? (Saved lives in the long run, the war and it's trade disruptions were starving millions, so a bomb that killed thousands was "humane" in its own way. ) Leaders make decisions that can be debated to be either good or bad that lead to terrible consequences. You think Putin's killing for conquest is in the same category? I think that's just plain bull Oh, I answered inside your quote
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