Coffeesforclosers Posted December 18 Posted December 18 In other news, both Russia and Ukraine have rejected "freezing" the conflict on current lines as a condition for any negotiations or peace settlements. 1
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted Sunday at 06:48 PM Posted Sunday at 06:48 PM 7 minutes ago, Tiberius said: Ok! Let's see the plan It’s good that you want to see this war ended, Tibsy. 1
Tiberius Posted Sunday at 06:50 PM Author Posted Sunday at 06:50 PM 2 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: It’s good that you want to see this war ended, Tibsy. I've always said something Trump won't, Putin needs to end the war now
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted Sunday at 07:01 PM Posted Sunday at 07:01 PM 7 minutes ago, Tiberius said: I've always said something Trump won't, Putin needs to end the war now I have you marked down as a fervent supporter of the industrial military complex. 1
starrymessenger Posted Sunday at 09:22 PM Posted Sunday at 09:22 PM 2 hours ago, Tiberius said: I've always said something Trump won't, Putin needs to end the war now Putin is in no hurry to end the war. Holds all the cards. Probably the world's senior statesman. The West has no idea who these people are - didn't in 1812, didn't in 1941, don't now. Maybe they can't make a car that works but they are in the forefront of missile technology. It is the West (basically America/Biden and previous Democrat admins) that has destroyed Ukraine, not Russia. If the West wants to negotiate it had better hurry up. Putin hasn't laid hands on the iconic city of Odessa yet showing admirable restraint. Odessa is pretty much 100% ethnic Russian and Russian speaking and is a stones throw from Kerson Oblast that Russia now controls. If he takes Odessa Ukraine loses its only remaining access to the Black Sea. It becomes like Belarus. Might as well absorb it into Poland at that point. At least there is Gdansk.
Coffeesforclosers Posted yesterday at 03:34 AM Posted yesterday at 03:34 AM 6 hours ago, starrymessenger said: Putin is in no hurry to end the war. Holds all the cards. Probably the world's senior statesman. The West has no idea who these people are - didn't in 1812, didn't in 1941, don't now. Maybe they can't make a car that works but they are in the forefront of missile technology. It is the West (basically America/Biden and previous Democrat admins) that has destroyed Ukraine, not Russia. If the West wants to negotiate it had better hurry up. Putin hasn't laid hands on the iconic city of Odessa yet showing admirable restraint. Odessa is pretty much 100% ethnic Russian and Russian speaking and is a stones throw from Kerson Oblast that Russia now controls. If he takes Odessa Ukraine loses its only remaining access to the Black Sea. It becomes like Belarus. Might as well absorb it into Poland at that point. At least there is Gdansk. Russia's invincible. Apart from when they lost in 1905 to Japan, 1918 to Germany and Austria, 1920 to Poland, 1988 to Afghanistan, and 1991 to, oh yeah, Us. It's because The West doesn't understand Russia that they're on their 4th, or 5th, form of government in 107 years. What a ***** take. 1
starrymessenger Posted yesterday at 04:18 AM Posted yesterday at 04:18 AM 2 minutes ago, Coffeesforclosers said: Russia's invincible. Apart from when they lost in 1905 to Japan, 1918 to Germany and Austria, 1920 to Poland, 1988 to Afghanistan, and 1991 to, oh yeah, Us. It's because The West doesn't understand Russia that they're on their 4th, or 5th, form of government in 107 years. What a ***** take. You forgot the Crimean War. They lost that one too, except that Crimea is now part of Russia. Excuse me. It sometimes takes the Russians a while to get their act in gear. You know, the Finns in '38 the Germans in the 1940's. Oh and the Japanese too in the Manchurian Strategic Offensive Operation. As for 1918, hard to fight an external war while at the same time you are fighting a civil war. I think Poland was a Soviet Republic. Wonder how that happened. And wasn't Marshal Rokossovsky a Pole, sorta like Felix Dzerzhinsky? Oh and by the way nobody since Alexander the Great has conquered Afghanistan (military power alone doesn't guarantee victory y'know). And not like us in Vietnam, Iraq, and, oh yeah, lest I forget, Afghanistan, I suppose, in your opinion. We showed them didn't we. i made no claim that the Russian people have always been well governed. They have not. But the quality is there. They have only managed to write a couple of the most heroic pages in the book of human history. In existential conflicts Russia is the place where invading armies go to die. Dude, it's over for Ukraine. That is a tragedy but it should be laid at the West's doorstep, not Russia's. We were ready for a nuclear war because the Russians put a few missiles in Cuba. Do you even know what the Monroe doctrine is? Russia sort of feels the same way. And do you have a clue what happened in Istanbul in 2022? Looks like that was a better deal for Ukraine than what those lightweights Blinken and Sullivan have been able to secure for it. You are uninformed and I've got better things to do than educate you. Adios.
Tiberius Posted yesterday at 02:16 PM Author Posted yesterday at 02:16 PM 9 hours ago, starrymessenger said: Dude, it's over for Ukraine. That is a tragedy but it should be laid at the West's doorstep, not Russia's. We were ready for a nuclear war because the Russians put a few missiles in Cuba. Do you even know what the Monroe doctrine is? Over? Really, you sound like LBJ right before Tet hit. The Monroe Doctrine was issued by a republic, the United States, to help republics in this hemisphere protect themselves from foreign domination. It is not a policy to crush and annex foreign countries we do not like. That was a silly comparison
starrymessenger Posted yesterday at 02:42 PM Posted yesterday at 02:42 PM 18 minutes ago, Tiberius said: Over? Really, you sound like LBJ right before Tet hit. The Monroe Doctrine was issued by a republic, the United States, to help republics in this hemisphere protect themselves from foreign domination. It is not a policy to crush and annex foreign countries we do not like. That was a silly comparison You are naive. Did the US kick Russia out of Cuba because the Cubans were being oppressed by the Russians? President Kennedy did it for entirely appropriate national security reasons.
Tiberius Posted yesterday at 02:47 PM Author Posted yesterday at 02:47 PM 3 minutes ago, starrymessenger said: You are naive. Did the US kick Russia out of Cuba because the Cubans were being oppressed by the Russians? President Kennedy did it for entirely appropriate national security reasons. And Ukraine removed their nuclear weapons also, so what? You are actually arguing that since the Cuban Missile Crisis happened Putin's invasion of Ukraine is ok? That makes no sense
starrymessenger Posted yesterday at 03:17 PM Posted yesterday at 03:17 PM 14 minutes ago, Tiberius said: And Ukraine removed their nuclear weapons also, so what? You are actually arguing that since the Cuban Missile Crisis happened Putin's invasion of Ukraine is ok? That makes no sense I am saying that the Russian response to events in Ukraine (including the overthrow of a democratically elected pro-Russian government) and generally the eastern expansion of NATO is entirely analogous to the United States taking "legitimate" national security interest in the affairs of countries in the western hemisphere. It may not always be nice (though sometimes it can be) but it's what great powers do. Don't piss in my backyard is the message. Or maybe you, like President Obama, don't think that Russia is a great power, only a regional one. I would invite you (and him) to think again. It remains a world power if you give credence to realism in international affairs. They could incinerate us just as we could incinerate them.
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