Bruce Smiths 200 Career Sacks, will it be beat?

[KeLLy1278]

Man.. Bruce Smith, Darryl Talley, Cornelius Bennett.  Good times.

 

Bruce is on a short list of the greatest defensive players ever.  LT, Butkus, Lott, Reggie, Rod Woodson, Chuck, Jones…

 

It’s interesting that whenever Smith and Bennett talk about who influenced them the most in the pros it was the guy that taught them and also never gave a damn about his own stats.  My favorite Bill on the D side of the ball: 

 

Darryl Talley

Edited November 20, 2021 by KeLLy1278

[QCity]

16 minutes ago, Freddie's Dead said:

 

 

Bruce is the GOAT, he was a better man on the field, and a better man off the field, than Reggie White.

 

I can get behind the "on the field" argument, but off the field...

 

[Freddie's Dead]

42 minutes ago, QCity said:

 

I can get behind the "on the field" argument, but off the field...

 

 

Look up Reggie White Wisconsin Legislature remarks.

[Utah John]

47 minutes ago, Freddie's Dead said:

 

Look up Reggie White Wisconsin Legislature remarks.

I had forgotten about that incident, but when I looked it up I have to agree, the man's a *****.  

 

Note I didn't originally write ***** but the system protected me from myself.  It wasn't a compliment, let's put it that way.

Edited November 20, 2021 by Utah John

[Brennan Huff]

No. Soon you won’t be allowed to sack the quarterback. Don’t even make eye contact with him

[HOUSE]

No, If you sack a QB 200 times in todays NFL it will cost you 20 million in fines

 

Do the math'

 

 

.

Edited November 20, 2021 by HOUSE

[Bruce Smith]

I think it will be beat but no one in the NFL right now is that guy.  

[nucci]

I watched A Football Life last night on Bruce. Half of his sacks would be roughing the passer today.

[HOUSE]

Bruce Smith was not fined for this hit, Today he would be suspended

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YfSkQfRa8ks&t=166s

 

[Dr.Sack]

JJ Watt was on pace but injuries.

TJ Watt is below pace but shows signs of being able to get sacks in bunches.

Bosa Bros? Injuries

Mack or Miller? Injuries 

 

There is no one in today’s NFL like Bruce or Reggie. Imagine if they were on the same team?

[TAinLack.]

7 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

Records are made to be broken ... 

 

But no 

 

200 sacks 

 

56 game hit streak 

 

2857 points 

 

Some records will stand the test of time ... Truly remarkable lines

 

 

OJ Simpson - 2000 yds. rushing in 14 games.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

8 hours ago, ßookie_tech said:

Is Bruce the GOAT or Reggie? 

 

IIRC there was one game where the QB “laid down” to give Reggie a sack to put him over Bruce for a season? 

[BuffaloBill]

8 hours ago, ßookie_tech said:

Is Bruce the GOAT or Reggie? 

 

 

Bruce - a non-winnable argument but Bruce set his record from a 3-4.

[shane nelson]

Probably will never be broken, because the game is so diffrent now.  Many of this hard hits (aka Boomer Esiason) would now be flagged in today's NFL.   

[thenorthremembers]

8 minutes ago, SlimShady'sSpaceForce said:

 

IIRC there was one game where the QB “laid down” to give Reggie a sack to put him over Bruce for a season? 

Thought that was Favre for Strahan?

[hondo in seattle]

I think Bruce's record is as good as gone for a number of reasons.

 

*  Teams pass more than in the past.  And I think teams will pass more in the future than they pass now.  That gives defensive players more opportunities to get sacks.

 

*  Because passing is considered more exciting than running, I think the NFL will make more rules to open up the passing game - reinforcing my prior  point.  

 

*  Players are smarter about health and longevity than they were in Bruce's day.  They're finding ways to play at a high level longer.  

 

*  Reggie White career sack total is only two less than Bruce's.  If Reggie can get 198 sacks back in the run-first days, someone else get get 200+ now.

 

*  Seasons are longer now.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 20, 2021 by hondo in seattle

[hondo in seattle]

9 minutes ago, BuffaloBill said:

 

 

Bruce - a non-winnable argument but Bruce set his record from a 3-4.

 

I've made the same argument myself but...

 

Did Bruce line up any closer to the ball than Reggie?

 

Was Bruce double-teamed any more than Reggie?

 

How often did the Bills blitz back then - rushing four or more?

 

I don't know the answers.  I'm just asking. 

 

Generally speaking, of course, it is harder for a 3-4 DE to get sacks than a 4-3 DE because their roles are somewhat different.  But in Bruce's specific case, he clearly didn't struggle getting to the QB at an exceptional rate.   The way Walt Corey used Bruce might have helped negate the 3-4 disadvantage.   

 

 

1 hour ago, HOUSE said:

Bruce Smith was not fined for this hit, Today he would be suspended

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YfSkQfRa8ks&t=166s

 

 

True enough.  

 

But if Bruce played today, he would still kill Boomer but avoid the helmet to helmet contact.  

[without a drought]

10 hours ago, ßookie_tech said:

Is Bruce the GOAT or Reggie? 

They were both great in there own right.

 

It's kind of like ranking guitarists, you can make a list but that's it, you can't really rank it in order. If you do, It usually comes down to personal taste and familiarity than who is really better.

[Mikie2times]

47 minutes ago, hondo in seattle said:

I think Bruce's record is as good as gone for a number of reasons.

 

*  Teams pass more than in the past.  And I think teams will pass more in the future than they pass now.  That gives defensive players more opportunities to get sacks.

 

*  Because passing is considered more exciting than running, I think the NFL will make more rules to open up the passing game - reinforcing my prior  point.  

 

*  Players are smarter about health and longevity than they were in Bruce's day.  They're finding ways to play at a high level longer.  

 

*  Reggie White career sack total is only two less than Bruce's.  If Reggie can get 198 sacks back in the run-first days, someone else get get 200+ now.

 

 

 

 

 

I considered this heavily prior to posting, but still don't think it happens which gives it even more respect. In theory it should be broken. It would be akin to passing stats and those will topple easily.  That said it seems to be very hard to stay healthy in today's NFL as a DL for the time required to hit this milestone. Somebody already mentioned OJ's 2,000 in 14 games, which is just dumb. That said, Jim Brown did have a competitive year against that in 1963 with almost half a yard more per carry, he just fell short of the 2,000 by a little. I think the rushing records will the very difficult to break for many of the reasons you discuss.   

 

41 minutes ago, hondo in seattle said:

 

I've made the same argument myself but...

 

Did Bruce line up any closer to the ball than Reggie?

 

Was Bruce double-teamed any more than Reggie?

 

How often did the Bills blitz back then - rushing four or more?

 

I don't know the answers.  I'm just asking. 

 

Generally speaking, of course, it is harder for a 3-4 DE to get sacks than a 4-3 DE because their roles are somewhat different.  But in Bruce's specific case, he clearly didn't struggle getting to the QB at an exceptional rate.   The way Walt Corey used Bruce might have helped negate the 3-4 disadvantage.   

 

 

 

True enough.  

 

But if Bruce played today, he would still kill Boomer but avoid the helmet to helmet contact.  

Buffalo played a a bend but don't break style of defense and never had a NT that was capable of demanding attention in Jeff Wright. That left a Guard and Tackle to regularly block Bruce. As I recall the Bills did move him around a little just trying to avoid double teams. Reggie played with Buddy Ryan for a part of his career and a much more talented front with the Eagles than we had in Buffalo. I don't remember his conditions in Green Bay as clearly.

 

I don't have a problem stating Bruce played for a less aggressive defense and was double teamed more frequently. The former is just obvious from watching the Bills. Walt Corey was certainly a bend but don't break DC. As far as double teams, it would be nearly impossible to have the protection in a 3-4 you get in a 4-3 regardless of how your DC schemes. The alignment in a 3-4 just doesn't allow a DE to stay protected. For some perspective on this within the top 10 career sack leaders, none are 3-4 DE's besides Bruce. 6 More DE's in the top 10, all 6 are 4-3 DE's.

 

3-4 DE's being known as legends are so rare, it's almost like Buffalo put Bruce in the position they did because they knew how rare he was and it would always occupy two blockers and even still he would beat it. Nobody like Bruce exists as far as production in a 3-4 role. 

 

I know you didn't speak to this, but I also don't understand why people keep citing the QB protection rules. Shorter passes, sure. I would read this article if people are curious on that. 

 

 https://www.vocativ.com/falsestart/376061/nfl-sack-rate-decline/index.html

11 minutes ago, without a drought said:

They were both great in there own right.

 

It's kind of like ranking guitarists, you can make a list but that's it, you can't really rank it in order. If you do, It usually comes down to personal taste and familiarity than who is really better.

Agree completely.  For me, Reggie was the most powerful DE of all time and had the best bull rush I've ever seen. Bruce was certainly powerful but had more athleticism and had the best spin move I've ever seen. I really don't know that you can argue one is better than the other.

[Bob in STL]

9 hours ago, MJS said:

To each his own. White had 2 less sacks than Smith but played in 47 fewer games. So he was more productive in the games he played as far as sacks. Smith had a lot more tackles for loss, though, so maybe that means that Smith was better at playing the run and was a more well rounded defender?

 

Both players are before my time, really, so I only have highlights and old games to go off of.

White played on 4-3, against the RT.  The Eagles supporting cast was better most of the times.
 

Bruce played on a 3-4, against the LT.   Probably a tougher role for sure. 
 

Hard to say who was better but Bruce has the sack record.