4 Current Players already deserve to be on Bills All-time team!

[Rico]

Out of everyone mentioned, Dawkins is the one most standing out of not being in this conversation. I like him, but he’s closer to being serviceable than great.

[Thurman#1]

3 hours ago, Mango said:

Right, just sort of making the point that there isn’t a general consensus on him even being great now let alone all time. That should be a prerequisite for being on an all time list. 
 

Also London Fletcher. 
 

(So we don’t hijack this into an Edmunds thread, I agree with you)

 

 

Good point. Fletcher was terrific.

 

38 minutes ago, Rico said:

Out of everyone mentioned, Dawkins is the one most standing out of not being in this conversation. I like him, but he’s closer to being serviceable than great.

 

 

Disagree strongly.

 

Since his bout with Covid, maybe this is on target, but since year three he's been settling in around excellent. Not elite, but not that far away either.

Edited November 17, 2021 by Thurman#1

[John from Riverside]

4 hours ago, FireChans said:

I know exactly who Kelly was.

I agree with fire Josh Allen is the best QB the bills Have ever had and that is with a great respect to Jim Kelly

Edited November 17, 2021 by John from Riverside

[Chandler#81]

5 hours ago, Augie said:

 

This is not meant with any offense, but I’m guessing you are on the younger side of things. Do you even have any idea who Butch Byrd is? I could go on, and on, and on, but I think that makes the point. 

I’ll ‘go on’.

Or George Saimes? Or Will Wolford? Or Robert James? Or Steve Freeman? Or Mike Stratton? Others have chimed in well too. Yes, definitely a Kiddies Table take. But it is Thanksgiving time, so it’s apt to set the table for the youngins.

 

[FireChans]

4 hours ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

Yup. Allen looks likely to become the best, but for right now, it's Kelly until Allen succeeds over time.

 

Kemp is underrated. First team all-pro twice, Pro Bowl six years in a row and seven total out of nine years of more than 20 passes thrown. A very solid guy.

 

 

He was first team once.

[BillsFanSD]

I think Allen is likely to retire as the Bills all-time best QB.  But right now, that title belongs to Kelly.

 

Likewise for Bass.  He shows a ton of promise, but he's not Steve Christie.  At this point, he's not even Ryan Lindell or Stephen Hauschka.  

 

I hate to comment on the DBs -- White, Poyer, and Hyde are all outstanding, but how many of us really study DB play?  

 

I don't think anybody else on our team is even within eyesight of "all-time" status.  Not that a guy like Oliver (for example) can't get there, just that it's not even up for discussion at this point.

 

4 hours ago, Thurman#1 said:

Good point. Fletcher was terrific.

Yep.  Think about some of the linebackers this team has had over the years.  Fletcher.  Conlan.  Talley.  Biscuit.  Spielman.  Paup.  Spikes.  I'm probably forgetting some guys, but that's a really elite set of LBs even if some of them spent good chunks of their careers with other teams.  

 

Milano is really good and I like Edmunds too, but come on.

Edited November 17, 2021 by BillsFanSD

[ChevyVanMiller]

10 hours ago, JY422 said:

I think we can make the case that there are 4 current players who already belong in the top 3 at their positions on the all-time Bills team. 

 

There are a few other current players who will likely be added to this list but their sample size is too small at this point. (Either for lack of time spent with the Bills, i.e. Stef Diggs, or because they are just coming into their own, i.e. Tre Edmunds, Tyler Bass & Dawson Knox.) 

 

here is my complete list by tiers:

 

Tier One: (Already top 3 at their respective positions)

Allen, White, Poyer, Hyde

perhaps Dawkins belongs in there with the above 4 but I think he still needs a breakout year or two first. 

 

Tier Two: (current trajectory has them in Tier One with another excellent season or two)

Diggs, Dawkins, Bass, Edmunds, Milano, Bease

 

Tier Three: (young bucks who have flashed enough to warrant discussion in another couple years)

Gave Davis, Spencer Brown, Rousseau, Oliver, Taron Johnson. 
 

As I think about all this it pulls me in two directions: 

 

“Optimist”

wow, what a roster Beane & McD have assembled. Not only players, but coaches as well. 

 

“Pessimist”

wow, the Bills have not had very many packed rosters with great players in their 61 year history. 
 

Of course, if this team is the one who brings the Lombardi to Orchard Park then all bets are off and all 53 players are elevated to tier one “legendary” status!! Legendary!

By definition, one can only have a singular breakout year.

[AlCowlingsTaxiService]

Couldn’t disagree more, but as an older fan, All-Time Team might have a completely different meaning to me … the only current player who merits the honor at this point is Hughes. Nobody else has both the longevity and consistently good play to be considered as of yet. 

[Greg S]

9 hours ago, FireChans said:

Allen is the best QB the Bills have ever had. The rest of them? nah.

 

Not yet. He hasn't played long enough. Talent wise he definitely has it over Kelly. He will probably have every Bills passing record when its all said and done. If he leads the Bills to a Super Bowl championship ( I think he will) then he definitely replaces Kelly as the greatest QB in Bills history. Before Allen became a Bill I would list the top 3 QB's in Bills history as Kelly, Kemp, and Ferguson. Josh has already passed Ferguson but he is still behind Kemp ( 2 AFL championships) and Kelly ( 4 Super Bowl appearances)

[oldmanfan]

10 hours ago, JY422 said:

I think we can make the case that there are 4 current players who already belong in the top 3 at their positions on the all-time Bills team. 

 

There are a few other current players who will likely be added to this list but their sample size is too small at this point. (Either for lack of time spent with the Bills, i.e. Stef Diggs, or because they are just coming into their own, i.e. Tre Edmunds, Tyler Bass & Dawson Knox.) 

 

here is my complete list by tiers:

 

Tier One: (Already top 3 at their respective positions)

Allen, White, Poyer, Hyde

perhaps Dawkins belongs in there with the above 4 but I think he still needs a breakout year or two first. 

 

Tier Two: (current trajectory has them in Tier One with another excellent season or two)

Diggs, Dawkins, Bass, Edmunds, Milano, Bease

 

Tier Three: (young bucks who have flashed enough to warrant discussion in another couple years)

Gave Davis, Spencer Brown, Rousseau, Oliver, Taron Johnson. 
 

As I think about all this it pulls me in two directions: 

 

“Optimist”

wow, what a roster Beane & McD have assembled. Not only players, but coaches as well. 

 

“Pessimist”

wow, the Bills have not had very many packed rosters with great players in their 61 year history. 
 

Of course, if this team is the one who brings the Lombardi to Orchard Park then all bets are off and all 53 players are elevated to tier one “legendary” status!! Legendary!

Allen I can buy as #2 behind Kelly, with Kemp third and Fergy 4th.

 

White?  He's in there with Byrd, Egerson, James - he's at least in the discussion

 

Poyer and Hyde?  Saimes, Tony Greene, Henry Jones - Poyer and Hyde are top 5

 

Dawkins?  Way behind Wolford, Barber, Peters; behind Dave Foley and Fina

 

WRs:   You have to have Reed and Moulds in your top two, have to have that, then Lofton, then Jerry Butler who may have been the best of all if he didn't get hurt. Diggs could get into the top three.  To suggest Beasley would is laughable. 

 

Bass could very well wind up #1 but right now is behind Gogolak, Christie, and others 

 

LBs:  Edmunds and Milano would have to prove they are better long term than a whole host of guys including, in the middle, Fletcher, Harry Jacobs, Conlan, Haslett, Shane Nelson, eugene Marve.  And outside Milano would have to beat out Stratton, John Tracy, Bennett. Talley, Paup, Spikes just to name a few

 

 

 

[CincyBillsFan]

9 hours ago, FireChans said:

Allen is the best QB the Bills have ever had. The rest of them? nah.

Second best - AFTER Jim Kelly.

 

 

[Brianmoorman4jesus]

I was just figuring this was a reason to give jerry Hughes his due then it just went totally sideways. Hughes is 1 or 2 solid seasons away from being fringe Wall of fame level. He’s almost the next chapter Kyle Williams but actually was a part of some good teams 😬.
 

I know this thing is probably getting torn to shreds but I’m going to just jump in real quick and throw out that regardless of timeline….Diggs is the best WR this team has ever had and yes I know what that means. I understand who that takes “shots” at…Diggs is the best WR this team has ever had and I won’t duck after saying it.

[Greg S]

2 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

Second best - AFTER Jim Kelly.

 

 

 

Right now I would say third best behind Kelly and Kemp. One has 4 Super Bowl appearances the other 2 AFL championships which are the only championships in Bills history.

[Frostbite]

9 hours ago, FireChans said:

Allen is the best QB the Bills have ever had. The rest of them? nah.

Statistically, sure, he's on pace to be the best but wins are everything. Get us that ring and then we'll talk.

[Ga boy]

Some of the ones on the OP list are sketchy, but I’m sure that most will agree that our RBs would not be in the top 30.  The list does suggest that this roster has great potential.  

[Ethan in Cleveland]

Recency bias....

 

While the safeties probably merit being in the conversation as will Allen and Diggs in a year or two, the rest have a lot of historical competition.  There have been some very good LT's that played in Buffalo. I'm not convinced Dawkins is in the top 7 let alone top 2 or 3. Right now he is below John Fina and maybe on par with Cordy Glenn. 

As for Edmunds my opinion on him is well documented.  Can he develop into a top 5 all time MLB for Buffalo. Maybe. But he has a long way to go. I don't even like Talley that much and I'd still take him over Milano. 

Bass is kicking lights out. And he doesn't have much competition. Christe was probably the best kicker Bills have had and Bass is more accurate and even a stronger leg. Let's hope he keeps it up.

[Giuseppe Tognarelli]

12 hours ago, JY422 said:

I think we can make the case that there are 4 current players who already belong in the top 3 at their positions on the all-time Bills team. 

 

There are a few other current players who will likely be added to this list but their sample size is too small at this point. (Either for lack of time spent with the Bills, i.e. Stef Diggs, or because they are just coming into their own, i.e. Tre Edmunds, Tyler Bass & Dawson Knox.) 

 

here is my complete list by tiers:

 

Tier One: (Already top 3 at their respective positions)

Allen, White, Poyer, Hyde

perhaps Dawkins belongs in there with the above 4 but I think he still needs a breakout year or two first. 

 

Tier Two: (current trajectory has them in Tier One with another excellent season or two)

Diggs, Dawkins, Bass, Edmunds, Milano, Bease

 

Tier Three: (young bucks who have flashed enough to warrant discussion in another couple years)

Gave Davis, Spencer Brown, Rousseau, Oliver, Taron Johnson. 
 

As I think about all this it pulls me in two directions: 

 

“Optimist”

wow, what a roster Beane & McD have assembled. Not only players, but coaches as well. 

 

“Pessimist”

wow, the Bills have not had very many packed rosters with great players in their 61 year history. 
 

Of course, if this team is the one who brings the Lombardi to Orchard Park then all bets are off and all 53 players are elevated to tier one “legendary” status!! Legendary!

Gabe Davis? Our 4th WR is on track to be a Bills all-time great? LOL

[Mikie2times]

Wow, we have entered into a new era of dumb with this thread. 

[FireChans]

1 hour ago, Frostbite said:

Statistically, sure, he's on pace to be the best but wins are everything. Get us that ring and then we'll talk.

What other Bills QB do you have above him

[Mikie2times]

11 hours ago, FireChans said:

I know exactly who Kelly was.

Doesn't sound like you're over 35, just a guess. Kelly has as many Super Bowl appearances as Allen has seasons. He is in the HOF. Allen very well could end up being the best, but it isn't even a conversation at this time. If you tried to bring your case to trial the judge would get pissed off at you for wasting his time.