Do you think a 4-3 formation could be a good one ?

[Sugar High JA17]

It's the Illusion here , reporting somewhere on spaceship earth just jamming through the solar system

Killing my mellow on the 4-3 talk !!!!!

Do my low-frequency beings agree? Why trap us in this hologram any longer

[In Summary]

1 hour ago, Italian Bills said:

 

When i opened this thread was not to say that we have to change the way we are playing D, i’m not crazy.. i opened this thread to ask your opinion about using a 4-3 formation here and there using three LBs to rush the passer more and to be more consistent at stopping the run against teams with great backs like Henry, Kamara, Taylor, etc. 
And those teams don’t have great QBs that can make you pay the price to play that formation few snaps during the game. I do also agree that the nickel is the right asset. 

For sure I like what you're saying.  If you're getting gouged by the run, throw a little more responsibility on your all-star defensive backfield for a few plays.  Matchups should dictate this.  I just think the Bills are very hesitant to move from the nickel.

[Big Turk]

We have the number one defense in the NFL almost across the board and we have people who still aren't satisfied and want them to change things...SMFH 

 

C'mon bro...this isn't Madden. You don't just make those type of changes and think everything is going to be the same.

 

They play base nickel 92% of plays with Johnson on the field. It's a passing league why would you replace a CB with an LB especially when they are also 3rd in the NFL against the rush on a YPC standpoint?? I mean I might be able to get there if we had terrible run D with nickel personable but we clearly don't.

10 hours ago, bmur66 said:

You want to change the no. 1 rated defense?

 

It's a slow day apparently...

Edited November 16, 2021 by Big Turk

[Pokebball]

10 hours ago, bmur66 said:

You want to change the no. 1 rated defense?

This was my first reaction.  Why?  Isn't what we're doing working pretty well? 

[Thurman#1]

Quick, we're the #1 defense.

 

Change!!!

[Italian Bills]

8 hours ago, In Summary said:

• Could be TJ's money but could also be analytics based risk assessment.  Maybe TJ simply guards you against more big plays than would Klein or 3rd LB?  
• McDermott and Frazier, college and pro secondary players respectively, understand the defensive backfield and are arguably playing to their experience and coaching strengths.  If Klein (or 3rd LB) and TJ were a draw on inherent talent, I'd still expect the coaches to lean TJ/nickel over 4-3.
• TJ and Poyer aren't afraid to hit so they're not necessarily run game liabilities IMO.  I've joked that Poyer is our most physical linebacker.
• I like Klein to jumpstart the pass rush if the front 4 are ineffective.  I wouldn't ask that of Edmunds.
• Most times the Bills have one guy (sometimes two) over 300 lb while the opponent's line has five.  Edmunds and Milano are not Shane Conlan and Jim Haslett.  We're built to stop the premier passing teams and not the two or three premier inside running games.
• The base 4-3 vs nickel debate is hopefully just about getting past those couple of teams than could derail your playoff seating.  

I thought the same about our OL players’s pounds compared to others D lines. I agree we are lighter and that’s another reason to use three LB’s, to support and strenght our front four against the run. 
This just when we face great backs like Henry, Kamara, etc. But it seem that people think i’m saying to change everything on D - I’’M NOT SAYING THIS, OK ? 
 

I was thinking about using a 4-3 in particular games against strong backs and “normal” QBs. 

Edited November 17, 2021 by Italian Bills

[hondo in seattle]

On 11/16/2021 at 5:31 PM, Big Turk said:

We have the number one defense in the NFL almost across the board and we have people who still aren't satisfied and want them to change things...SMFH 

 

C'mon bro...this isn't Madden. You don't just make those type of changes and think everything is going to be the same.

 

They play base nickel 92% of plays with Johnson on the field. It's a passing league why would you replace a CB with an LB especially when they are also 3rd in the NFL against the rush on a YPC standpoint?? I mean I might be able to get there if we had terrible run D with nickel personable but we clearly don't.

 

It's a slow day apparently...

 

I agree with every point you make.  But I do think you overstated your intro just a bit.  We're #1 in yards and points allowed which is amazing.  But #2 in pass yards allowed and #3 in rushing yards allowed.  We're not really number 1 almost across the board but we are #1 in the most important metrics and high in others.

 

It boggles the mind that a team that runs Nickel as much as we do can be #3 in rushing defense.  

 

I can only see using a 4-3 when facing a running team.  And the Colts are a running team.  When Taylor rushes for over 100 yards, they win.   When he doesn't, they lose.  That's been the trend.  So it'll be interesting what Frazier dials up.

[hondo in seattle]

On 11/16/2021 at 12:13 PM, LeGOATski said:

That's 4-2-5, which the Bills have used often with Neal. 

 

Instead of "run and stop the run", McDermott's philosophy seems to be "pass and stop the pass." That's why 4-3 hasn't really factored into their system as much.

 

Agreed.  And it's Beane's philosophy, too.  For example,  he used first round draft picks to get guys who help the passing game while using 3rd round picks on RBs.  Most the offensive linemen he acquired are players who had better reps for pass pro than road grating.  Our LBs are coverage guys - not Dick Butkus smash-you-in-the-mouth types.   And so on.  

 

Under the circumstances, I'm not surprised our offensive running attack isn't better.   I am surprised our rush D is as good as it is.  

[Italian Bills]

1 hour ago, hondo in seattle said:

 

I agree with every point you make.  But I do think you overstated your intro just a bit.  We're #1 in yards and points allowed which is amazing.  But #2 in pass yards allowed and #3 in rushing yards allowed.  We're not really number 1 almost across the board but we are #1 in the most important metrics and high in others.

 

It boggles the mind that a team that runs Nickel as much as we do can be #3 in rushing defense.  

 

I can only see using a 4-3 when facing a running team.  And the Colts are a running team.  When Taylor rushes for over 100 yards, they win.   When he doesn't, they lose.  That's been the trend.  So it'll be interesting what Frazier dials up.

Exactly, that’s why i suggested a 4-3 formation against strong running teams. 

[HoofHearted]

You guys are wild. Defenses have personnel packages - not formations. The offense dictates how you align regardless of the personnel you have on the field so it ultimately would put a lesser athlete in space the majority of the time. Leave the coaching to the coaches fellas.

[BigAl2526]

Worth considering?  Sure, but with the #1 defense in the league, I'm not expecting McDermott to make a major change like the team's base alignment