The loss of Knox has caught up to us

[78thealltimegreat]

 Having taken the time to rewatch the game it literally took every single thing to break against the Bills for them to lose…Josh trying to be a one man offense…timely penalties…oline that was literally getting worse by the quarter 

  But lack of TE depth is our true offense Achilles heel what we saw against Miami and we saw against Jacksonville…both teams followed a similar pattern bracket outside…let 4 rush and leave the middle open cause of zero threat from the backs or TEs and it proved to be the difference against the Jags I have no doubt if Dawson played they win this game by 2 TDs 

  When Dawson broke his hand the front office made a calculation right next to the trade deadline hey we should be able to survive this stretch of games and it hasn’t  panned out he means as much to Josh as Diggs does anymore

  When Dawson comes back hopefully this week we will look like a completely different team 

  We can argue about The lack of TE depth and whose at fault for it but that part really really showed up in this game  

[LABILLBACKER]

Knox and Brown better play this Sunday. Sweeney is not the answer. Still don't understand why we keep guys like Dimarco/ Gilliam over a Hollister?

[billsfan1959]

The loss of Knox and Brown (and the subsequent shuffling of the online) had a much bigger impact the last two weeks than most people anticipated.

[HappyDays]

It has. I just posted this in another thread:

 

 

That level of efficiency is not sustainable but that is an eye popping stat. Knox is our best red zone target and our best check down option. He has become a complete weapon. Hopefully the injury doesn't linger for the whole season.

[ProcessTruster]

8 hours ago, billsfan1959 said:

The loss of Knox and Brown (and the subsequent shuffling of the online) had a much bigger impact the last two weeks than most people anticipated.

completely agree.   injuries matter in the NFL.   wipes out the right side of the line (G, T and TE) when they are out.   the average fan just doesn't understand.   There is a reason Ford is a backup (at guard, no less).   plus Williams got his fat contract and went to sleep and can't play RT anymore...   Beane was very wise to grab Spencer Brown in the draft.  

[Pete]

Knox is a cover 2 buster.  Singletary, Moss, and Sweeney are not

[BearNorth]

Josh is 6-5, Most O-lineman are at least that tall if not taller, Jax D line was 6-5 6-5 6-7 6-3. How do you get the ball to our smurf sized & slow RB's [Moss 5-9, Motor 5-7].

 

[stosh64]

3 minutes ago, BearNorth said:

Josh is 6-5, Most O-lineman are at least that tall if not taller, Jax D line was 6-5 6-5 6-7 6-3. How do you get the ball to our smurf sized & slow RB's [Moss 5-9, Motor 5-7].

 

They said during the game that Josh has the most tipped passes in the league.  That kind of surprised me, for a 6'5" QB.

[Royale with Cheese]

22 minutes ago, stosh64 said:

They said during the game that Josh has the most tipped passes in the league.  That kind of surprised me, for a 6'5" QB.

It’s because our line is getting pushed back.  The closer to Josh, the more likely a tip.

[BearNorth]

3 hours ago, stosh64 said:

They said during the game that Josh has the most tipped passes in the league.  That kind of surprised me, for a 6'5" QB.

Josh believes he has superior arm strength, so I think sometimes he throws fastballs without a lot of arc, and those are easier to tip or bat than throws with some arc and touch.  He also has to throw quickly with the mess we call an O-line.  Brady is a master of the perfectly arced touch pass.

[Motorin']

13 hours ago, HappyDays said:

It has. I just posted this in another thread:

 

 

That level of efficiency is not sustainable but that is an eye popping stat. Knox is our best red zone target and our best check down option. He has become a complete weapon. Hopefully the injury doesn't linger for the whole season.

 

He also takes the top off of defenses and draws attention from one of the safeties, which opens up the intermediate passing windows for the other receivers. 

Edited November 9, 2021 by Motorin'

[CircleTheWagons99]

The lack of an OLINE has finally caught up with the Bills....

[Straight Hucklebuck]

And in general this franchise has thrown scrub players at the problem forever. 

 

Ryan Neufeld, Lee Smith, Chris Gragg, Derek Fine, Shawn Nelson, Derek Schouman, Nick O'Leary, Matt Murphy, Joe Klopfenstein. 

 

 

Since 2010 we've drafted a total of four Tight Ends. 

 

Knox, Sweeney, O'Leary, Gragg. 

 

That's it. 

 

 

So this Coaching Staff and Front Office can talk all they want about recognizing the trends in the NFL, but players like Tommy Sweeney are still on the roster, Reggie Gilliam who can't play Fullback or Tight End effectively because he is a tweener. 

 

It's never been a focus of the Bills to get Tight End correct, we've got no depth at all, and haven't forever. 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 9, 2021 by Straight Hucklebuck

[dorquemada]

10 minutes ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

And in general this franchise has thrown scrub players at the problem forever. 

 

Ryan Neufeld, Lee Smith, Chris Gragg, Derek Fine, Shawn Nelson, Derek Schouman, Nick O'Leary, Matt Murphy, Joe Klopfenstein. 

 

 

Since 2010 we've drafted a total of four Tight Ends. 

 

Knox, Sweeney, O'Leary, Gragg. 

 

That's it. 

 

 

So this Coaching Staff and Front Office can talk all they want about recognizing the trends in the NFL, but players like Tommy Sweeney are still on the roster, Reggie Gilliam who can't play Fullback or Tight End effectively because he is a tweener. 

 

It's never been a focus of the Bills to get Tight End correct, we've got no depth at all, and haven't forever. 

 

 

 

 

 

Gilliam is the mystery there.  Even the few times he's been in at FB, he's a decoy, and has he even caught a pass as a TE?  Are we holding him in double top secret reserve for a trick play in the SB? 

 

Shoulda kept Hollister instead

[Hapless Bills Fan]

5 hours ago, ScottLaw said:

Starts and stops with the offensive line. Knox played against the Steelers…. Where the offense was also putrid thanks to their line getting annihilated. 

 

Against the Steelers, the Bills played empty set (5 WR) or (1,0) set (1 RB, 4 WR) almost half the time.  Knox was only on the field just over half the time, as opposed to subsequent games where it's been 79%-91% of the time.

 

That said, last year when we were missing Knox, we had a decent backup TE in Kroft.  We went into training camp with a decent proven backup TE in Hollister.

 

Somehow they evaluated Sweeney > Hollister, and that appears to have been a mistake.

 

 

 

1 hour ago, dorquemada said:

 

Gilliam is the mystery there.  Even the few times he's been in at FB, he's a decoy, and has he even caught a pass as a TE?

 

This *is* the sort of thing one can look up quickly

 

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/G/GillRe00.htm

 

Yes, he has

[Hapless Bills Fan]

5 hours ago, stosh64 said:

They said during the game that Josh has the most tipped passes in the league.  That kind of surprised me, for a 6'5" QB.

 

1) A QB can throw a pass with arc over a tall defender to hit an RB or WR in the flats.  Josh has actually DONE that a few times this season, but any sort of pass to the flats was a weakness for him coming out of college and it's still not his best thing; throwing short passes with arc is something I've only seen him start to do this season.

 

2) Tipped passes are a function of the OL not being engaged at the point of attack with the DL to my understanding.  When Eric Wood was the center, anyone who tried to jump and tip a pass would get a gutful of Wood's shoulder laying them on their ass and wish they hadn't.  But if nothing is blocking the defender's path to the QB, or if the OLman has been thrown back or off balance, the DLman can jump and deflect with impunity.

[Scott7975]

Yup the loss of Knox is pretty big. Also the loss of Brown. The o line still wasn’t great with Brown in but it was light years better than the mess this past week. 

[dorquemada]

31 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

 

This *is* the sort of thing one can look up quickly

 

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/G/GillRe00.htm

 

Yes, he has

 

Wow, get rekt, me.  Instead of the zero receptions i thought he had, he had infinity percent more catches at 1

 

Do you think it was a good decision to give him a roster spot instead of Hollister?

[billsfan1959]

27 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

They value their own guys way too much… there seemed to be a lot of emphasis on how hard Sweeney battled to get back after the bout with myocarditis… 

 

They valued Knox too when most people had completely given up on him. Sweeney missed a lot of time because of health issues. I'm willing to wait a little longer to see if he can take that big step forward.

[uninja]

15 minutes ago, dorquemada said:

 

Wow, get rekt, me.  Instead of the zero receptions i thought he had, he had infinity percent more catches at 1

 

Do you think it was a good decision to give him a roster spot instead of Hollister?

 

Gilliam is a fixture on special teams and Hollister has been pretty meh with the Jags. He's currently behind Dan Arnold on the depth chart and was a healthy scratch for the game against the Bills.

 

For his ability to line up in the FB position, play teams etc I think Gilliam is the better player.