I hate to say it … but the Pats are coming

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

49 minutes ago, PatsFanNH said:

Whose thumping their chest?  I think it just spiraled out of control.

 

I originally said I know what my Pats are because of who they have faced. (They have faced two top 3 O’s and 2 Top 10 D)That is a good team with the potential be great in the near future.

 

I then said we don’t know who Buffalo is because they haven’t faced a truly rough stretch yet. Now tough means teams they are facing not losses.. Hell even in a loss if the team looked good and it was just bad luck can tell you something. (For example the AZ game last year.)

 

I have said all year the Pats are a fringe playoff team and the Bills should be SB contenders.  That could change depending on these next 4 weeks where the Bills face playoff contenders.. Bills could be who we thought they were or prove us wrong in which case the Pats would be AFCE champs again. 
 

now are you saying the Bills have truly been tested by any true metal of the league in regards to Offense? They have faced a tough D in Pitt but that’s it.. 

 

I think NE is playing good football, and they're built for a playoff run.  Just need to avoid any serious injuries and they'll be dangerous.  

Honestly i don't think there's a team in the AFC that wants to play either of them in the first round.  Good defenses that don't let you establish a rushing attack , and take the ball away.  One offense that pounds the rock/exploits the boundaries, and the other has a top 5 QB with weapons.  I think both teams stats are propped up a bit from weaker opponents - but that doesn't change the remainder of the AFC's perception of them.  

 

At the end of the day, fans posturing (not saying you are doing this, its a bills board so its probably bills fans) and media coverage is meaningless and this will be settled on the field at least twice this year - possibly 3 times.  

Edited November 16, 2021 by dneveu

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

2 minutes ago, streetkings01 said:

I trust Frazier/McDermott against young inexperienced QBs……not at all scared of Mac Jones and his 13 TD passes in 10 games in which 3 of them just came against the Browns.

 

Not taking anything away from Mac Jones, but if he was putting up these same stats for any team other than the Pats he wouldn’t be getting near the hype. It’s not like he’s lighting up the NFL……he’s avg 233 yards and 1.3 touchdowns a game.

 

He's only turned it over twice during the winning streak.  He played really well against cleveland, not so much against carolina and LA.  6 games over 70% completion, but he's got a pretty short average depth of target, but the numbers been trending up.  I think he's playing well in their structure.  

[Patrick Duffy]

54 minutes ago, PatsFanNH said:

now are you saying the Bills have truly been tested by any true metal of the league in regards to Offense? They have faced a tough D in Pitt but that’s it.

Yes, I'd say Tenn (best record in AFC) which came down to the wire. Also KC, and I don't care to hear the "KC was playing bad, blah blah". KC is still a very good and dangerous team on offense.

 

And not much difference in Pats opponents and Bills opponents. TB, Saints, and cowboys were the toughest ones on paper. Bills with Pitt, KC, and Tenn. So that's 3 teams each both Pats and Bills played that one could consider "tough games"

[GottaRun]

38 minutes ago, streetkings01 said:

I trust Frazier/McDermott against young inexperienced QBs……not at all scared of Mac Jones and his 13 TD passes in 10 games in which 3 of them just came against the Browns.

 

Not taking anything away from Mac Jones, but if he was putting up these same stats for any team other than the Pats he wouldn’t be getting near the hype. It’s not like he’s lighting up the NFL……he’s avg 233 yards and 1.3 touchdowns a game.

I think we'll have a better idea of who Mac is after the Monday nighter in Buffalo.  He's going to experience a truly hostile road game, in an amped up stadium, if he plays well in our house I'll be shocked.  We all know tough division games are another level of intensity.  

[Hapless Bills Fan]

9 hours ago, Ghost_002! said:

well....and if any coach or player spends anytime thinking more  "what could be" than the actually game plan you already lost. If nothing has happened what is there to worry about..i mean overall teams are suppose to keep things away from other teams right...playbooks, game plans, signal calls...etc. 

 

You have it backwards.  (Now retired) Bills LB Zo Alexander laid it out in 2019, players have to think about it and be mentally prepared for stuff to happen and don't get mentally hijacked when it does.  Doesn't mean they spend significant time on it, just be aware that stuff will happen, equipment wise, ref wise, etc. and don't let it get to you, move on.

 

Your team is called the Cheatriots for a reason.  Doesn't mean they're not a good football team and Bill Belicheck a great coach, just means they earned that moniker Fair and Square. 

 

 

[Patrick Duffy]

1 minute ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

You have it backwards.  (Now retired) Bills LB Zo Alexander laid it out in 2019, players have to think about it and be mentally prepared for stuff to happen and don't get mentally hijacked when it does.  Doesn't mean they spend significant time on it, just be aware that stuff will happen, equipment wise, ref wise, etc. and don't let it get to you, move on.

 

Your team is called the Cheatriots for a reason.  Doesn't mean they're not a good football team and Bill Belicheck a great coach, just means they earned that moniker Fair and Square. 

 

 

Exactly, they framed that reputation for themselves. 

[P Riv]

The Division race hasn't been this fun in about 20+ years!  The 2 games against the Pats will be like playoff games, definitely more exciting than just playing out the string waiting for January.  

[BADOLBILZ]

13 minutes ago, P Riv said:

The Division race hasn't been this fun in about 20+ years!  The 2 games against the Pats will be like playoff games, definitely more exciting than just playing out the string waiting for January.  

 

 

I know the thread title is "the Pats are coming"..............but as someone who never doubted Belichick despite all of the revisionist nonsense about it being all about Brady (and this includes a lot of ignorant Pats fans too)...........IMO the Pats never left.

 

McDermott is still 2-6 versus Belichick......and last season........despite major roster issues...........they played the Bills very competitively for about 6 quarters before the Bills really flipped the switch and obliterated them in that game in NE.

 

So IMO.........the Pats are still the hunted to me.   I don't want to survive against them...........I want to beat them a 3rd straight time........then a 4th straight..........nobody has done that to Belichick.

 

I want to send Belichick back to the drawing board so he can spend more money in free agency(after an NFL record $ outlay this past offseason).    

 

I agree.........this is what divisional football is supposed to look like and frankly over the years one of the things I always looked forward to was having a Bills team eventually overtake NE and sharpen themselves against a Belichick team and carry that into the playoffs where you know you will be facing lesser coaching.

 

Last year, it really wasn't a fair fight and they were still in the Bills heads so I think the resulting games weren't that good.    This year they should be competing on the same level and we could really see some great football.

[What a Tuel]

2 hours ago, PatsFanNH said:

Whose thumping their chest?  I think it just spiraled out of control.

 

I originally said I know what my Pats are because of who they have faced. (They have faced two top 3 O’s and 2 Top 10 D)That is a good team with the potential be great in the near future.

 

I then said we don’t know who Buffalo is because they haven’t faced a truly rough stretch yet. Now tough means teams they are facing not losses.. Hell even in a loss if the team looked good and it was just bad luck can tell you something. (For example the AZ game last year.)

 

I have said all year the Pats are a fringe playoff team and the Bills should be SB contenders.  That could change depending on these next 4 weeks where the Bills face playoff contenders.. Bills could be who we thought they were or prove us wrong in which case the Pats would be AFCE champs again. 
 

now are you saying the Bills have truly been tested by any true metal of the league in regards to Offense? They have faced a tough D in Pitt but that’s it.. 

 

The pats lost to the Dolphins, Bucs, Saints, Cowboys. 

 

I mean cool, you beat the browns without their QB, Panthers with a limited McCaffrey and no QB, and the Chargers (good win). Otherwise bottom of the barrel, Jets (2x), Texans (barely) make up half of your wins.

 

I don't think you really have a leg to stand on in terms of quality of opponents to be sitting here saying the bills haven't been tested. The pats have been tested and failed 75% of their tough games (Chargers, Cowboys, Bucs, Saints).

 

The whole argument is asinine.

[streetkings01]

23 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

I know the thread title is "the Pats are coming"..............but as someone who never doubted Belichick despite all of the revisionist nonsense about it being all about Brady (and this includes a lot of ignorant Pats fans too)...........IMO the Pats never left.

 

McDermott is still 2-6 versus Belichick......and last season........despite major roster issues...........they played the Bills very competitively for about 6 quarters before the Bills really flipped the switch and obliterated them in that game in NE.

 

So IMO.........the Pats are still the hunted to me.   I don't want to survive against them...........I want to beat them a 3rd straight time........then a 4th straight..........nobody has done that to Belichick.

 

I want to send Belichick back to the drawing board so he can spend more money in free agency(after an NFL record $ outlay this past offseason).    

 

I agree.........this is what divisional football is supposed to look like and frankly over the years one of the things I always looked forward to was having a Bills team eventually overtake NE and sharpen themselves against a Belichick team and carry that into the playoffs where you know you will be facing lesser coaching.

 

Last year, it really wasn't a fair fight and they were still in the Bills heads so I think the resulting games weren't that good.    This year they should be competing on the same level and we could really see some great football.

McDermott is 0-6 against Brady/Belichick…….2-0 against Other QB/Belichick.

 

I believe the Buffalo Bills have a winning record against Belichick in games where Brady did not play or finish the game. Add in the fact that Belichick is 219-64 with Brady and 63-75 without Brady.

Edited November 16, 2021 by streetkings01

[Ghost_002!]

1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

You have it backwards.  (Now retired) Bills LB Zo Alexander laid it out in 2019, players have to think about it and be mentally prepared for stuff to happen and don't get mentally hijacked when it does.  Doesn't mean they spend significant time on it, just be aware that stuff will happen, equipment wise, ref wise, etc. and don't let it get to you, move on.

 

Your team is called the Cheatriots for a reason.  Doesn't mean they're not a good football team and Bill Belicheck a great coach, just means they earned that moniker Fair and Square. 

 

 

 

 

What exactly did i have backwards? He actually touched on my point about if you let the "reputation" control your thoughts you lose. I never said that's what every player or coach thinks. I said "IF" they do. He never once brought up the equipment issue (which is what you brought up and is what i asked you about specifically). The co-host wanted talk about the b.s. that follows the pats but didn't (see the sour grapes in his face).

 

I do not get too caught up in referees and calls because 1. every teams' fan complains and think their teams is always being wrong by the refs,  and every player complains about the refs and superstars and great teams do get favorable calls thats in every sports not something that just happens in New England solely. 

 

but at the end of the day...when the bills play the patriots you guys have won fair and square and you have lost fair and square. Point blank! Nothing "b.s." wise has taken any victory from the Bills, my point. Never said you didn't think they are a good team or don't  have a great coach, what i challenged you on was the equipment issue that really isn't an issue.  

 

Also you never heard me deny spygate or the other crap with the footballs..but for sure you can't say the bills had any issue with any equipment and as i pointed out other teams have complained about equipment issue in their own games that had nothing to do with the patriots. 

Edited November 16, 2021 by Ghost_002!

[BADOLBILZ]

12 minutes ago, streetkings01 said:

McDermott is 0-6 against Brady/Belichick…….2-0 against Other QB/Belichick.

 

I believe the Buffalo Bills have a winning record against Belichick in games where Brady did not play or finish the game. Add in the fact that Belichick is 219-64 with Brady and 63-75 without Brady.

 

 

McDermott was actually fired.......*****-canned mid-season and replaced by Juan Castillo(yes, that Juan Castillo)....at the coordinator job he had prior to Carolina......so does that mean he's only a good coach because he was lucky to be in the right situation in Carolina?

 

At about that same time.......Belichick took a QB who hadn't started a game since high school in Matt Cassell and lead them to an 11-5 record.

 

Belichick is the greatest coach in NFL history.   Beating him should be ultra-satisfying every time.   

[dave mcbride]

22 minutes ago, streetkings01 said:

McDermott is 0-6 against Brady/Belichick…….2-0 against Other QB/Belichick.

 

I believe the Buffalo Bills have a winning record against Belichick in games where Brady did not play or finish the game. Add in the fact that Belichick is 219-64 with Brady and 63-75 without Brady.

68-76, actually. You may be forgetting to include the first 4 games of 2016 (they went 3-1) and also the fact that while Brady started game one of the 2008 season, he went down early in the first quarter with the score tied 0-0. They won that game with Cassel. Perhaps more importantly, he is 27-19 since 2008 without Brady. 

[P Riv]

2 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

68-76, actually. You may be forgetting to include the first 4 games of 2016 (they went 3-1) and also the fact that while Brady started game one of the 2008 season, he went down early in the first quarter with the score tied 0-0. They won that game with Cassel. Perhaps more importantly, he is 27-19 since 2008 without Brady. 

 

Way too much is made of his time in Cleveland 25-30 years ago.  Its emphasized in an attempt to distort the record to pretend he's overrated, while at the same time ignoring what he did as the assistant head coach/DC under Bill Parcells.  That resume includes 2 SB wins, shutting down Joe Montana (the previous GOAT) and the K-gun, a SB loss with the Patriots to the Packers all star team, and also getting the late 90's Jets to the AFC Championship game and almost winning it.  

 

To me, saying he's overrated is an easy way to look like a Homer.  His resume dwarfs any other coach, including his mentor Parcells and rival Don Shula.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

8 minutes ago, What a Tuel said:

 

The pats lost to the Dolphins, Bucs, Saints, Cowboys. 

 

I mean cool, you beat the browns without their QB, Panthers with a limited McCaffrey and no QB, and the Chargers (good win). Otherwise bottom of the barrel, Jets (2x), Texans (barely) make up half of your wins.

 

I don't think you really have a leg to stand on in terms of quality of opponents to be sitting here saying the bills haven't been tested. The pats have been tested and failed 75% of their tough games (Chargers, Cowboys, Bucs, Saints).

 

The whole argument is asinine.

 

This, especially when it started with @PatsFanNH saying "Every one of the Patriots wins was against an above .500 team..... That’s simple facts" when the "simple facts" show that the Patriots in fact have 3 of their 6 wins against bad teams, plus as you say, beat up on the Browns without their star RB Nick Chubb and with an injured (then out) Mayfield.

 

There are other metrics for how difficult a win is to achieve for a given team in a given week than the opponent's W-L record.  In the meantime, You Are what Your Record Says You Are.

 

Kudos to Belichick and the Patriots for putting together a 6-4 season with a rookie QB.  Good for them!  In the meantime, I guess if it makes a Pats fan feel better to come on a Bills message board and spout nonsense about how "every one of the Patriots wins was against an above 0.500 team" being a fact, whatever.

 

The Bills are on to Indianapolis, which is IMO a far bigger challenge than their 5-5 record would suggest, and a "test" for the Bills defense which was unable to stop the combination of a strong rushing attack and a sufficient passing game against the Titans.

 

The Pats get to play the Atlanta Falcons, who IMO are a far weaker opponent than their 4-5 record would suggest, but any given Sunday....

1 minute ago, P Riv said:

Way too much is made of his time in Cleveland 25-30 years ago.  Its emphasized in an attempt to distort the record to pretend he's overrated, while at the same time ignoring what he did as the assistant head coach/DC under Bill Parcells.  That resume includes 2 SB wins, shutting down Joe Montana (the previous GOAT) and the K-gun, a SB loss with the Patriots to the Packers all star team, and also getting the late 90's Jets to the AFC Championship game and almost winning it.  

 

To me, saying he's overrated is an easy way to look like a Homer.  His resume dwarfs any other coach, including his mentor Parcells and rival Don Shula.

 

This.

 

The same "look at his record when he was with...." argument could be used to discredit our coaches as well.

 

Bill Belichick is a great coach, which is why it's somewhat puzzling that he resorts to some of the shady things he has done - but he's still a great coach.  The fact that he gets the Star treatment from the refs and that previously, he has owned Sean McDermott's soul, just makes him more dangerous.

[Ghost_002!]

Trending...

 

 

 

 

Edited November 16, 2021 by Ghost_002!

[Hapless Bills Fan]

18 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

McDermott was actually fired.......*****-canned mid-season and replaced by Juan Castillo(yes, that Juan Castillo)....at the coordinator job he had prior to Carolina......so does that mean he's only a good coach because he was lucky to be in the right situation in Carolina?

 

C'mon Man.  McDermott was fired after the season, on January 15th - after a disappointing 10-6 season in which the Eagles lost to the Packers in the WC game.  He was hired as DC by the Panthers almost immediately.  The facts paint a very different picture than your "***** canned mid season and replaced by Juan Castillo" imply to people who don't know better.

 

You have valid points about the practice of denigrating Bill Belichick because of his long-ago coaching record prior to the Patriots or because he had the smarts to recognize what he might have in Brady, keep him on the roster, and develop him properly by not asking too much initially.

 

So why undercut those points with dramatic sounding incorrect gouge?

 

It is of course true that Reid promoted Juan Castillo, his OL coach, to DC, and the reasons why Reid made that decision are a puzzle for the ages.  It took the Eagles from a 10-6 team who had been to the playoffs 3 years running, to an 8-8 then a 4-12 team and ultimately led to Reid's ouster from Philly.

 

[BADOLBILZ]

38 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

C'mon Man.  McDermott was fired after the season, on January 15th - after a disappointing 10-6 season in which the Eagles lost to the Packers in the WC game.  He was hired as DC by the Panthers almost immediately.  The facts paint a very different picture than your "***** canned mid season and replaced by Juan Castillo" imply to people who don't know better.

 

You have valid points about the practice of denigrating Bill Belichick because of his long-ago coaching record prior to the Patriots or because he had the smarts to recognize what he might have in Brady, keep him on the roster, and develop him properly by not asking too much initially.

 

So why undercut those points with dramatic sounding incorrect gouge?

 

It is of course true that Reid promoted Juan Castillo, his OL coach, to DC, and the reasons why Reid made that decision are a puzzle for the ages.  It took the Eagles from a 10-6 team who had been to the playoffs 3 years running, to an 8-8 then a 4-12 team and ultimately led to Reid's ouster from Philly.

 

 

 

So McDermott was why they went to the playoffs 3 years running and firing him lead to Reid's ouster?  That's a scalding hot take for sure.

 

I think the Eagles had been good for some time prior to McDermott's promotion to DC and I think there were other, more important factors that lead to Reid leaving Philly.    He's since proven to be a fairly good HC without McD as well,  IMHO.  

 

My bad about the timing of the McDermott firing though.....it was right after the season............he was replaced by the promotion of Juan Castillo though..........which is hilarious and certainly looks like utter disrespect for the coaching acumen of McDermott.  In hindsight.

 

Which is what we are talking about here.    Hindsight and ancient history.

 

Belichick had a bad record in Cleveland the better part of 30 years ago.    I can't believe we still hear that nonsense though.    Irrelevant.   He was rebuilding an organization at a time when turnarounds were harder.......before widespread free agency created a league without a repeat champion in 15 years........and he didn't have a good situation at QB and his final season was undermined by the team announcing their move to Baltimore.  

 

But even in Cleveland he created the blueprint and processes used by a Ravens organization that has since won 2 SB's and really never lost that identity.

 

So the whole "his record without Brady" stuff is just jibber-jabber from bitter folk.    

[Patrick Duffy]

9 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

My bad about the timing of the McDermott firing though.....it was right after the season............he was replaced by the promotion of Juan Castillo though..........which is hilarious and certainly looks like utter disrespect for the coaching acumen of McDermott.  In hindsigh

Wasn't Juan an OL coach or something? If I remember right he was....weird to fire your DC and replace with a OL coach that sucked I might add.

[ColoradoBills]

22 hours ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said:

Actually it's not the Patriots that were coming, it was the British!

 

This thread is more like "The Russians are Coming, The Russians are Coming".  Bills fans have to get "organized".
 

 

4 hours ago, billsfan1959 said:

 

Look, I know you are back on your team's bandwagon and good for you. If you feel the need to go on another team's message board to try to convince fans of another team and yourself that the Chargers, Browns, and Panthers were some kind of "gauntlet" and playing great football when they played your team, in order to rationalize to yourself that your team deserves the lofty status it now occupies in your mind, feel free.

 

Regardless, the truth is this: It doesn't matter who your team has played or who the Bills have played, or what the outcomes of those games were. None of that has any relevance to the games ahead between the two teams, or with other teams. We will know when they play each other and at the end of the year where the two stand.

 

Until then, spend your time thumping your chest on the message boards of other teams to manage your fragile psyche and to keep your little world from falling apart. I guess it is cheaper than a therapist. 

 

It all seems somewhat pathetic to me, but I try not to judge.

 

Great post and should be read by fans from all teams!