Election Night: Nov 2 GDT

[Doc]

How did the socialists get so much power over the Dems?  Are they really that afraid of them?

[ComradeKayAdams]

On 11/6/2021 at 8:01 AM, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

I’m actually a bit disappointed to read this post.  I recognize that the Guv likely loses out out on the free coffee if he doesn’t get all the punches on his bigotry card, but you’re “...not quite sure about…” his condescending and disrespectful characterization of a massive segment of the female voting bloc?

 

We aren’t where we were, historically speaking, but the “you can’t trust them people” trope is how we got there the first time around.  

 

There are no new ideas, just different boogeypersons.

 

Why are you disappointed in me?? I was just being polite and open-minded and was giving Mr. Governor an opportunity to defend a very bold statement. His supporting evidence for the claim that white women are becoming more racist appears to be that more voted for Trump in 2020 than in 2016. Suffice to say, I remain unconvinced… And even if the claim is true, liberals should know by now that calling everyone a racist isn’t a productive political strategy (see: 2016 presidential election, Hillary campaign, “deplorables” comment).

 

While politicians alone won’t “solve” racism (empathic dialogue and social desegregation are essential components too), my contention is that they can still do a lot to alleviate the problem by delivering on domestic economic policies which have overwhelming support from the electorate (such as most of the stuff that is being gutted from the BBB bill…). Why? Because American history is loaded with examples indicating a strong causal relationship between economic anxiety and racial tension.

[Governor]

45 minutes ago, ComradeKayAdams said:

 

Why are you disappointed in me?? I was just being polite and open-minded and was giving Mr. Governor an opportunity to defend a very bold statement. His supporting evidence for the claim that white women are becoming more racist appears to be that more voted for Trump in 2020 than in 2016. Suffice to say, I remain unconvinced… And even if the claim is true, liberals should know by now that calling everyone a racist isn’t a productive political strategy (see: 2016 presidential election, Hillary campaign, “deplorables” comment).

 

While politicians alone won’t “solve” racism (empathic dialogue and social desegregation are essential components too), my contention is that they can still do a lot to alleviate the problem by delivering on domestic economic policies which have overwhelming support from the electorate (such as most of the stuff that is being gutted from the BBB bill…). Why? Because American history is loaded with examples indicating a strong causal relationship between economic anxiety and racial tension.

https://www.alternet.org/2020/11/heres-why-so-many-white-women-voted-for-trump-analysis/

 

None of this is very earth shattering. We’ve seen this behavior for decades. It shows up in polling and focus groups.

 

“However one defines it, a majority of white women voted for Trump to protect what they have – status, income, tax advantage, whatever – despite Trump's anti-woman attitudes and record.”

 

Now, who is “perceived” to be threatening those things?

Edited November 7, 2021 by Governor

[ComradeKayAdams]

1 hour ago, Governor said:

https://www.alternet.org/2020/11/heres-why-so-many-white-women-voted-for-trump-analysis/

 

None of this is very earth shattering. We’ve seen this behavior for decades. It shows up in polling and focus groups.

 

“However one defines it, a majority of white women voted for Trump to protect what they have – status, income, tax advantage, whatever – despite Trump's anti-woman attitudes and record.”

 

Now, who is “perceived” to be threatening those things?

 

Thank you for the article, Mr. Governor. Yes, I’m familiar with the content and you are correct that it’s not earth-shatteringly breaking news. As a Bernie 2016 and Bernie 2020 canvasser in the NYC area, I rarely ventured out to the suburbs so I rarely interacted with the white women demographic that voted for Trump (though the five boroughs certainly have their fair share of gentrified neighborhoods, of course, which is partly the subject of the article).

 

But I still don’t think the article is in opposition to my original stance, which is basically the following:

 

1. The overall white women demographic is choosing to prioritize personal economics over social justice issues.

2. Accusing them of “racial insensitivity” is fair game, especially regarding the issue of affordable housing options in suburbs.

3. Accusing them of outright “racism” is much more dubious and politically suicidal.

 

Maybe we’re more or less in agreement here? This topic is beginning to feel more tautological than substantive, so I shall retire to another thread on this lovely pre-Bills game afternoon…

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

5 hours ago, ComradeKayAdams said:

 

Why are you disappointed in me?? I was just being polite and open-minded and was giving Mr. Governor an opportunity to defend a very bold statement. His supporting evidence for the claim that white women are becoming more racist appears to be that more voted for Trump in 2020 than in 2016. Suffice to say, I remain unconvinced… And even if the claim is true, liberals should know by now that calling everyone a racist isn’t a productive political strategy (see: 2016 presidential election, Hillary campaign, “deplorables” comment).

 

While politicians alone won’t “solve” racism (empathic dialogue and social desegregation are essential components too), my contention is that they can still do a lot to alleviate the problem by delivering on domestic economic policies which have overwhelming support from the electorate (such as most of the stuff that is being gutted from the BBB bill…). Why? Because American history is loaded with examples indicating a strong causal relationship between economic anxiety and racial tension.

I’m disappointed because while I disagree with most of your political positions, it seems to me that you’re articulate, passionate and quite obviously well-read.  Yet, you chose not to call him out on his condescending commentary and bigotry.  Had someone asked me prior to today if CKA would have politely demurred to such comments, I’d have bet that you would not.   
 

But maybe it’s acceptable because women historically have not had to fight, struggle and suffer to be heard.  Perhaps a little honey is for the best. It’s worked for the suffragettes, right?  
 

 

[LeviF]

Aside from the fact that the "racism" canard only affects you if you give a ***** about being called a racist, if you interact with any white folks in real life you learn quickly that "whites" is an internally diverse majority group.  They have no sense of solidarity as a whole because, among other things, their loyalties are sifted finer than major race categories.

[Big Blitz]

Starting at the 1:30 mark pure gold...

 

Love Stetler's condescending "hmm.......hmm."

 

 

"Sometime around 2015 White liberals starting to have more extreme views on race then even people of color...."

 

 

 

She asks "In my book I explore the question where did that and this "wokeness" come from?

 

 

 

 

I'll spare you the research:

 

[Doc]

I always hated the term "woke."  It's like it was invented by a 5-year old.  "Mommy, I woke."

[B-Man]

 

 

 

DAVID CATRON: The Kamikaze Party. 

 

“The Democrats respond to last week’s defeat with a series of futile suicide missions.”

 

Such ominous data, combined with last Tuesday’s rebuke by the voters, signal that the Democrats are in real trouble and members of the party are sounding the alarm. The New York Times quotes Rep. Abigail Spanberger (D-Va.) thus: “We were so willing to take seriously a global pandemic, but we’re not willing to say, ‘Yeah, inflation is a problem, and supply chain is a problem, and we don’t have enough workers in our work force.’” Yet party leaders like House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) aren’t listening. She still intends to push passage of the Build Back Better (BBB) social spending and climate bill that only 34 percent of the voters favor, according to the latest Emerson poll.

 

Pelosi, President Biden and other prominent Democrats have made it clear since last Tuesday’s debacle that they believe it was caused by their failure to pass this fiscally irresponsible legislation. As the editors of the New Hampshire Union Leader put it, “Biden, Nancy Pelosi and company were convinced that gifting the people with billions and billions of dollars of their own money and massive debt would have bought enough votes to push their gubernatorial candidate to victory.”

 

But the Emerson poll is by no means the only poll that says precisely the opposite. An ABC News-Ipsos poll released two days before Election Day found that the majority of voters were not sold on BBB.

 

 

Read the whole thing.

https://spectator.org/the-kamikaze-party/

 

 

[Chef Jim]

8 hours ago, Doc said:

I always hated the term "woke."  It's like it was invented by a 5-year old.  "Mommy, I woke."

 

No it was invented by the same person who invented the term "my bad".  🙄

[unbillievable]

3 hours ago, Chef Jim said:

No it was invented by the same person who invented the term "my bad".  🙄

 

11 hours ago, Doc said:

I always hated the term "woke."  It's like it was invented by a 5-year old.  "Mommy, I woke."

 

I feel the same way about "based."

I looked it up and no one knows the meaning. It's also hard to figure out in context because everyone uses it differently.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

On 11/7/2021 at 12:38 PM, ComradeKayAdams said:

 

Thank you for the article, Mr. Governor. Yes, I’m familiar with the content and you are correct that it’s not earth-shatteringly breaking news. As a Bernie 2016 and Bernie 2020 canvasser in the NYC area, I rarely ventured out to the suburbs so I rarely interacted with the white women demographic that voted for Trump (though the five boroughs certainly have their fair share of gentrified neighborhoods, of course, which is partly the subject of the article).

 

But I still don’t think the article is in opposition to my original stance, which is basically the following:

 

1. The overall white women demographic is choosing to prioritize personal economics over social justice issues.

2. Accusing them of “racial insensitivity” is fair game, especially regarding the issue of affordable housing options in suburbs.

3. Accusing them of outright “racism” is much more dubious and politically suicidal.

 

Maybe we’re more or less in agreement here? This topic is beginning to feel more tautological than substantive, so I shall retire to another thread on this lovely pre-Bills game afternoon…

number 3 in not only dubious it’s a lazy conclusion.  
 

Regarding number 2, people want to protect their assets. Hone values don’t benefit from “affordable housing projects”.  To prove this, go find an affluent predominantly black neighborhood, of which there are plenty across the country, and investigate scenarios where such housing project proposals were received. 
 

“not in my backyard” isn’t a social sentiment It’s an economic one equally applied to factories, Amazon warehouses, highways, etc. 

 

i mean the last neighborhood I lived in, which I was not politically involved in aside from paying the dues, 

spent considerable legal resources resisting an elderly home project. Was it because they were ageists?

Edited November 10, 2021 by Over 29 years of fanhood

[ComradeKayAdams]

On 11/7/2021 at 5:07 PM, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

I’m disappointed because while I disagree with most of your political positions, it seems to me that you’re articulate, passionate and quite obviously well-read.  Yet, you chose not to call him out on his condescending commentary and bigotry.  Had someone asked me prior to today if CKA would have politely demurred to such comments, I’d have bet that you would not.   
 

But maybe it’s acceptable because women historically have not had to fight, struggle and suffer to be heard.  Perhaps a little honey is for the best. It’s worked for the suffragettes, right?

 

Us vegans don’t consume honey, Leh-nerd.

 

Thank you for the compliments, but I do think you’re making this a bigger deal than it needs to be. I believe the Governor and I reached a point of mutual understanding over his contentious remarks, and I believe that we would have never reached that point had I not demurred politely.

 

For the past five years, I have been among the most vociferous critics toward the “Trump voter = racist” accusations because they lack nuance and a basic willingness to understand conservative, libertarian, and populist nationalist values. I have done so even as it has been enormously unpopular and alienating within left-leaning social circles in my personal life. So I don’t feel any special added obligation to do the same on a right-wing internet forum read by two or three dozen other right-wing people. You guys are normally pretty good and quick at taking on that responsibility!

 

Is it the “white female” component that has you especially annoyed with me? You are disappointed that I did not exhibit any special solidarity with “my people?” Sure, I suppose the Governor’s sweeping generalization could be construed as offensive to our delicate sensibilities. In the broader spectrum of life’s tribulations, however, it does not pose an existential crisis to our rights and to our dignities as Americans. Us twenty-first century white chicks are going to be okay! We’re gonna make it after all! And perhaps challenges to be a little more self-reflective on how our political choices impact the world around us should be encouraged, no?

 

But if we are now in the business of confronting every instance of condescending commentary and bigotry in this absolute hellhole of a subforum, I have a VERY long list for you guys. Oh wherever shall I begin?? For starters, how about all the verbal abuse here that routinely gets directed at the transgendered community??

 

Actually…you know what? It’s been a rough few days for all of Bills Mafia. Let us reserve the therapeutic vituperation for Daboll, Bobby Johnson, Sugar High Josh, Cody Ford, etc… Do you need a hug, Leh-nerd? I know I could sure use one. Here, Leh-ny, let me give you a hug….

 

Narrator (to be read using a Brian “Baldy” Baldinger voice-over…I find his voice very calming): “ComradeKayAdams leans toward her laptop, wraps her arms around the screen, and gives a gentle squeeze. She closes her eyes and smiles, knowing the Jets are next up on the schedule. Kay reasons that a healthy Knox and a greater commitment to the run game out of spread formations should fix a lot of the offense’s problems. Furthermore, Kay knows that Frazier’s cover 3 zone defense has remained sensational all season, aside from that one Derrick Henry run. Kay often tells lies to herself in order to get through the week.”

 

3 hours ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

number 3 in not only dubious it’s a lazy conclusion.  
 

Regarding number 2, people want to protect their assets. Hone values don’t benefit from “affordable housing projects”.  To prove this, go find an affluent predominantly black neighborhood, of which there are plenty across the country, and investigate scenarios where such housing project proposals were received. 
 

“not in my backyard” isn’t a social sentiment It’s an economic one equally applied to factories, Amazon warehouses, highways, etc. 

 

i mean the last neighborhood I lived in, which I was not politically involved in aside from paying the dues, 

spent considerable legal resources resisting an elderly home project. Was it because they were ageists?

 

On point #2: No doubt, but prioritizing personal finances over affordable housing issues that disproportionately affect minorities is what I mean by “racial insensitivity.” In various situations, yes, this may instead manifest itself as “socioeconomic class insensitivity” or “elderly insensitivity.” It would be preferable if these suburban Trump-supporting “keeping-up-with-the-Joneses” white women supported candidates who also offered viable alternative housing policies for others less fortunate than them. But alas, the binary American political system normally only offers non-ideal choices. So I understand that people’s motivations behind their voting decisions are complex. I therefore try to temper my judgment a little.

 

EDIT: spelling mistake.

Edited November 10, 2021 by ComradeKayAdams

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

35 minutes ago, ComradeKayAdams said:

 

Us vegans don’t consume honey, Leh-nerd.

 

Thank you for the compliments, but I do think you’re making this a bigger deal than it needs to be. I believe the Governor and I reached a point of mutual understanding over his contentious remarks, and I believe that we would have never reached that point had I not demurred politely.

 

For the past five years, I have been among the most vociferous critics toward the “Trump voter = racist” accusations because they lack nuance and a basic willingness to understand conservative, libertarian, and populist nationalist values. I have done so even as it has been enormously unpopular and alienating within left-leaning social circles in my personal life. So I don’t feel any special added obligation to do the same on a right-wing internet forum read by two or three dozen other right-wing people. You guys are normally pretty good and quick at taking on that responsibility!

 

Is it the “white female” component that has you especially annoyed with me? You are disappointed that I did not exhibit any special solidarity with “my people?” Sure, I suppose the Governor’s sweeping generalization could be construed as offensive to our delicate sensibilities. In the broader spectrum of life’s tribulations, however, it does not pose an existential crisis to our rights and to our dignities as Americans. Us twenty-first century white chicks are going to be okay! We’re gonna make it after all! And perhaps challenges to be a little more self-reflective on how our political choices impact the world around us should be encouraged, no?

 

But if we are now in the business of confronting every instance of condescending commentary and bigotry in this absolute hellhole of a subforum, I have a VERY long list for you guys. Oh wherever shall I begin?? For starters, how about all the verbal abuse here that routinely gets directed at the transgendered community??

 

Actually…you know what? It’s been a rough few days for all of Bills Mafia. Let us reserve the therapeutic vituperation for Daboll, Bobby Johnson, Sugar High Josh, Cody Ford, etc… Do you need a hug, Leh-nerd? I know I could sure use one. Here, Leh-ny, let me give you a hug….

 

Narrator (to be read using a Brian “Baldy” Baldinger voice-over…I find his voice very calming): “ComradeKayAdams leans toward her laptop, wraps her arms around the screen, and gives a gentle squeeze. She closes her eyes and smiles, knowing the Jets are next up on the schedule. Kay reasons that a healthy Knox and a greater commitment to the run game out of spread formations should fix a lot of the offense’s problems. Furthermore, Kay knows that Frazier’s cover 3 zone defense has remained sensational all season, aside from that one Derrick Henry run. Kay often tells lies to herself in order to get through the week.”

 

 

On point #2: No doubt, but prioritizing personal finances over affordable housing issues that disproportionately affect minorities is what I mean by “racial insensitivity.” In various situations, yes, this may instead manifest itself as “socioeconomic class insensitivity” or “elderly insensitivity.” It would be preferable if these suburban Trump-supporting “keeping-up-with-the-Joneses” white women supported candidates who also offered viable alternative housing policies for others less fortunate than them. But alas, the binary American political system normally only offers non-ideal choices. So I understand that people’s motivations behind their voting decisions are complex. I therefore try to temper my judgment a little.

 

EDIT: spelling mistake.

The proportionality racist argument has always been a red herring. The majority of people in poverty are white non Hispanic, twice as many as other racial groups. 
 

so to generalize, if you don’t want to subsidize the impoverished, the largest percentage of that group are white non Hispanics. What’s so racist about that?? Sounds like a straw man argument. 
 

So maybe the real topic here is how much do those who have earned and work hard for a living for themselves and their families owe to those who don’t. 
 

Maybe it needs to be work ethic disparity  insensitivity? 
 

or “poor decision maker” insensitivity? 
 

Or “effort”ism  maybe? 

Edited November 10, 2021 by Over 29 years of fanhood

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

On 11/8/2021 at 8:16 PM, Big Blitz said:

Starting at the 1:30 mark pure gold...

 

Love Stetler's condescending "hmm.......hmm."

 

 

"Sometime around 2015 White liberals starting to have more extreme views on race then even people of color...."

 

 

 

She asks "In my book I explore the question where did that and this "wokeness" come from?

 

 

 

 

I'll spare you the research:

 

Great post. She had excellent insight

[Governor]

Why do you think Trump’s campaign manager directed Donald to say these remarks when it was clear he was behind and needed a hail Mary to squeeze a few points out of the suburbs? Why did they think that would work?

 

No president in history spent as much time with his pollsters each day. This all shows up in the polling. So what did he do? Well, he tried to scare them. Why would they think that would scare them?

 

https://www.cnsnews.com/article/national/cnsnewscom-staff/president-trump-suburban-women-i-saved-your-damn-neighborhood

 

Now, there were a few things wrong with this strategy.

 

1. The suburbs aren’t very white anymore.

 

2. Most voters were done with the guy 6 months into his term. It was too late. There were no undecided voters left to sway.

 

3. White women voters were already with him. They didn’t need to be reminded that a vote for Biden meant brown people would kick their door in and drag them out by their hair and kill their husbands and children.

Edited November 13, 2021 by Governor