2017 Re-Draft - What would you do?

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

3 hours ago, Bill from NYC said:

The trade turned out well, and this is a great thing. The odds of it turning out so well were poor and imo the success of the trade was random, not planned. Trading away from a HOF QB at 10 all the way down to 27 to draft a corner (however good) is not a strategy that is going to win you lots of football games.

 

Front office also had no idea they would trade away from a HOF QB at 10 though too. Nobody really knew what Mahomes would be. Same thing with Allen.

[NewEra]

I’ll take Josh every day of the week.  
 

We MAY have won a super bowl with Mahomes last season but that tampa DL likely would have had their way with our OL and the result would have been similar to KC.

 

I don’t feel that our TEAM was good enough in 18 or 19.  

I don’t think we have a SB if we drafted Mahomes.  
 

I’m extremely happy with the state of our team. Wouldn’t change a thing.  We’ll get ours

 

 

[corta765]

Question 3 is good, I said no, and this is my take:

 

Mahomes would've been successful in Buffalo, BUT the timeline of his development would've been similar to Allen's. He may have looked better year 1, but the 2018 Bills offense was garbage to the farthest extreme. By comparison the 2018 Chiefs which is Mahomes first true year at QB in KC (2017 I am not including in this exercise) he had a ready to run offense in terms of talent at skill positions and O-line. Literally he had to drive the ship and dear god did he ever drive that ship. Maybe the Bills are closer to the playoffs with Mahomes in 2018, but it still is a learning year.

 

I think the 2019 Bills with Mahomes take out Brady for the division, but remember how important Tre is for the secondary and also the fact Dion Dawkins was acquired with one of the picks we moved for also. The Bills defense without Tre probably is not as solid which puts pressure on the Mahomes led offense in 2019 to be dynamic. We didn't have Tyreek or Kelce, so while John Brown and Beasley are good players the offense is less dynamic. But who knows what that then means of the AFC with KC then, do they bring in Lamar or Josh? Do they try and trade for Kirk Cousins or Tannehill? The dominos really are fascinating. I have no problem saying the Bills are a step ahead in 2019 with Mahomes, but I think the AFC as a whole is more competitive then as KC's supernova type start with Mahomes 2018-2020 truly did dominate the landscape and wouldn't happen allowing more competition. Additionally the Bills themselves are stronger on offense on the outset but their D is weaker. Truthfully last years 2020 Bills squad was the best team in the AFC they just had KC in the way. This years team is more well rounded I think, but the competition is raised even with KC falling back to earth.

 

So I say no the Bills do not win a SB and if anything mimic this current squads journey especially as I think the AFC is just that much tighter instead. This would be my prediction for the Bills 2018-2020 with Mahomes:

 

2018: 8-8 . Offense is better as Mahomes out of the gate was more accurate then Allen, but lack of weapons sinks the season and the defense misses not having a #1 corner

2019: 11-5 division crown. NE goes down, but the Bills fall in the post season and Baltimore or Houston goes to the SB

2020: 12-4 division crown again. Post-season I think Bills have 25% chance at SB, but the talent in the AFC makes it all a coin flip at this point and it just isn't our turn.

[Royale with Cheese]

Allen and White.

 

Mahomes got out of the gate faster than Allen but I truly think Allen will continue to surpass Mahomes in their careers.  

[hondo in seattle]

I would have answered differently last year.  

 

But right now Josh is playing better than Mahomes.   Who knows how these guys act off camera but I suspect Allen is the better leader, too. 

[atlbillsfan1975]

14 minutes ago, hondo in seattle said:

I would have answered differently last year.  

 

But right now Josh is playing better than Mahomes.   Who knows how these guys act off camera but I suspect Allen is the better leader, too. 

100%. The Chiefs right now need some leaders to step up. Watching that sideline yesterday and against the Bills, the Chiefs looked like Mike Tyson after the Buster Douglas fight. 

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

If I pick Mahomes, do I have to take his brother too?

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

12 hours ago, Ethan in Portland said:

I love Allen but think of all the other picks and players they could have had if they just stayed at 10 in 2017 and taken Mahommes. 

 

What picks?  They wouldn't have got the picks they did from KC.  They also traded a tackle to the Bengals (Can't recall his name) which allowed them to move up in 1st round of draft.  Likely if they had drafted a QB, they wouldn't have wanted to trade a lineman away so no better pick there either.  Doubt they'd have done little of any of the other maneuvering they did to collect picks if they already had a QB.  If anything may have traded them for vet players, but likely be in more cap trouble today if they had.

[YoloinOhio]

5 minutes ago, Miyagi-Do Karate said:

If I pick Mahomes, do I have to take his brother too?

And his fiancée and mom

[Dopey]

12 hours ago, BaaadThingsMan said:

Give me White and Allen every time.

 

Josh will prove out to be the better of the two when they are both retired. 

He'd better get started, then. He's way behind Mahomes. 

[BADOLBILZ]

1 hour ago, MJS said:

For me it isn't an argument that Allen is better than Mahomes. To me it's clear. Mahomes has had the greatest start to his career probably of all time. Dan Marino is in that conversation too. As of right now, Mahomes is the top QB in the league. What he has done is amazing.

 

But he was also put onto a team with talent ready to win right away, with a great coach. The Bills were largely devoid of talent, especially the skill positions.

 

So when would Mahomes have won a Superbowl with the Bills? Not last year. Mahomes got beat by the Bucs and Tom Brady. There's no reason to believe that he would have done better with the Bills in that game. 2019, maybe? But the Bills had only John Brown and Cole Beasley to throw to. Maybe he could have gotten it done, but the rest of the team wasn't ready to win a Superbowl, in my opinion. Mahomes would have gone nowhere in 2018 with the garbage talent the Bills had.

 

Also, I just like Josh Allen and Tre White and think the fit the team and the fan base really well. So no, I wouldn't trade them and I doubt that Mahomes would have won a Superbowl with the Bills by now.

 

 

Where people are confused is the notion that drafting Mahomes would have still resulted in the same moves made by the organization.      

 

McDermott.......and likely Beane, who knew he was going to be the GM.......had decided that offseason that Trubisky,  Mahomes and Watson weren't going to be as good as the stellar 2018 class of Darnold, Rosen, Allen and Jackson(Mayfield was a late riser).    So they planned to not take a QB.......take a willing step back in the name of culture while loading up on draft picks to trade up for their young QB.........so they didn't need guys like Bob Woods or Sammy Watkins in place.   They let one walk for what turned out to be a bargain deal for LA and they traded the other to LA........where they helped turn the Rams offense into a force.

 

If the Bills go into that offseason with the mindset that this Bills team should have won 12 games in each of the past two seasons.......that the young core of guys like Gilmore and Woods and Watkins/Darby must be maintained.......and that they were a stud QB and good coaching away from contention,  then everything changes.    Remember, nobody was saying the Bills were old or in cap hell until after that was used as an excuse for big roster changes.   

 

The idea that the Chiefs were much better set up than the Bills going into the 2017 offseason is incorrect.    The Chiefs were in a very similar position.........the teams were neck and neck since Marrone and Reid arrived in the jobs.   They played close games almost every year that swung their playoff destiny.    The narrative in KC when all they had was Tyreek Hill and Kelce (and even Kareem Hunt) was that they were very under-powered offensively.   One season under Reid they didn't have a single TD pass thrown to a WR!   Go back to Bills at Chiefs 2017 for reference on their offensive inconsistency and struggles.   

 

Mahomes changed all of that and his abilities elevated Hill and Kelce to much greater heights.   He would have elevated the talent in place in Buffalo too and they would have had A LOT more assets to acquire talent without all the trading up they had to do to acquire Allen.  Unless McDermott and Beane sucked at their jobs then success would have been inevitable.  

 

[SCBills]

I don't even need White in this equation.  I'm taking Allen over Mahomes, straight up.

 

It was debatable coming into this year, due to Mahomes success vs Allen's potential, but we're now entering Week 8 of the 2021 season and it's no longer debatable (IMO) ...

 

Allen >>> Mahomes

[Stank_Nasty]

18 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Where people are confused is the notion that drafting Mahomes would have still resulted in the same moves made by the organization.      

 

McDermott.......and likely Beane, who knew he was going to be the GM.......had decided that offseason that Trubisky,  Mahomes and Watson weren't going to be as good as the stellar 2018 class of Darnold, Rosen, Allen and Jackson(Mayfield was a late riser).    So they planned to not take a QB.......take a willing step back in the name of culture while loading up on draft picks to trade up for their young QB.........so they didn't need guys like Bob Woods or Sammy Watkins in place.   They let one walk for what turned out to be a bargain deal for LA and they traded the other to LA........where they helped turn the Rams offense into a force.

 

If the Bills go into that offseason with the mindset that this Bills team should have won 12 games in each of the past two seasons.......that the young core of guys like Gilmore and Woods and Watkins/Darby must be maintained.......and that they were a stud QB and good coaching away from contention,  then everything changes.    Remember, nobody was saying the Bills were old or in cap hell until after that was used as an excuse for big roster changes.   

 

The idea that the Chiefs were much better set up than the Bills going into the 2017 offseason is incorrect.    The Chiefs were in a very similar position.........the teams were neck and neck since Marrone and Reid arrived in the jobs.   They played close games almost every year that swung their playoff destiny.    The narrative in KC when all they had was Tyreek Hill and Kelce (and even Kareem Hunt) was that they were very under-powered offensively.   One season under Reid they didn't have a single TD pass thrown to a WR!   Go back to Bills at Chiefs 2017 for reference on their offensive inconsistency and struggles.   

 

Mahomes changed all of that and his abilities elevated Hill and Kelce to much greater heights.   He would have elevated the talent in place in Buffalo too and they would have had A LOT more assets to acquire talent without all the trading up they had to do to acquire Allen.  Unless McDermott and Beane sucked at their jobs then success would have been inevitable.  

 

The 2017 Chiefs were 6th in points scored and 5th in yards. Hunt led the league in rushing at 1300+. Hill was a Probowl 1200 yd wr. Kelce was a 1000 yd probowl TE.... Mahomes absolutely stepped into it... He's also an awesome QB.

Edited October 25, 2021 by Stank_Nasty

[Solomon Grundy]

4 hours ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said:

Pegulas put their foot down: Can't afford Rob's snacks bill.

Not Rex and the feet again 🤦🏽‍♂️

[LeGOATski]

Different teams with different philosophies, so I don't think Mahomes has the same success here.

 

Side note: His family don't seem like "process" people. I bet they would be acting even worse if their son was struggling on the Bills.

[YoloinOhio]

Speaking of Rex, I saw an interview with Ed Reed today and I somehow had completely blocked out of my memory that he coached for the Bills that one year 😂

[Cruiserplayer]

Oh the extra assets we would’ve had if we would have traded with the Texans instead. 

[Captain Hindsight]

9 hours ago, cage said:

 

The article I was referring to seemed to indicate that Whaley/Monos were kind of dismissive of Pegula's input on picking Mahomes.  Maybe if they were on the "same page" with him and believed he should be the pick at #10, that would have all played differently?  That's not a one day pick, but a three month process leading up to the draft.  Maybe that's why he was ready to can them right after the draft??

 

I read this article, I think they were ok with picking Mahommes but thought he would last longer. If he was there at 27, I think he would have been a Bill. Pegula didnt want to overstep McDermott, who was basically running the draft at that point

[ToGoGo]

15 hours ago, Stank_Nasty said:

Mahomes ain’t passing for 50 tds throwing to Kelvin “the chest freezer” benjiman and Andre “special teams ace” Holmes. And he ain’t winning a Super Bowl in 2019 with brown and Beasley as his top wr’s. The dude was thrust into a PERFECT situation and, to his credit, he capitalized on it. The shine is wearing off and the prayer heaves are getting picked. 

 

If he never gets back to where he was a few years ago, his closest comp becomes Kurt Warner. A very, very well-paid Kurt Warner. 

[Da webster guy]

I was surprised by the results. 

 

Mahomes is an MVP and superbowl champ barely in his prime and look at the Bills faithful saying we'd rather have Josh and Tre White.   Pretty cool.

 

I know the Chiefs sure could use Tredavious right about now, and from the looks of it yesterday, so could the Ravens.

 

You forgot the 4th option in the survey though:   If you were the Bengals, would you rather A) stay put and draft John Ross  or B) draft Mahomes ?  Here's a hint, Ross now plays for the Giants and his career total yardage is less than Bease had last year alone.