Taylor Heinicke TD Ruled No TD! Why?

[Never NEVER Give-up]

Is it me?  Have the rules changed?

Earlier today, Heinicke ran in for a TD, diving at about the 2 yard line; the ball was at the half-yard line when his knee was down, but no one touched him (no down by contact), and he slid into the end zone - - TD!!  Nope!

I thought when a QB slides or any player for that matter, they are giving themselves up and ruled down where they started their slide - OK - fair rule.

However when a QB or player dives, it's where the ball is when the runner is down (if they are going down due to contact).  If there is no contact, I thought they were down once they were touched or if they enter the end zone - TD!

What's the rule?  Was there a rule change? (and it seems not fair)

BTW on the next play, the QB sneak when he fumbles, regains the ball and extends it over the goal line, THAT also should have been a TD, but they said no again.  I don't think he was ever "down", I think he was on top of bodies.  Because he lost the ball, it cannot be said his forward progress stopped.  He regained possession and extended it into the end zone.  Please let me know your thoughts on this one too.

[Warcodered]

They are stricter on the QBs giving themselves up it's cost us some yards here and there.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

12 minutes ago, Never NEVER Give-up said:

Is it me?  Have the rules changed?

Earlier today, Heinicke ran in for a TD, diving at about the 2 yard line; the ball was at the half-yard line when his knee was down, but no one touched him (no down by contact), and he slid into the end zone - - TD!!  Nope!

I thought when a QB slides or any player for that matter, they are giving themselves up and ruled down where they started their slide - OK - fair rule.

However when a QB or player dives, it's where the ball is when the runner is down (if they are going down due to contact).  If there is no contact, I thought they were down once they were touched or if they enter the end zone - TD!

What's the rule?  Was there a rule change? (and it seems not fair)

BTW on the next play, the QB sneak when he fumbles, regains the ball and extends it over the goal line, THAT also should have been a TD, but they said no again.  I don't think he was ever "down", I think he was on top of bodies.  Because he lost the ball, it cannot be said his forward progress stopped.  He regained possession and extended it into the end zone.  Please let me know your thoughts on this one too.

 

I think the rule change you’re looking for is explained here:

 

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2018/08/04/nfl-rules-will-now-treat-head-first-dives-like-feet-first-slides/

[pennstate10]

4 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I think the rule change you’re looking for is explained here:

 

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2018/08/04/nfl-rules-will-now-treat-head-first-dives-like-feet-first-slides/

Its a stupid rule.

Guaranteed to be modified in the offseason.

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

This was a bad interpretation of the new rule. I think they are trying to basically say a head first slide is the same as a feet first slide. 
 

He is clearly not sliding— he is diving for the endzone. To the OP’s point, if this is called a “slide”/giving yourself up, then Lamar Jackson diving forward into the endzone for a somersault should not be a TD. 

 

[Saint Doug]

Anyone have the video?

[Mikie2times]

I don't know if you watched to full game, but the officiating was pretty bad. At one point they ruled Green Bay recovered a fumble when it was clear it was recovered by Washington. They got it right, but In my entire history of watching football I don't remember a time a fumble recovery was prematurely called. They always let them play and who has the ball in the end gets the ball. Green Bay never came close to controlling the ball and they ruled it that way before the play was over. Weird stuff.   

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

6 minutes ago, Saint Doug said:

Anyone have the video?

 

 

[zow2]

Heinicke’s knee touched just before ball crossed the goaline. That killed the play. He should’ve just stayed in on his feet and ran to the pylon, easy TD….OR he could’ve dove in headfirst before touching his knee. 

He’s been criticized for absorbing too much contact and was just trying to play it safe and not get hit. I guarantee he will never do that again.

[Never NEVER Give-up]

27 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I think the rule change you’re looking for is explained here:

 

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2018/08/04/nfl-rules-will-now-treat-head-first-dives-like-feet-first-slides/

Thank you!

That's insane!!  How do they decipher between dives, QB sneaks, lunging for an extra yard, leaps over the pile, etc.?  They're outsmarting themselves!

[1ManRaid]

Weird, not many objected to the rule when it saved a Josh Allen fumble for a touchback when he dove for the goal line last year (I think)...

[djp14150]

54 minutes ago, Never NEVER Give-up said:

Is it me?  Have the rules changed?

Earlier today, Heinicke ran in for a TD, diving at about the 2 yard line; the ball was at the half-yard line when his knee was down, but no one touched him (no down by contact), and he slid into the end zone - - TD!!  Nope!

I thought when a QB slides or any player for that matter, they are giving themselves up and ruled down where they started their slide - OK - fair rule.

However when a QB or player dives, it's where the ball is when the runner is down (if they are going down due to contact).  If there is no contact, I thought they were down once they were touched or if they enter the end zone - TD!

What's the rule?  Was there a rule change? (and it seems not fair)

BTW on the next play, the QB sneak when he fumbles, regains the ball and extends it over the goal line, THAT also should have been a TD, but they said no again.  I don't think he was ever "down", I think he was on top of bodies.  Because he lost the ball, it cannot be said his forward progress stopped.  He regained possession and extended it into the end zone.  Please let me know your thoughts on this one too.

 

rule change

 

dives are giving themselves up because some QBs in a foot slide didn’t want knee injuries.

 

Josh lost a TDearlier this season because of this rule.

 

personally I don’t like it. Especially when QB running out of the pocket is a RB. Dives forward for goalie or first down markers shouldn’t be viewed as giving themselves up.

[LeGOATski]

1 hour ago, Never NEVER Give-up said:

Thank you!

That's insane!!  How do they decipher between dives, QB sneaks, lunging for an extra yard, leaps over the pile, etc.?  They're outsmarting themselves!

It's not insane, it's grey area by design.

 

The NFL makes it's home in the grey area.

[Rochesterfan]

1 hour ago, pennstate10 said:

Its a stupid rule.

Guaranteed to be modified in the offseason.

 

I doubt it will be changed.  It was requested because some QBs - especially wearing knee braces - have been hurt sliding because the brace catches.  Therefore they preferred to dive forward, but without this protection - they can get drilled.

 

The NFL then came out and created a rule to help protect QBs and basically any dive or slide is considered “giving themselves up” and they are down and can not be drilled by a defender.

 

QBs have to know the rule and be smart.  In this case he wasn’t and the outcome was correctly called. 
 

It is a good rule if QBs are your livelihood and protecting them makes sense.

 

 

Edited October 25, 2021 by Rochesterfan

[Big Turk]

Yes the rules have changed. Diving forward is the same as sliding, in that it's considered giving yourself up as a QB. The ball comes back to where the dive initiated from.

 

Stupid rule but the correct call based on it.

[Ya Digg?]

So then not to bring up old stuff (but to completely bring up old stuff) didn’t heinicke do the same thing when he scored against the Bills? I get they are trying to protect the QB, but shouldn’t the action happening around the QB come into effect? The closest defender wasn’t that close 
 

 

edit: to be clear, I actually think in both instances they are touchdowns, just pointing out he made the same play against the Bills. 

Edited October 25, 2021 by Ya Digg?

[pennstate10]

1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I think the rule change you’re looking for is explained here:

 

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2018/08/04/nfl-rules-will-now-treat-head-first-dives-like-feet-first-slides/

 

17 minutes ago, Rochesterfan said:

 

I doubt it will be changed.  It was requested because some QBs - especially wearing knee braces - have been hurt sliding because the brace catches.  Therefore they preferred to dive forward, but without this protection - they can get drilled.

 

The NFL then came out and created a rule to help protect QBs and basically any dive or slide is considered “giving themselves up” and they are down and can not be drilled by a defender.

 

QBs have to know the rule and be smart.  In this case he wasn’t and the outcome was correctly called. 
 

It is a good rule if QBs are your livelihood and protecting them makes sense.

 

 

We'll see what happens.

 

If a QB is diving for the end zone, its pretty clear he's not "giving himself up".

 

And the refs shouldnt be put in the position of being mind readers.

 

I understand some QBs may not be skilled sliders.  Maybe they should practice sliding.

 

I stand by what i said.

 

Rule will be changed.  Headfirst = not giving yourself up.  Sliding = giving yourself up.

[Rochesterfan]

2 minutes ago, pennstate10 said:

 

We'll see what happens.

 

If a QB is diving for the end zone, its pretty clear he's not "giving himself up".

 

And the refs shouldnt be put in the position of being mind readers.

 

I understand some QBs may not be skilled sliders.  Maybe they should practice sliding.

 

I stand by what i said.

 

Rule will be changed.  Headfirst = not giving yourself up.  Sliding = giving yourself up.

 

Ok - we will see.  Good Luck with that since it was a requested change - I would not hold my breath as an injury to a QB is worse than an additional 0.5 yard.

 

QB safety first.

[Big C]

He didn’t fully extended the ball; instead he kinda tucked it back in as he was going down. So I think the interpretation of the rule was fair here. He didn’t need to get conservative; it was an easy TD. I mean it was still an easy TD so they didn’t need to be a stickler but that is the rule.

[DrPJax]

2 hours ago, pennstate10 said:

Its a stupid rule.

Guaranteed to be modified in the offseason.

Yep, that article was from 2018, and I can’t believe that’s being called consistently. For example when Josh dove for the possible first down against the titans, that would mean the ball would have been spotted where he started the dive and not where it was spotted where he landed.   What if he had attempted to dive over the pile on 4 th , by that rule the ball would be spotted behind the line!  Another example of the nfl trying to legislate too much and By doing so it ends up creating subjectivity into the calls more and more.with resulting inconsistency.   Also If a player fumbles forward like you described I am pretty sure if that player recovers they are the only one who can still advance the ball and so a td would be possible.  Sounds like more terrible refs influencing outcomes and it’s getting intolerable. No also dove for a first down head first tonight on 2 nd and 15 and he dove for the last 2 yards on a 17 yd run, so the rule of it still exists is not being uniformly enforced.  I don’t see how it could as it goes against all of prior tradition in football fighting and diving for tds or first downs.  If this officiating keeps being this bad sooner or later the NFL will lose a big class action suit by a fan base whose team lost and they will have a ton of film to support prior things not being called in a similar fashion.  Imagine a call like that in a super bowl deciding the outcome!   That’s a Billsy thing to happen!  😀