That was a BAD loss

[Brianmoorman4jesus]

The real issue last night was we didn’t make a stop for the last hour and a half. We kept getting the lead back and just never held it.

[teef]

jesus herbert christ.  

[What a Tuel]

Just now, Big Turk said:

 

Nobody is diving by intentionally having their back plant foot slide back like that. Allen admitted postgame he lost his footing there. But I guess he is now lying.

 

Notice he now angles right. Plan was to go left. LT doesn't do his job. Josh Allen tries to adjust and goes right on a blown play and slides yes. There is no point in saying he "slipped" as if the play would have worked if he just hadn't slipped. It was already blown.

[Buffalo03]

We're gonna be fine. We should be 9-2 going into Tampa. The Titans will lose another game or 2 by then 

[JGMcD2]

7 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

The funny part is this was the first time that Henry really got rolling against us...the other 3 games he was held in check...with a much worse run D

It was really just that one big run… that’s all it ever takes with him. If he gets one it changes everything. 
 

The worst part is that one should have been called back. They were holding all game and it felt like nothing was called. The hold was akin to the one they called against Sanders on the Knox running TD. 
 

Very frustrating. 

[MJS]

Before the season if you would have asked me how I'd feel coming out of the Chiefs and Titans 1-1, I'd take it. Ideally you beat both of them, but you can't win them all.

 

This will be a good wake up call for the team. They have a lot of great film to review and will be able to identify some issues to clean up and some personnel that isn't getting the job done.

[BADOLBILZ]

 

They should have played better and won.........the Bills are the better team........but that wasn't a bad loss...........it was one of just 3 road games on the entire schedule that looked like it would require an "A" effort to win.

 

The Pittsburgh game was a BAD loss........they had no business winning in Buffalo.

[JGMcD2]

3 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

They should have played better and won.........the Bills are the better team........but that wasn't a bad loss...........it was one of just 3 road games on the entire schedule that looked like it would require an "A" effort to win.

 

The Pittsburgh game was a BAD loss........they had no business winning in Buffalo.

I kind of love when we agree. 
 

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

1 hour ago, RyanC883 said:

Now, this is not a "cancel the season," "Josh sucks," "fire this person or that person" thread.  What this is, is an acknowledgement that the loss last night was bad, and totally unacceptable for a team that is a super bowl contender.  The Bills are now 1-2 against teams with a record of .500 or greater, in large part due to the issues we saw on display last night.  Elite teams win last night.  The Bills, I think, are elite, they should have won.   More details below, in no particular order!.   Ideas on how to fix the below?  Disagree?  Let's discuss.  

 

1.  Offensive Line:  This was an abysmal performance.  F grade.  The poor OL play was the root cause, IMO, of most of this teams issues last night.  We couldn't get Josh the time needed to hit passes against the WORST deep cover team in the NFL--that was also down to a backup CB and 3rd string CB.  Just totally unacceptable.  We need better pass blocking, either from technique or personnel.    The OL also failed to allow JA, a huge QB, the ability to gain ONE YARD twice.  I can't think of another team where this happens.  The Steelers and Pats** during their dominant years routinely made that play.  D's knew it was coming and couldn't stop it.  Oh, and JAs interception was due to a tipped ball, that's also on the OL as well as the RB who failed to bat the ball down and/or just tackle the guy before he could intercept it.  Fix:  I have no idea for this season other than either find someone at the trade deadline; or stop throwing the ball deep, which I hate to say, and go to more intermediate routes and an occasional deep ball.  

 

2.  DL:  Yes, I get Derrick Henry is a beast.  The DL was okay in controlling him for the most part, but it was totally blown open on Henry's long run, and failed to sack the most sacked QB in the league.  We have no dominate pass rusher AT ALL.  We were also down AJ and Basham, both of whom were inactive.  The Titans also lost Lewan during the game and his replacement I think played like under 20 snaps this year.  Still, no sacks.  Grade: F.  Fix: I think an improvement here comes from rotating the DL more often and including AJ and Basham; or finding someone at the trade deadline.  

 

3.  Secondary:  What, really?  Yeah.  They had 2 good WR's against them, but when they had to stop 3rd and longs they seemed to be routinely beat.  This is not something an elite secondary does.  Fix:  I think it's just an off day.  I'm not too concerned here, but it was a subpar performance last night.  

 

4.  Coaching:  This is a mixed bag.  I loved the aggressive going for it on 4th and 1.  As noted above, good/decent OLs provide space for that play.  Our defense was abysmal all night.   The issues I have here are those noted above: (1) why was AJ and Basham inactive; (2) why was Milano in over Klien, who can pressure a QB on 3rd and long and is likely better against Henry; (3) why can't Daboll (I know his Grandfather who raised him died, and I feel awful picking on him, but this was a season long issue here) figure out the red zone offense?   And Frazier is just, really, outmatched again.  At some point you need to mix up what you are doing and send pressure and stop being so freaking predictable.  Finally, the most maddening thing from coaching last night is you have 2-3 all-pro WRs, against a backup and 3rd string cornerback, and you don't attack them all game with passes at all levels of the field.  Stop taking the deep shots against them all the time.  Drive it down 5-15 yards at a time.  Tire them out, esp. with the OL incapable of blocking anyone.  Fix:  McD has changed his style from ultra-conservative to more aggressive, and overall it's worked.  The OC and DC have MAJOR issues they need to work on, and if not fixed, perhaps replacements need to come in during the offseason.  We are wasting elite QB and WR talent here, and the OL, while not great personnel wise, had a total clunker.  

 

5.  Josh:  ha, had to put this in here.  He was good last night.  Not the reason we lost.  Yeah, he missed seeing some open WR's, but he was also trying to avoid getting sacked and taking a negative play.  His one interception was courtesy of the OL letting a DL tip the pass.  Fix:  I guess more awareness to look down the field when running for your life?  Also, don't trust your OL.  I know you love them, but if you have to QB sneak again, do NOT go to the left.  Audible out of it.  

 

6.  RB play.  Are running backs are backup level.  No DC is like, "oh, Singletary and/or Moss, how do we plan to stop them."  Here is how you stop them, catch them from behind if they rip off a 5 yard run.  They also can't catch, and on JA's interception, the RB needed to play CB, heck, tackle the guy before he catches it and take an offensive PI, better than a turnover.  Fix:  trade at trade deadline, use Bredia.  

 

7.  Conclusion:  I keep hearing, "we win this 8 or 9 out of 10 times."  Well, interesting, look at our record v. .500 or better teams this year, and the Titans the last two times.  That argument fails.  These above issues are fixable, but we need to stop playing poorly when it matters.  We get out played and out coached on the coordinator level.  It was simply a BAD loss.  When you have a top QB and WR combos and can't exploit backup CB's, it's terrible.  When you have the most sacked QB in the NFL and don't get a single sack, it's terrible.  When you can't convert 2 4th and 1's, it's terrible.  There are fixes, lets hope they happen. 

 

 

 

 

 

The running backs weren't the problem in this one.  Routinely getting hammered at the LOS or behind.  There's not much Henry could do behind the lines performance in this one.  

 

And regarding winning this most of the time?  I think they played really well, and we did not execute at times especially on defense.  The holding calls we got were justified - sanders, smith on TD plays.  They didn't get a holding on the 76 yard TD run where they definitely held several players.  Flip those calls and its probably a 2 score win.  

[Greg S]

3 minutes ago, Buffalo03 said:

We're gonna be fine. We should be 9-2 going into Tampa. The Titans will lose another game or 2 by then 

 

The Titans play at home vs the Chiefs this Sunday. If the Chiefs win there is your Titans loss. If the Titans win it buries the Chiefs even further back in the AFC playoff race.

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

9 minutes ago, What a Tuel said:

 

Notice he now angles right. Plan was to go left. LT doesn't do his job. Josh Allen tries to adjust and goes right on a blown play and slides yes. There is no point in saying he "slipped" as if the play would have worked if he just hadn't slipped. It was already blown.

 

Simmons was lined up fairly inside of dawkins shoulder at the snap.  I probably do a sweep or option play there to the left.  Even an RPO with the LB as the conflict - if he takes moss on the RPO you got diggs in man on a slant with a huge window.

[djp14150]

1 hour ago, Seoulofstone said:

So, what's a good loss?

 

1 They gave up 3 sacks. Our rookie playing only his 2nd start gave up a tough sack to a veteran player. You're spoiled if you think they were abysmal.

 

2 Agree that the DL had a bad day. Agree that one or both of Boogie AJ should have played. I think Jerry H is getting a bit of a free pass for past achievements.

 

3 secondary were excellent. You cross because the ball bounced off a helmet in a fluke or because of AJ Browns short crossers? That's not why they lost. Dont throw out the baby with the bathwater.

 

 4 I didn't see the coaching as an issue last night.

 

 5 Hard to blame Josh. His interception was caused by the pressure and Moss didn't react to help out. He scored 3TDs and threw for 350. Limp finish but it was one of those nights.

 

6 These Rbs are not special. They're merely made to look good in a great O. This isn't news to me.

 

7 That's an idiotic thing that fans say when they are buthurt at a loss. No basis in fact but you can read it on most fan forums  Lame. Take the loss it's only a game. Titans played better. Good for them.

 

on #3 I think OP flushed everything…

 

Tennessee is a good team who played up facing buffalo.

 

thus came down to a few places…

 

against D

1 the 48 yr 3td down pass that led to a SD

2. long TD run

 

on Off

 

1 early red zone drives getting FGs.

2. kick for the tie vs going for it.

 

Penalties

 

1 took away a TD for a FG

2. killed the KR

 

still tired…I was at the game sitting on the 4th q side at the first down marker on TV side.

 

 

[John from Riverside]

Feel better?

[Big Turk]

11 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

They should have played better and won.........the Bills are the better team........but that wasn't a bad loss...........it was one of just 3 road games on the entire schedule that looked like it would require an "A" effort to win.

 

The Pittsburgh game was a BAD loss........they had no business winning in Buffalo.

 

Kelly always said that it is really tough to go on the road and beat a good team, no matter what the advantages you may think you have are. The Super Bowl Bill teams had their share of "bad" road losses...usually in Arrowhead on Primetime if I remember, but they often did not play well in Primetime road games if I remember correctly.  Either way, it's one game in week 6.  I doubt any other team is going 11-0 from this point forward, so the Bills will have chances to make up wins and likely will since they have the easiest remaining schedule in the NFL.

1 hour ago, Seoulofstone said:

So, what's a good loss?

 

1 They gave up 3 sacks. Our rookie playing only his 2nd start gave up a tough sack to a veteran player. You're spoiled if you think they were abysmal.

 

2 Agree that the DL had a bad day. Agree that one or both of Boogie AJ should have played. I think Jerry H is getting a bit of a free pass for past achievements.

 

3 secondary were excellent. You cross because the ball bounced off a helmet in a fluke or because of AJ Browns short crossers? That's not why they lost. Dont throw out the baby with the bathwater.

 

 4 I didn't see the coaching as an issue last night.

 

 5 Hard to blame Josh. His interception was caused by the pressure and Moss didn't react to help out. He scored 3TDs and threw for 350. Limp finish but it was one of those nights.

 

6 These Rbs are not special. They're merely made to look good in a great O. This isn't news to me.

 

7 That's an idiotic thing that fans say when they are buthurt at a loss. No basis in fact but you can read it on most fan forums  Lame. Take the loss it's only a game. Titans played better. Good for them.

 

Moss actually strangely jumped too early or mistimed his jump which took him out of the play on the INT

Edited October 19, 2021 by Big Turk

[DCbillsfan]

I get it OP, you hate losing to the Titans.  Take a number and get in line.  Who doesn't?

 

This game went exactly how the Titans needed it to stay in the game.  The Bills were 2 for 5 in the red zone, Henry had a long TD run, the Bills turned it over deep in their zone which led to a TD.  Still they were 1 yard short of victory.

 

The OL is the weakness of this team.  They struggle against physical DLs.  Really can't do anything about it until the offseason.

[PromoTheRobot]

3 hours ago, RyanC883 said:

Now, this is not a "cancel the season," "Josh sucks," "fire this person or that person" thread.  What this is, is an acknowledgement that the loss last night was bad, and totally unacceptable for a team that is a super bowl contender.  The Bills are now 1-2 against teams with a record of .500 or greater, in large part due to the issues we saw on display last night.  Elite teams win last night.  The Bills, I think, are elite, they should have won.   More details below, in no particular order!.   Ideas on how to fix the below?  Disagree?  Let's discuss.  

 

1.  Offensive Line:  This was an abysmal performance.  F grade.  The poor OL play was the root cause, IMO, of most of this teams issues last night.  We couldn't get Josh the time needed to hit passes against the WORST deep cover team in the NFL--that was also down to a backup CB and 3rd string CB.  Just totally unacceptable.  We need better pass blocking, either from technique or personnel.    The OL also failed to allow JA, a huge QB, the ability to gain ONE YARD twice.  I can't think of another team where this happens.  The Steelers and Pats** during their dominant years routinely made that play.  D's knew it was coming and couldn't stop it.  Oh, and JAs interception was due to a tipped ball, that's also on the OL as well as the RB who failed to bat the ball down and/or just tackle the guy before he could intercept it.  Fix:  I have no idea for this season other than either find someone at the trade deadline; or stop throwing the ball deep, which I hate to say, and go to more intermediate routes and an occasional deep ball.  

 

2.  DL:  Yes, I get Derrick Henry is a beast.  The DL was okay in controlling him for the most part, but it was totally blown open on Henry's long run, and failed to sack the most sacked QB in the league.  We have no dominate pass rusher AT ALL.  We were also down AJ and Basham, both of whom were inactive.  The Titans also lost Lewan during the game and his replacement I think played like under 20 snaps this year.  Still, no sacks.  Grade: F.  Fix: I think an improvement here comes from rotating the DL more often and including AJ and Basham; or finding someone at the trade deadline.  

 

3.  Secondary:  What, really?  Yeah.  They had 2 good WR's against them, but when they had to stop 3rd and longs they seemed to be routinely beat.  This is not something an elite secondary does.  Fix:  I think it's just an off day.  I'm not too concerned here, but it was a subpar performance last night.  

 

4.  Coaching:  This is a mixed bag.  I loved the aggressive going for it on 4th and 1.  As noted above, good/decent OLs provide space for that play.  Our defense was abysmal all night.   The issues I have here are those noted above: (1) why was AJ and Basham inactive; (2) why was Milano in over Klien, who can pressure a QB on 3rd and long and is likely better against Henry; (3) why can't Daboll (I know his Grandfather who raised him died, and I feel awful picking on him, but this was a season long issue here) figure out the red zone offense?   And Frazier is just, really, outmatched again.  At some point you need to mix up what you are doing and send pressure and stop being so freaking predictable.  Finally, the most maddening thing from coaching last night is you have 2-3 all-pro WRs, against a backup and 3rd string cornerback, and you don't attack them all game with passes at all levels of the field.  Stop taking the deep shots against them all the time.  Drive it down 5-15 yards at a time.  Tire them out, esp. with the OL incapable of blocking anyone.  Fix:  McD has changed his style from ultra-conservative to more aggressive, and overall it's worked.  The OC and DC have MAJOR issues they need to work on, and if not fixed, perhaps replacements need to come in during the offseason.  We are wasting elite QB and WR talent here, and the OL, while not great personnel wise, had a total clunker.  

 

5.  Josh:  ha, had to put this in here.  He was good last night.  Not the reason we lost.  Yeah, he missed seeing some open WR's, but he was also trying to avoid getting sacked and taking a negative play.  His one interception was courtesy of the OL letting a DL tip the pass.  Fix:  I guess more awareness to look down the field when running for your life?  Also, don't trust your OL.  I know you love them, but if you have to QB sneak again, do NOT go to the left.  Audible out of it.  

 

6.  RB play.  Are running backs are backup level.  No DC is like, "oh, Singletary and/or Moss, how do we plan to stop them."  Here is how you stop them, catch them from behind if they rip off a 5 yard run.  They also can't catch, and on JA's interception, the RB needed to play CB, heck, tackle the guy before he catches it and take an offensive PI, better than a turnover.  Fix:  trade at trade deadline, use Bredia.  

 

7.  Conclusion:  I keep hearing, "we win this 8 or 9 out of 10 times."  Well, interesting, look at our record v. .500 or better teams this year, and the Titans the last two times.  That argument fails.  These above issues are fixable, but we need to stop playing poorly when it matters.  We get out played and out coached on the coordinator level.  It was simply a BAD loss.  When you have a top QB and WR combos and can't exploit backup CB's, it's terrible.  When you have the most sacked QB in the NFL and don't get a single sack, it's terrible.  When you can't convert 2 4th and 1's, it's terrible.  There are fixes, lets hope they happen. 

 

 

 

 

 

Actually that was a great loss at the perfect time.

 

First if all, this game will go down in Bills lore as one of the greatest played, despite losing. Second, this team needs a punch in the face around the middle of the season to get it's head right.

 

We forget that wins aren't automatic. I'm seeing videos of Bills players dropping by fan parties on Broadway and I'm thinking 'are these guys ready to play?' Same with the fans. This was the inevitable drop-off after beating KC. 

 

The loss to AZ last year spurred us on to the AFC final. Here's hoping that stewing in this loss for two weeks gets them back to the Hungry Bills, not the Rock Star Bills.

Edited October 19, 2021 by PromoTheRobot

[Buffalo03]

40 minutes ago, Greg S said:

 

The Titans play at home vs the Chiefs this Sunday. If the Chiefs win there is your Titans loss. If the Titans win it buries the Chiefs even further back in the AFC playoff race.

The Titans are so up and down though. I could see them losing to Kansas City and dropping a dud along the way to someone else. They lost to the Jets a few weeks ago

[JohnNord]

This just in…..

 

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, RyanC883 said:

5.  Josh:  ha, had to put this in here.  He was good last night.  Not the reason we lost.  Yeah, he missed seeing some open WR's, but he was also trying to avoid getting sacked and taking a negative play.  His one interception was courtesy of the OL letting a DL tip the pass.  Fix:  I guess more awareness to look down the field when running for your life?  Also, don't trust your OL.  I know you love them, but if you have to QB sneak again, do NOT go to the left.  Audible out of it. 

 

Tipped passes are something that bother me.   Eric Wood once expressed the attitude that no one was going to tip a pass on his QB and if they jumped up to try he would drive into their gut and pancake them and they'd wish they hadn't.  Is this no longer allowed or something?  Sometimes the defender is several steps back or unblocked when they jump, but we had one guy tip a ball who was in contact or almost in contact with Feliciano when he went up for it.

 

Nit, couldn't this have gone in the "what are our problems?" thread, since that's what it seems to be - an analysis of our problems?

[Never NEVER Give-up]

Overall, the Bills weren't good enough last night.  But even playing at an average level, they almost won.  It's hard to overcome:

• Arrogant coaching.  A simple FG sends the game to OT and an even-chance at winning.
• Overthinking decisions - sitting pass rushers Basham and Epenesa and playing 'big boys' Phillips & Butler to stop the run.  How'd that work Coach?  We looked soft last night.
• Poor red-zone execution.  Tennessee looked like a #1 defense, pushed our o-line around.

What happened to being Humble?  We looked arrogant and got punched in the mouth.  We need to smarten-up.  We're better that we showed last night.
 

Edited October 19, 2021 by Never NEVER Give-up