Josh Allen: A winner above all other things

[Lieutenant Aldo Raine]

20 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Exactly. I know where the OP is going but so far the only things Josh has won are a single division title and the 2017 Famous Idaho Potato Bowl. Josh has a great fighters mentality but I wait for people to win before calling them winners. Josh feels like a winner all he is missing is the hardware to prove it. 

 

The kid went from nobody wanting him out of high school; going to JUCO, sending out thousands of emails and tape, and finally one school giving him an opportunity.  He turned that opportunity into the 7th overall pick in the 2018 draft; and in his fourth year is the second highest paid QB in the NFL, and one of the bright young stars in the league.  He worked his ass off for that!   That's winning - winning in life and on the football field.   You know what's not winning - sitting at your desk eating cheetos racking up over 36.8k meaningless forum posts like this one.  

 

Edited October 14, 2021 by Lieutenant Aldo Raine

[GunnerBill]

6 minutes ago, Lieutenant Aldo Raine said:

 

The kid went from nobody wanting him out of high school; going to JUCO, sending out thousands of emails and tape, and finally one school giving him an opportunity.  He turned that opportunity into the 7th overall pick in the 2018 draft; and in his fourth year is the second highest paid QB in the NFL, and one of the bright young stars in the league.  He worked his ass off for that!   That's winning - winning in life and on the football field.   You know what's not winning - sitting at your desk eating cheetos racking up over 36.8k meaningless forum posts like this one.  

 

 

I don't dispute any of the bolded. He has done incredibly well to beat the odds. Josh is fantastic. But Tom Brady is a winner. Dan Marino, who achieved an enormous amount, isn't. To be a winner you have to put the hardware on the table. Josh will, I am pretty sure of that, he just hasn't yet.

 

As for the personal insult I guarantee if you knew what I actually sit at my desk doing and where I came from you wouldn't be having a dig. 

[BADOLBILZ]

15 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I don't dispute any of the bolded. He has done incredibly well to beat the odds. Josh is fantastic. But Tom Brady is a winner. Dan Marino, who achieved an enormous amount, isn't. To be a winner you have to put the hardware on the table. Josh will, I am pretty sure of that, he just hasn't yet.

 

As for the personal insult I guarantee if you knew what I actually sit at my desk doing and where I came from you wouldn't be having a dig. 

 

 

 

[Lieutenant Aldo Raine]

55 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I don't dispute any of the bolded. He has done incredibly well to beat the odds. Josh is fantastic. But Tom Brady is a winner. Dan Marino, who achieved an enormous amount, isn't. To be a winner you have to put the hardware on the table. Josh will, I am pretty sure of that, he just hasn't yet.

 

Completely disagree with your definition of a winner; you don't need a material trophy to be a winner.  Where in the Merriam-Webster definition below state you have to have "Hardware" to be considered a winner.   Maybe you should change your definition to "champion", that would carry a little more weight.  Tom Brady is a Champion.  Trent Dilfer is a Champion. Dan Marino and Josh Allen who have achieved a lot and winners themselves, are not Champions.  

 

Winner: 

a: one that is successful especially through praiseworthy ability and hard work

b: a victor especially in games and sports

c: one that wins admiration

 

 

 

[JESSEFEFFER]

All the back story is essential to who he is and how his place in the league has evolved.  If he got a scholarship to a power 5 school he might have never seen the field as a QB.  His game might have been so raw compared to the others in the QB room that the coaches might have converted him to TE before he even got a chance to show much growth.  Thus, Wyoming was the best fit.  They gave him a chance to shine.  The 2018 Bills were much like the 2015 Wyoming Cowboys.  A great place for him to grow.  His "bloom where you are planted" mantra serves him very well.  

[BADOLBILZ]

2 hours ago, Lieutenant Aldo Raine said:

 

Completely disagree with your definition of a winner; you don't need a material trophy to be a winner.  Where in the Merriam-Webster definition below state you have to have "Hardware" to be considered a winner.   Maybe you should change your definition to "champion", that would carry a little more weight.  Tom Brady is a Champion.  Trent Dilfer is a Champion. Dan Marino and Josh Allen who have achieved a lot and winners themselves, are not Champions.  

 

Winner: 

a: one that is successful especially through praiseworthy ability and hard work

b: a victor especially in games and sports

c: one that wins admiration

 

 

 

 

 

You have to win championships to be characterized as a "winner" in the NFL.  The NFL is not a Charlie Sheen kinda' winning situation.   No participation trophies.   Doesn't mean a player is a loser if they don't win titles but it means they aren't known for winning.

[Nihilarian]

2 hours ago, JESSEFEFFER said:

All the back story is essential to who he is and how his place in the league has evolved.  If he got a scholarship to a power 5 school he might have never seen the field as a QB.  His game might have been so raw compared to the others in the QB room that the coaches might have converted him to TE before he even got a chance to show much growth.  Thus, Wyoming was the best fit.  They gave him a chance to shine.  The 2018 Bills were much like the 2015 Wyoming Cowboys.  A great place for him to grow.  His "bloom where you are planted" mantra serves him very well.  

Not with that arm of his...

 

The reason most colleges turned him down were because after high school he was 6'2'' 180 LB scrawny kid. Josh wasn't a 5 star recruit out of high school like the others in that draft. 

 

I don't know that Wyoming was the "best fit" as it was the only fit. Out of over a thousand emails Josh sent out to colleges all over the country only Wyoming and Eastern Michigan wanted to meet with him. After the latter found out he was taking to the former... they rescinded their offer.

 

 

On another note. I kinda side with LAR. I consider both Jim Kelly and Dan Marino winners as they won AFC championships to get to the SB. Besides, Hall of Famers are winners in my book. 

 

 

[Bferra13]

He's Elway on steroids. Best way I can describe him.

[ColoradoBills]

My term to describe Josh Allen is "Hard Working Competitor".  What's amazing is that his biggest competition is with himself!

[AuntieEm]

19 hours ago, The Dean said:

The only issue I have with the "Winner" label is, unlike most of the QBs in the NFL, Josh has NOT been on a winning team from youth to the NFL. Some of these guys have never experienced losing or hardship. Josh certainly has seemed to turn himself into a winner, I'll give you that. But he knows what losing is like and seems to know how to recover.  I don't see this team getting too low, or too high, based on the results of a game or two. Part of that may be due to Josh's path to the NFL

 

 

   

   Don't know his Hs career stats he was a multiple sport athlete. I'm sure some of his teams were winners at their level.  Otherwise his drive to win isn't worth much if it never propelled him or his teams.

 

   I'd say he's driven to succeed and he drags along his teammates. Josh Allen is the dog that's pulling the Bills wagons in a circle or heading to the location of the next game.

 

  And you can see all the team jumping in line with him to make that journey easier to reach the final destination.

 

 

Edited October 14, 2021 by AuntieEm

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

20 hours ago, KzooMike said:

Josh seems to be a very polarizing figure in the media and while he is adored by the fan base, at times you see the that polarizing effect even leak out into Bills fans when he plays poorly. I’m trying to understand that more. While I might drop a stat or two, in my opinion stats almost muddy the waters even more.

 

As an example, last year, Josh was had several games where he carved teams up and put up QBR's as good as it gets. But if you said describe Josh in one word, I think the last word I would choose would be “efficient”.

 

If you asked me to describe most the legends in the QB annuals in the last 20-30 years, I would say efficient would be the most common word used. Brady, Montana, Young, Brees, Manning, “efficient” just dominates your mind when you hear those names. They had a robot-like consistency and that is what we have come to visualize when looking at the greats.

 

More recently you see guys like Mahomes who I would also not call “efficient” as far as the first word to describe them. Perhaps, “talented or unique”. Mahomes is pretty consistent in his play, but it’s what he does that so few can that makes you scratch your head. He is also a Super Bowl winner and former MVP, so if he appears inconsistent once in awhile benefit of the doubt is given.

 

If I described Josh in one word it would be “winner”. He is probably the most physically talented QB in the NFL but I feel his drive to just win games is even greater than his talent. At times he can go stretches looking awful and that's what confuses people . Then he does something nobody can, not even Mahomes. Then he leaps a defender gaining 20 yards on the ground. A few hours later you look at the score and we put up 35 points and think, Allen probably could have played even better. With Allen, he will always produce points, because even when he looks inconsistent, he can still become Houdini by air or land at any moment and he is the 2nd most impactful running QB in the NFL. 

 

To me Josh fits the term “winner” more than any QB in the NFL at this time. That said, Josh has not won the big one.  Justifiably so, it’s hard to anoint him as the ultimate “Winner” until that time comes. Until then he seems to be stuck in this efficient ideology of NFL’s QB’s and if that shifts, he then goes to competing against a Super Bowl winning former MVP who is the only guy that can even come close to replicating some of the plays you might see from Allen week to week.

 

Josh is not a normal QB. I don't think he will ever just unload for 5 yards unmercifully breaking your will like his predecessors. As for his sham wow ability, he probably is the top guy, but he's also getting compared to a MVP with a ring. That said nobody will ever convince me Mahomes wants it more or is as tough as Allen. Allen will run through your DT's. He isn't a Brett Farve comp, Brett Farve is a Josh Allen Comp. Farve, even with his stupid arm strength is still less physically gifted and he certainly couldn't run 1/10th as effective as Allen can. 

 

It might be hard for Allen to carve out a true identity which makes people question how good he really is. It unlikely he ever gets the efficiency label applied like many former legends have. That said once the SB rings come, It will be much easier to just label him for what he is. A winner. 

We have played pretty conservative with big leads this year and hes had his fair share of bad weather games and hes still putting up great stats.  People just look at completion percentage and decide whether a qb is good or bad lol it's ridiculous.  You can't compare joshs stats this year to someone like Herbert's who has been in 5 close games in good weather. 

Edited October 14, 2021 by Generic_Bills_Fan

[Buffalo716]

5 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I don't dispute any of the bolded. He has done incredibly well to beat the odds. Josh is fantastic. But Tom Brady is a winner. Dan Marino, who achieved an enormous amount, isn't. To be a winner you have to put the hardware on the table. Josh will, I am pretty sure of that, he just hasn't yet.

 

As for the personal insult I guarantee if you knew what I actually sit at my desk doing and where I came from you wouldn't be having a dig. 

To be fair.. after a rough start to Josh's rookie season... He has done nothing but win in the league .. and he won at a Wyoming school that wasn't winning before him

 

I've said it before I'll put a stamp on it.. Josh Allen will be the face of the NFL, he will be better than Patrick mahomes.. might already be there.. and he's going to win us super bowls 

 

I have zero doubt in my mind

 

 

 

 

[BADOLBILZ]

9 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

To be fair.. after a rough start to Josh's rookie season... He has done nothing but win in the league .. and he won at a Wyoming school that wasn't winning before him

 

I've said it before I'll put a stamp on it.. Josh Allen will be the face of the NFL, he will be better than Patrick mahomes.. might already be there.. and he's going to win us super bowls 

 

I have zero doubt in my mind

 

 

 

 

 

 

Philip Rivers has more career wins than Joe Montana.......one guy is remembered for failure to win big games the other is known for being 4-0 on the biggest stage.

 

We all know what defines a QB who is characterized as a winner...........it's not going 16-11 at Wyoming.........it's winning championships.

 

 

 

 

Edited October 14, 2021 by BADOLBILZ

[Buffalo716]

2 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Philip Rivers has more career wins than Joe Montana.......one guy is remembered for failure to win big games the other is known for being 4-0 on the biggest stage.

 

We all know what defines a QB who is characterized as a winner...........it's not going 16-11 at Wyoming.........it's winning championships.

 

 

 

 

Do you doubt Josh Allen

[Lieutenant Aldo Raine]

7 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Philip Rivers has more career wins than Joe Montana.......one guy is remembered for failure to win big games the other is known for being 4-0 on the biggest stage.

 

We all know what defines a QB who is characterized as a winner...........it's not going 16-11 at Wyoming.........it's winning championships.

 

 

 

 

 

Joe Montana is a Champion; Phillip Rivers is not!  IMO, there's a difference between being a winner and being a champion.   If you don't think Josh is a winner; that's on you.  He's a winner in my book!  

 

[BADOLBILZ]

1 minute ago, Buffalo716 said:

Do you doubt Josh Allen

 

 

No I do not, but that's irrelevant.......doubt is a matter of opinion...........winning is a matter of fact.

 

 

[BigDingus]

20 hours ago, itaos said:

I don't disagree with your evaluation but with the amount of times Tebow was described as a winner despite his flaws taints the term a bit. 

 

Yeah, Tebow & Vince Young always had those "he's just a winner" defenders. I guess when the numbers don't pop off the page, wins is all you can point to. Thankfully Allen's got good numbers to back it up, so he's the good kinda winner  

[Heathcliff]

One word: baller

[GunnerBill]

36 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

Philip Rivers has more career wins than Joe Montana.......one guy is remembered for failure to win big games the other is known for being 4-0 on the biggest stage.

 

We all know what defines a QB who is characterized as a winner...........it's not going 16-11 at Wyoming.........it's winning championships.

 

 

This. Totally this. And I don't doubt Josh either. I think the Bills will win a Superbowl or maybe two in the next 5 or 6 years. But until he does I would hold off on the "winner" tag. I know absolutely what the OP means, it just isn't the word "winner" in my book. Winners win championships. Pure and simple. 

 

I am sure Josh will get to that point. Then we can crown him.

 

[muppy]

he says "LET'S GO"  a lot lol

 

what's not to love. Humble, gifted, altruistic, loyal, and he has Great taste in women :-)))))

 

he is one of those guys like Prince who only needs 1 name...and that's 17.

 

and he's OUR"s **Happy dances swirley hips****

Edited October 14, 2021 by Muppy