Truth or Scare ?

[oldmanfan]

3 minutes ago, plenzmd1 said:

So, let me get this straight. You  just blindly do everything that any doctor recommends you do? Do you understand the litigious society we live in? Do you think any doctor is going to expose themselves in regards to this vaccine? 

 

Let me tell you from experience, Docs always default to meds or surgery, its easy and it insulates them from litigation. I know from years of experience with my son...you do understand with the  ADHD meds, they have no clue why they work and what the long term affects will be of sustained. prolonged  use of stimulants...and yet its the first and most often only solution pediatricians will recommend for ADHD. 

 

About May of 2020, i had an ortho tell me the damage to my shoulder could only be fixed with an expensive surgery with several months of post surgery rehab. I researched the injury, exercises and equipment i could use to rehab...and what do ya know my shoulder is just fine today.

 

I have also had docs tell me my SI joint dysfunction needed surgery as only option...and what do you know, strength exercises i researched online and  the occasional chiro visit and i manage just fine

 

And yes, i am thankful the internet exists and it affords us layman the ability to dig in and find out what may be best for ourselves and families, and not blindly follow a doctor.

 

But god bless you think they are infallible.

Second opinions are always valuable.  We encourage our patients to do so.  But patients also will blindly come to us with stuff thy see on an an Internet website, insisting that we do it for them, when in reality it has nothing to do with their particular situation and could in fact do more harm than good.

 

I work in reproductive medicine, been directing infertility labs for 40 years, have to regularly do continuing education to keep my board certification as does the physician (with 30 years experience) that I work with.  Yet patients some times trust what someone says on Facebook more than what we tell them.  We are seeing the same stuff with the Covid pandemic.  You have epidemiologists and virologists and public health officials with a lifetime of training and expertise, yet folks would rather dismiss their expertise in favor of some conspiracy fueled nonsense on Facebook.  I am dealing with this now with a group on Facebook insisting that pregnant women should not get vaccinated because it will kill their baby and such, when the recommendations from every leading women's health organization are that women get vaccinated in pregnancy, because Covid infections in pregnancy are more dangerous to the mother and the baby, leads to premature labor and a host of other issues.  

[plenzmd1]

4 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

Second opinions are always valuable.  We encourage our patients to do so.  But patients also will blindly come to us with stuff thy see on an an Internet website, insisting that we do it for them, when in reality it has nothing to do with their particular situation and could in fact do more harm than good.

 

I work in reproductive medicine, been directing infertility labs for 40 years, have to regularly do continuing education to keep my board certification as does the physician (with 30 years experience) that I work with.  Yet patients some times trust what someone says on Facebook more than what we tell them.  We are seeing the same stuff with the Covid pandemic.  You have epidemiologists and virologists and public health officials with a lifetime of training and expertise, yet folks would rather dismiss their expertise in favor of some conspiracy fueled nonsense on Facebook.  I am dealing with this now with a group on Facebook insisting that pregnant women should not get vaccinated because it will kill their baby and such, when the recommendations from every leading women's health organization are that women get vaccinated in pregnancy, because Covid infections in pregnancy are more dangerous to the mother and the baby, leads to premature labor and a host of other issues.  

i have no clue whats on Facebook, as i saw someone refer to it the other day.." the virtual nursing home of the internet" LOL.

 

But for Sundancer to claim all doctors are infallible and that the internet is not a treasure trove of info that should be used to research your options when it concerns the heath of you and your family is just wrong,. Even worse , to me it's just plain lazy to not do research, especially when it comes to the health of your children.  

[Tenhigh]

12 hours ago, Sundancer said:

Cool cool. Lots of doctors recommending patients skip the vaccine? And yours? 
 

Ignoring doctors sounds like the perfect path to healthy living. 

Do you abstain from drinking alcohol? Always skip chicken wings and fast food? Sleep at least 8 hours per day?  

 

If everyone listened to their doctor, the home opener would be a ghost town.  Personally, I chose to get vaccinated,  but if others don't, it's their choice. 

[Sundancer]

9 minutes ago, Tenhigh said:

Do you abstain from drinking alcohol? Always skip chicken wings and fast food? Sleep at least 8 hours per day?  

 

If everyone listened to their doctor, the home opener would be a ghost town.  Personally, I chose to get vaccinated,  but if others don't, it's their choice. 

 

You can *choose* to ignore your doctor, and when you do so, you are making a bad health decision. I of course make those decisions and when I do, I make decisions that are BAD FOR MY HEALTH. 

 

Which is why I keep asking the vaccine defenders: "What does your doctor recommend?" If they are honest and say, "they recommend that everyone get the vaccine," that's good but they should also admit part 2 of this "logic," which they don't like to admit: "and not getting the vaccine is a bad health decision and bad for my community because it will help spread the disease to vulnerable people who might die." 

 

I am against government mandates. Anti-vax defenders like Plenz and Timmy put words in my mouth that I've not said. But people should follow the science, not the Twitter-science that Plenz, TMD (Twitter MD) promotes, and admit: Getting the vaccine is what actual scientists and doctors recommend. Only here in America is the anti-vax defense so vocal and not laughed out of existence. There's the Plenz TMD types and his ilk who get excited about any link that makes them feel counter-culture above the scientiests, "See I knew I was smart all along." It's an odd way to self-validate.

 

Be proud fellas and enjoy the next remedy that comes from Twitter. Here, I am going to make something up out of my ass for how to treat Covid and if it gets enough follows, I bet people start believing it. It can be as crazy as anything but if Berenson or Tucker start talking about it, it will take off!

 

You know what works well to treat Covid: Horse-dewormer dog flea and tick medicine taken orally. 

 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

1 hour ago, Tenhigh said:

Do you abstain from drinking alcohol? Always skip chicken wings and fast food? Sleep at least 8 hours per day?  

 

If everyone listened to their doctor, the home opener would be a ghost town.  Personally, I chose to get vaccinated,  but if others don't, it's their choice. 

That and there is a segment of that discipline that would rather prescribe you Zestril, Lipitor and Ambien then suggest any lifestyle improvements   

[Tenhigh]

1 hour ago, Sundancer said:

 

You can *choose* to ignore your doctor, and when you do so, you are making a bad health decision. I of course make those decisions and when I do, I make decisions that are BAD FOR MY HEALTH. 

 

Which is why I keep asking the vaccine defenders: "What does your doctor recommend?" If they are honest and say, "they recommend that everyone get the vaccine," that's good but they should also admit part 2 of this "logic," which they don't like to admit: "and not getting the vaccine is a bad health decision and bad for my community because it will help spread the disease to vulnerable people who might die." 

 

I am against government mandates. Anti-vax defenders like Plenz and Timmy put words in my mouth that I've not said. But people should follow the science, not the Twitter-science that Plenz, TMD (Twitter MD) promotes, and admit: Getting the vaccine is what actual scientists and doctors recommend. Only here in America is the anti-vax defense so vocal and not laughed out of existence. There's the Plenz TMD types and his ilk who get excited about any link that makes them feel counter-culture above the scientiests, "See I knew I was smart all along." It's an odd way to self-validate.

 

Be proud fellas and enjoy the next remedy that comes from Twitter. Here, I am going to make something up out of my ass for how to treat Covid and if it gets enough follows, I bet people start believing it. It can be as crazy as anything but if Berenson or Tucker start talking about it, it will take off!

 

You know what works well to treat Covid: Horse-dewormer dog flea and tick medicine taken orally. 

 

Maybe if you addressed them as people instead of a$$#oles you'd get further?

Edited October 7, 2021 by Tenhigh

[Sundancer]

1 hour ago, Tenhigh said:

Maybe if you addressed them as people instead of a$$#oles you'd get further?

I only argue with #######s here.

[Tenhigh]

22 minutes ago, Sundancer said:

I only argue with #######s here.

Like we said when we were kids, "takes one to know one!"

[oldmanfan]

4 hours ago, plenzmd1 said:

i have no clue whats on Facebook, as i saw someone refer to it the other day.." the virtual nursing home of the internet" LOL.

 

But for Sundancer to claim all doctors are infallible and that the internet is not a treasure trove of info that should be used to research your options when it concerns the heath of you and your family is just wrong,. Even worse , to me it's just plain lazy to not do research, especially when it comes to the health of your children.  

I agree research is important, so long as you have to ability to discern the research, understand what is statistically relevant and such.  Sounds like you do; a lot of folks don't.

[TSOL]

You dont meed a weatherman to know which way the wind blows 

[plenzmd1]

3 hours ago, Sundancer said:

 

You can *choose* to ignore your doctor, and when you do so, you are making a bad health decision. I of course make those decisions and when I do, I make decisions that are BAD FOR MY HEALTH. 

 

Which is why I keep asking the vaccine defenders: "What does your doctor recommend?" If they are honest and say, "they recommend that everyone get the vaccine," that's good but they should also admit part 2 of this "logic," which they don't like to admit: "and not getting the vaccine is a bad health decision and bad for my community because it will help spread the disease to vulnerable people who might die." 

 

I am against government mandates. Anti-vax defenders like Plenz and Timmy put words in my mouth that I've not said. But people should follow the science, not the Twitter-science that Plenz, TMD (Twitter MD) promotes, and admit: Getting the vaccine is what actual scientists and doctors recommend. Only here in America is the anti-vax defense so vocal and not laughed out of existence. There's the Plenz TMD types and his ilk who get excited about any link that makes them feel counter-culture above the scientiests, "See I knew I was smart all along." It's an odd way to self-validate.

 

Be proud fellas and enjoy the next remedy that comes from Twitter. Here, I am going to make something up out of my ass for how to treat Covid and if it gets enough follows, I bet people start believing it. It can be as crazy as anything but if Berenson or Tucker start talking about it, it will take off!

 

You know what works well to treat Covid: Horse-dewormer dog flea and tick medicine taken orally. 

 

Show me one post, just one, where I am anti vax. I have said repeatedly people should take the vaccine, except if they have natural immunity. I am

fully based for Christ sake and own Moderna stock. 
 

For  the umpteenth time what I continue to  point out to the vaccine cutlers like you is that the information our government provides is garbage , as you admit , the whole process has been politicized, and I can understand in the face of all the conflicting and quite frankly misleading information put out by our government why people are hesitant to take the vaccine. 
 

it is an absolute travesty how the CDC has performed during this pandemic, but especially under Walensky. They are much more to blame for vaccine hesitancy and resistance than trump, or Tucker et al. 

 

You chose to bury your head in the sand and say “ just get the vaccine and this all goes away cause that’s what the government says” But you can’t even tell me the number of cases that are breakthough cases. 
 

as I have mention before , 7 of 8 people with me at a game tested positive for Covid, we were all fully vaxed. 5 of 6 at a friends house for Covid, all vaxxed except the one dude who did not catch Covid. 
 

and this is not a crazy coincidence, it’s happening all over. But cause the CDC has decided unless hospitalized, it’s not a breakthrough we have no true numbers that indicate vaccine efficacy in the USA in real time. And that’s a damn shame.
 

Leads a whole lot of folks to ask why in light of the Delta variant, they continue that policy. What are they afraid of? 
 

 

 

[oldmanfan]

38 minutes ago, plenzmd1 said:

Show me one post, just one, where I am anti vax. I have said repeatedly people should take the vaccine, except if they have natural immunity. I am

fully based for Christ sake and own Moderna stock. 
 

For  the umpteenth time what I continue to  point out to the vaccine cutlers like you is that the information our government provides is garbage , as you admit , the whole process has been politicized, and I can understand in the face of all the conflicting and quite frankly misleading information put out by our government why people are hesitant to take the vaccine. 
 

it is an absolute travesty how the CDC has performed during this pandemic, but especially under Walensky. They are much more to blame for vaccine hesitancy and resistance than trump, or Tucker et al. 

 

You chose to bury your head in the sand and say “ just get the vaccine and this all goes away cause that’s what the government says” But you can’t even tell me the number of cases that are breakthough cases. 
 

as I have mention before , 7 of 8 people with me at a game tested positive for Covid, we were all fully vaxed. 5 of 6 at a friends house for Covid, all vaxxed except the one dude who did not catch Covid. 
 

and this is not a crazy coincidence, it’s happening all over. But cause the CDC has decided unless hospitalized, it’s not a breakthrough we have no true numbers that indicate vaccine efficacy in the USA in real time. And that’s a damn shame.
 

Leads a whole lot of folks to ask why in light of the Delta variant, they continue that policy. What are they afraid of? 
 

 

 

They’ve done so because mild infections that don’t lead to hospitalization aren’t what kills people.  We all know or should know the delta variant is more infectious, but I agree they need to explain these things much better.  I would have presented all data on infections through deaths from the beginning to today.

[Sundancer]

1 hour ago, plenzmd1 said:

Show me one post, just one, where I am anti vax. I have said repeatedly people should take the vaccine, except if they have natural immunity. I am

fully based for Christ sake and own Moderna stock. 
 

For  the umpteenth time what I continue to  point out to the vaccine cutlers like you is that the information our government provides is garbage , as you admit , the whole process has been politicized, and I can understand in the face of all the conflicting and quite frankly misleading information put out by our government why people are hesitant to take the vaccine. 
 

it is an absolute travesty how the CDC has performed during this pandemic, but especially under Walensky. They are much more to blame for vaccine hesitancy and resistance than trump, or Tucker et al. 

 

You chose to bury your head in the sand and say “ just get the vaccine and this all goes away cause that’s what the government says” But you can’t even tell me the number of cases that are breakthough cases. 
 

as I have mention before , 7 of 8 people with me at a game tested positive for Covid, we were all fully vaxed. 5 of 6 at a friends house for Covid, all vaxxed except the one dude who did not catch Covid. 
 

and this is not a crazy coincidence, it’s happening all over. But cause the CDC has decided unless hospitalized, it’s not a breakthrough we have no true numbers that indicate vaccine efficacy in the USA in real time. And that’s a damn shame.
 

Leads a whole lot of folks to ask why in light of the Delta variant, they continue that policy. What are they afraid of? 
 

 

 

 

I didn't say you're antivax. I added a word. You're an antivax defender. OR I could say antivax apologist. 

 

CDC messanging has been awful. I've said it a bunch of times. Trump's messaging (or lack thereof) is and was atrocious too. At best we get a "I think you should get vaccinated" wink-wink that got booed and that came very late. 

 

But here's the only message. Get vaccinated. If you don't like that message, don't go to Twitter or PPP to refute it, ask your doctor. 

Edited October 7, 2021 by Sundancer

[SoCal Deek]

3 hours ago, Sundancer said:

 

I didn't say you're antivax. I added a word. You're an antivax defender. OR I could say antivax apologist. 

 

CDC messanging has been awful. I've said it a bunch of times. Trump's messaging (or lack thereof) is and was atrocious too. At best we get a "I think you should get vaccinated" wink-wink that got booed and that came very late. 

 

But here's the only message. Get vaccinated. If you don't like that message, don't go to Twitter or PPP to refute it, ask your doctor. 

Oh brother.  Whenever I've heard the former President talk about the issue, he generally says that people should get the vaccine.  And remember, we only got the vaccine about three weeks before he left office....so there was no time for him to give much of an 'official' message on ANYTHING by then.   He, like others, is not against the vaccine, he may be against mandating vaccines, but he has no authority on it.  Now.... Uncle Joe comes in and says it more sternly, but he too has not mandated the vaccine and he's now been stuck in neutral for MONTHS!

[Orlando Buffalo]

https://www.cnn.com/2021/10/09/health/halloween-2021-safety-dr-wen-wellness/index.html

 

Unless your child has a major health issue, which would include obesity, then trick or treating outside is as safe this year for your child as any year in the past. Anyone who say otherwise is being paranoid or is a liar 

[oldmanfan]

3 minutes ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

https://www.cnn.com/2021/10/09/health/halloween-2021-safety-dr-wen-wellness/index.html

 

Unless your child has a major health issue, which would include obesity, then trick or treating outside is as safe this year for your child as any year in the past. Anyone who say otherwise is being paranoid or is a liar 

There’s no reason to not have trick or treating

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

On 10/7/2021 at 8:32 AM, plenzmd1 said:

So, let me get this straight. You  just blindly do everything that any doctor recommends you do? Do you understand the litigious society we live in? Do you think any doctor is going to expose themselves in regards to this vaccine? 

 

Let me tell you from experience, Docs always default to meds or surgery, its easy and it insulates them from litigation. I know from years of experience with my son...you do understand with the  ADHD meds, they have no clue why they work and what the long term affects will be of sustained. prolonged  use of stimulants...and yet its the first and most often only solution pediatricians will recommend for ADHD. 

 

About May of 2020, i had an ortho tell me the damage to my shoulder could only be fixed with an expensive surgery with several months of post surgery rehab. I researched the injury, exercises and equipment i could use to rehab...and what do ya know my shoulder is just fine today.

 

I have also had docs tell me my SI joint dysfunction needed surgery as only option...and what do you know, strength exercises i researched online and  the occasional chiro visit and i manage just fine

 

And yes, i am thankful the internet exists and it affords us layman the ability to dig in and find out what may be best for ourselves and families, and not blindly follow a doctor.

 

But god bless you think they are infallible.

#truth 

 

 

[Orlando Buffalo]

30 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

There’s no reason to not have trick or treating

Well growing up in NY we had as snow storm one Halloween so that put a damper on it but otherwise you are of course correct.

[All_Pro_Bills]

Just now, Buffalo Timmy said:

Well growing up in NY we had as snow storm one Halloween so that put a damper on it but otherwise you are of course correct.

Heavy rain and wind with temperatures in the 40's has been a mood killer in previous years too. 

[oldmanfan]

36 minutes ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

Well growing up in NY we had as snow storm one Halloween so that put a damper on it but otherwise you are of course correct.

I trick or treated in the snow more than not back in the day