Nfl pass protection index via the Athletic

[billybrew1]

The real question is how could everyone be so wrong about Cody Ford?

 

Can he still improve? You laugh but he hasn't played much RG in his entire career and hasn't played much pro ball at all.

So, conceivably, Ford could still work out if we are patient and the Bills seem as patient as pudding when it comes to Ford....

 

I wish I still had the Pittsburgh game. Later in that game I thought I saw Watt get destroyed by a guard coming to help Williams a couple times but I never rewatched the game because we lost..... : (

[K-9]

14 minutes ago, Kelly the Dog said:

I know they don’t plan it this way, and would prefer not to suck, but the extraordinary way Josh handles the rush, the Bills can excel the way they are playing. I mentioned this in my BuffNews fan article this week. 
 

Allen easily makes the first guy miss almost every time. He gets in trouble when he eludes one guy and the second surprises him from behind. Or he blindly eludes one and turns into a second (which is really the same thing). 
 

This talent of Josh’s is literally on the same level as his arm talent. It’s insane how easily and often he does it and makes it look. 
 

If only one guy is getting beat we are fine. When the jailbreaks come we will be in trouble. 

As Josh matured and with the addition of receivers who can read defenses as well, he started ripping man coverage and blitzes of every type; to the tune of being at or near the top in passer rating against those schemes. In response, we’ve seen DCs drop 7 into zone coverages more frequently and our OL has had the numbers advantage most of the time. They should win the majority of those battles and keep a cleaner pocket. It’s nice to know that JA has to beat less rushers on his own most of the time.
 

DCs are gonna be in a bigger quandary when Allen becomes as good vs. zone as he became against man because if you can’t get to him with four rushers, he’s gonna kill ya. How many great QBs have we said the very same thing about in the past? 
 

Enjoy the ride.

[LyndonvilleBill]

1 hour ago, Bangarang said:

It’s actually pretty surprising how consistently bad Ford continues to be. 

I agree, but, considering his first year at RT (really bad decision), last year being messed up, then starting at LG, then gets injured and now going into week 4 at RG... I'll be a little more patient and give him to the bye week until I start jumping on him. 

[K-9]

24 minutes ago, LyndonvilleBill said:

I agree, but, considering his first year at RT (really bad decision), last year being messed up, then starting at LG, then gets injured and now going into week 4 at RG... I'll be a little more patient and give him to the bye week until I start jumping on him. 

That’s a reasonable take. He’s been poor in 2 of the three games this year but, and this isn’t defending him, he’s also gone up against a couple of elite interior DL players who make most of the interior OLmen they face look just as bad much of the time. I’m gonna try to be patient as well given that he’s never had the opportunity to really settle into a position and make it his own.

[NewEra]

We’ll live and die on the OL play.

[Kelly the Dog]

4 minutes ago, NewEra said:

We’ll live and die on the OL play.

Not so sure about that. Josh has proven that he can be truly great without it. Again, this is not how we would like it, and we need to do what we can to make it better. There were a lot of factors that went into the Bills loss to the Chiefs last year that rivaled the lackluster OL performance.

[gobills404]

 

[hondo in seattle]

3 hours ago, MJS said:

Unless you have a boat load of money and draft picks (which the Bills don't), it's going to take some time. We have a bunch of average starters, some of them maybe below average. It gets the job done often, and sometimes it doesn't.

 

Beane has been excellent at building depth on the line, though, so when someone comes in it isn't a huge dropoff. Over time by developing draft picks and making shrewd pickups in free agency the line should get better. But it is a multi-year project, and even then you have to start replacing players that leave or get old, so the job is never going to be done on the oline.

 

What we need is one elite guy on the line to anchor it and then fill in the pieces around him. Right now we don't have that. Dawkins is above average. Morse is maybe a little above average. But they aren't even close to being elite. The rest are below average or worse, but at least lower end starting caliber players.

 

I agree with pretty much all of this.  The salary cap forces GMs to prioritize.  And Beane focused on the skill positions in the passing game.  He also picked up a couple of decent 3rd round RBs.  And he's brought in a truckload of offensive linemen on a budget over the past few years and kept the best ones.  You're right, our OL depth is actually pretty good even if our starting lineup is far from great.

 

I've always thought if I was a GM, I'd want a couple Pro Bowl quality lineman and then some cost-effective JAGs.  We have mostly JAGs right now with a couple maybe above average.  As you say, none of them are elite.   I want a couple elite guys to protect our $258 million dollar man.  I'd guess Beane wants the same but things just haven't fallen in place either in free agency or the draft.  I hope he makes the OL a bigger priority this upcoming offseason.

 

 

[billybrew1]

Man! Bills got some work to do!

 

Maybe it's good we have an early bye?

[2020 Our Year For Sure]

2 hours ago, Kelly the Dog said:

I know they don’t plan it this way, and would prefer not to suck, but the extraordinary way Josh handles the rush, the Bills can excel the way they are playing. I mentioned this in my BuffNews fan article this week. 
 

Allen easily makes the first guy miss almost every time. He gets in trouble when he eludes one guy and the second surprises him from behind. Or he blindly eludes one and turns into a second (which is really the same thing). 
 

This talent of Josh’s is literally on the same level as his arm talent. It’s insane how easily and often he does it and makes it look. 
 

If only one guy is getting beat we are fine. When the jailbreaks come we will be in trouble. 

Nice plug

[buffaloboyinATL]

4 hours ago, BTB said:

Kind of what I suspect.  Protection has been below average, and Allen’s mobility has bailed them out 

Maybe it is by design. Allen told Ford, "just let them run by you and I'll take it from there".

 

[1ManRaid]

2 hours ago, Florida Bills Fanatic said:

The data at face value gives the o-line a poor performance evaluation.  One significant contributing factor is the length of time that Josh Allen holds the ball.  Another factor is the type of routes that are being run.  The Bills don't run a quick pass offense and the teams that do don't give up as many sacks and pressures, thus making their o-line stats look much better.  Could the Buffalo o-line play better?  Certainly they can but it is not the dire catastrophe that the "sky is falling crowd" purports it to be.  A simple one dimensional review of statistics rarely gives the total story.

 

Until the Bills establish a legitimate running game, defenses will continue to disregard run defense and will strictly focus on rushing the passer.  This puts the o-line at a distinct disadvantage.

 

Yeah I saw a lot of people saying our D-line sucked vs WFT because we didn't get a lot of sacks.  What I saw was a lot of deep fast dropbacks from their QB with quick throws specifically to avoid getting sacked after seeing us taking down Miami QBs 6 times.  Being down their starting QB, they couldn't afford to even give up pressures even if their offense was weaker as a result.

 

So my takeaway from these stats is week 1 continues to be a big fat liar, and anyone can be made to look better or worse through stats if you ignore context.

[fergie's ire]

4 hours ago, CorkScrewHill said:

His mobility and his spider sense .. 10 times a game it seems I am like oh #$#$ he doesn't see the pressure  .. and he senses it somehow and avoids .. it is really remarkable.

Yeah, last year I watched the game late in the season between the Ravens and Browns.  The biggest difference I saw between Lamar and Baker vs Josh is the pocket awareness.  I was used to watching Josh and watching them made his ability stand out.  Sometime between year 2 and 3 Josh developed that Brady-esque ability to sense pressure and make subtle steps to avoid it while keeping his eyes downfield.  I am not saying he does it to Brady's level at this point (nobody does) but watching his classmates really made it clear how far Allen has come.

[K-9]

2 minutes ago, fergie's ire said:

Yeah, last year I watched the game late in the season between the Ravens and Browns.  The biggest difference I saw between Lamar and Baker vs Josh is the pocket awareness.  I was used to watching Josh and watching them made his ability stand out.  Sometime between year 2 and 3 Josh developed that Brady-esque ability to sense pressure and make subtle steps to avoid it while keeping his eyes downfield.  I am not saying he does it to Brady's level at this point (nobody does) but watching his classmates really made it clear how far Allen has come.

Intelligence + talent + work ethic = Josh Allen

[machine gun kelly]

6 hours ago, Inigo Montoya said:

 

You're exactly right BTB.  If it wasn't for Josh's ability to slide around the pocket and roll out of the pocket and still deliver strikes, the Bills offense would be dead in the water.  

 

Daboll needs to stay in 11 personel and continue to swing Knox or Gilliam into the backfield to provide and extra blocker for Josh along with the RB.  The O-line just isn't playing very well right now.  I'm not sure what the answer is, but if Ford and Feliciano continue to play like this, I suspect we're going to end up starting a 6'8" rookie guard at some point this season.

Inigo, my guy in search of the 6 fingered man, I think you could see Boettger getting back into the LG spot.  We also haven't seen much of Bates who's been groomed here for a few years.  Taron Johnson and Levi Wallace developed nicely under McD.  I wonder if either will get a shot.  I'm with you 100% in 11 personnel, and with teams where we think we can run even 21 personnel with Gilliam and (Moss/Motor) in there and leave Knox out for a play.  The RB can go up the middle with Gilliam plowing the field for a tough couple of yards, or he stays in for protection and Moss is you're dump of 3-4 yards down for a pass and let him knock a safety on his ars.  What did he say, that will be a business decision.

Edited October 1, 2021 by machine gun kelly

[947]

I still don't understand why we cut Forrest Lamp. I thought he had a shot to be our best OG. Not sure how bad his injury was, but I'd have rather seen him IR'd.

[JGMcD2]

It has nothing to do with the o-line. 

 

It's blatantly obvious that Josh is regressing right in front of our eyes!

 

🤣

Edited October 1, 2021 by JGMcD2

[NewEra]

9 hours ago, Kelly the Dog said:

Not so sure about that. Josh has proven that he can be truly great without it. Again, this is not how we would like it, and we need to do what we can to make it better. There were a lot of factors that went into the Bills loss to the Chiefs last year that rivaled the lackluster OL performance.

Idk.  Sure he can, but not every time.  Prior to Miami and wft, the last two games we saw him play, our OL got shredded and he played poorly.  I didn’t see Superman vs Kc or Pittsburgh.

[78thealltimegreat]

20 hours ago, loveorhatembillsfan4life said:

I just pulled this up on the Athetic and if you had to guess where would you say they ranked us among 32 teams..

 

We are number 30 and I’m trying to relay for those who can’t access.

 

 

 

BUFFALO BILLS

WEEK 1-3 PASS PROTECTION

SACKS 4

3 (this is again a rank which is good as we have allowed only four sacks)

 

SACK%3.0

1

PRESSURES 49

1

PRESSURE% 35.3

30

“Josh Allen must be a wizard.

The Bills are 2-1 even though guard Cody Ford produced the single worst game of the season with 11 pressures allowed in Buffalo’s loss to Pittsburgh. So it figures Ford is tied for the league lead with 16 pressures.

It’s come from several directions as well, with guard Jon Feliciano (11), tackle Daryl Williams (10) and tackle Dion Williams (nine) being far too porous for the Bills. Center Mitch Morse shouldn’t be praised for having only six pressures.

All of that, and Allen has only been sacked four times.”

 

We have the 30th rated oline and the QB was still AFC player of the week…I think we can safely reach the conclusion Josh is really really good 

[Kelly the Dog]

10 hours ago, NewEra said:

Idk.  Sure he can, but not every time.  Prior to Miami and wft, the last two games we saw him play, our OL got shredded and he played poorly.  I didn’t see Superman vs Kc or Pittsburgh.

Versus Pitt he just seemed off a little and their defense confused him a little. There were a lot of plays to be made.  I didn’t see him getting sacked or rattled by one guy quickly rushing or in his face IMO.