Pegulas invite UB football to new stadium. UB prefers to stay on campus.

[Buffalo716]

3 minutes ago, BillStime said:

Buffalo is unique - has infrastructure to support a city three times its size.

I know there are studies out there that say there is little economic benefit to a downtown stadium. 
 

I can fund a study too that says a downtown stadium near a casino is an economic goldmine.

 

I wonder if those studies ever  focused on NFL cities the size of Buffalo - the second smallest city in the NFL and an economically deprived city with numerous bombed out corners covered by parking lots, limited subway infrastructure, and a population base that is slowly growing.

 

They probably focused on large cities w limited space, bursting population centers and vibrant economies.

 

The area has to find a way to bring the core back and develop from the center.

In the past 10-15 years there's been a resurgence of development

 

Downtrodden cities like Buffalo don't turn around overnight... It's literally a 30 40 year plan

 

And there's already a lot of parts of downtown that have seen economic revivals... Mom and pop shops, boutiques

 

Hipsters are moving back into the city cuz it's trendy now

[chris heff]

32 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Still a resident of Buffalo

 

I don't think anybody saying they don't want the city to be bustling.. it's already a beautiful city 

 

The only thing is there's been a lot of studies shown that downtown stadiums do nothing for a cities  economy... So statistically building a stadium downtown is going to do nothing for the economy

 

Football stadiums are never money makers for the economy

 

So it's one thing to want buffalo to be beautiful and bustling.. but a stadium downtown is not going to make that happen .

 

It's not what changes cities

 

 

Granted I just Googled “do downtown stadiums help city economy” not one article or study came up that specifically states that. Plenty that said stadiums no matter where they are don’t really help the economy. One article about new arena in Sacramento has helped downtown, but an arena is different that a stadium.

[Buffalo716]

5 minutes ago, chris heff said:

Granted I just Googled “do downtown stadiums help city economy” not one article or study came up that specifically states that. Plenty that said stadiums no matter where they are don’t really help the economy. One article about new arena in Sacramento has helped downtown, but an arena is different that a stadium.

The area doesn't matter.. stadiums don't help the economy of wherever they are.. suburbs or downtown most studies indicate

[chris heff]

1 minute ago, Buffalo716 said:

The area doesn't matter.. stadiums don't help the economy of wherever they are.. suburbs or downtown most studies indicate

Exactly, I just have a hard time seeing them dump a couple of billion into Orchard Park. Like I said Rich Stadium ended up in Orchard Park by default. Did find an interesting article about the future of stadiums, smaller and more luxurious could be the trend.

[BillStime]

26 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

In the past 10-15 years there's been a resurgence of development

 

Downtrodden cities like Buffalo don't turn around overnight... It's literally a 30 40 year plan

 

And there's already a lot of parts of downtown that have seen economic revivals... Mom and pop shops, boutiques

 

Hipsters are moving back into the city cuz it's trendy now

And a billion dollar stadium would have ZERO impact on hotels restaurants, stores?

 

Improved public transportation infrastructure wouldn’t help a city like Buffalo?

I just don’t buy it.

 

[Saxum]

57 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

But TG weekend they aren't around anyway. 

 

As someone who lived in dorms when I went to UB that is not true.

Most of the NYers and Lon G'Islanders went home to their rich mommy and daddy (rich but too cheap to pay for private colleges) but there were plenty of students there off campus and on.   We even had an event one year on Thanksgiving and watched football.   

[Saxum]

6 minutes ago, chris heff said:

Exactly, I just have a hard time seeing them dump a couple of billion into Orchard Park. Like I said Rich Stadium ended up in Orchard Park by default. Did find an interesting article about the future of stadiums, smaller and more luxurious could be the trend.

 

I have more hard time seeing them spending more to put it elsewhere and both UB, Buffalo, Greater Love Canal or Dunkirk Don's dream stadium.

[Buffalo716]

11 minutes ago, BillStime said:

And a billion dollar stadium would have ZERO impact on hotels restaurants, stores?

 

Improved public transportation infrastructure wouldn’t help a city like Buffalo?

I just don’t buy it.

 

8 to 10 games a year really does have little economic impact

 

All those restaurants are operating 365 a year..  there's tons of thriving restaurants downtown , 8 days a year of business isn't really going to change things

 

Hotels around the city are filled up 

 

And buffalo is a smart drinking City... Sure you get younger adults who will party downtown and hit strip... But dive bars are King in the city

 

most people won't be hitting the bar scene downtown and paying $15 a drink before the Bills game... They would much rather buy 12 pack for that price and just pre-game with Friends... Which is why I don't think it's going to have a huge impact on the bar/restaurant scene 

 

If they Put it downtown it's because it's the best place for a football

 

 

Edited September 25, 2021 by Buffalo716

[WhoTom]

9 minutes ago, chris heff said:

Did find an interesting article about the future of stadiums, smaller and more luxurious could be the trend.

 

Makes sense, from a financial standpoint. A smaller footprint means less land to buy and lower building and maintenance costs, and those who can afford to pay the premium for tix and PSLs are willing to blow a C-note or more on beer and food.

[Doc Brown]

15 hours ago, machine gun kelly said:

Doc, I think they mentioned a canopy so in essence the upper and part of the lower decks would be covered from snow, rain, and most importantly wind.  By installing those huge heating lamps would also create a much more mild environment.  It also on the field will still look like an open stadium which a lot of people like so without the heavy winds at times, the field would still see a little snow.  I love it, and given in another thread people are not happy about PSL’s, they would only be worse in other places mentioned.

Seems like a lot of effort when you can just throw a roof over it but it's better than nothing.  I went to the game in Minnesota's new stadium the first year it opened and was awed at the design.  It felt like an outdoor game even though it was inside.  You could pry build a similar type stadium for around the same price. 

[chris heff]

4 hours ago, Limeaid said:

 

As someone who lived in dorms when I went to UB that is not true.

Most of the NYers and Lon G'Islanders went home to their rich mommy and daddy (rich but too cheap to pay for private colleges) but there were plenty of students there off campus and on.   We even had an event one year on Thanksgiving and watched football.   

You do realize that people from Long Island pay taxes in New York State and the UB is a State college. And I hope that everyone else will recognize that  “ Lon G’ Islanders” is an anti Semitic slur. 

Edited September 26, 2021 by chris heff

[Doc]

15 hours ago, BillStime said:

There's reason for NFL to fear Jeff Bezos. But it's not big enough to keep him out, especially if London is in play

 

All the more reason to help make the Bills more viable in one of the leagues smallest markets.

 

Small thinking like building in OP does not help the owners maximize revenue. Does nothing to help the tax payers maximize its investment.

 

Does nothing for WNY to help turn itself around and it starts by capitalizing on these once in a lifetime transformative opportunities.

 

The league does not care about your desire to tailgate.

Keeping a team in Buffalo does nothing to help the owners maximize profit, even with a downtown stadium. We are fortunate that the Rams moved from St. Louis and the city sued Jerry Jones over it. He doesn’t want another situation like that on his hands (whether STL has a case or not). 
 

And why should the NFL fear Bezos?  A team in London will be a failure. 

[SirAndrew]

9 hours ago, chris heff said:

You do realize that people from Long Island pay taxes in New York State and the UB is a State college. And I hope that everyone else will recognize that  “ Lon G’ Islanders” is an anti Semitic slur. 

 

Please explain so I don’t offensively use this remark. I’m not meaning to be sarcastic in any sense, but I’ve never heard anyone say this before, and I’m confused. 

[That's No Moon]

9 hours ago, chris heff said:

You do realize that people from Long Island pay taxes in New York State and the UB is a State college. And I hope that everyone else will recognize that  “ Lon G’ Islanders” is an anti Semitic slur. 

It is? Everyone on Lawn Guileland is Jewish? I think the Jesuit who taught me social studies in 11th and 12th grade would disagree.

[chris heff]

14 minutes ago, That's No Moon said:

It is? Everyone on Lawn Guileland is Jewish? I think the Jesuit who taught me social studies in 11th and 12th grade would disagree.

Did you read his entire post? He also says everyone from Long Island is rich and cheep at best that statement is stereotyping at worst it is a racial trope. I lived on Long Island and no not everyone is Jewish, but that particular accent both you and the original poster mimicked would be stereotyping a NYC area Jewish American accent. You took Social Studies in 11th and 12th grade? The Franciscan nuns taught me Social Studies in 5th and 6th grade. If I recall correctly Social Studies combined geography with culture, I don’t remember it ridiculing regional accents.

[SirAndrew]

23 minutes ago, chris heff said:

Did you read his entire post? He also says everyone from Long Island is rich and cheep at best that statement is stereotyping at worst it is a racial trope. I lived on Long Island and no not everyone is Jewish, but that particular accent both you and the original poster mimicked would be stereotyping a NYC area Jewish American accent. You took Social Studies in 11th and 12th grade? The Franciscan nuns taught me Social Studies in 5th and 6th grade. If I recall correctly Social Studies combined geography with culture, I don’t remember it ridiculing regional accents.

So native Long Islanders who are Irish, Italian, etc don’t have the Long Island accent ? 

[chris heff]

4 minutes ago, SirAndrew said:

So native Long Islanders who are Irish, Italian, etc don’t have the Long Island accent ? 

No not all it depends on where you are. The original poster objects to students from Long Island because their parents are rich and cheep. Rich and cheep is a Jewish stereotype and has been for centuries, the Irish and Italians have their own stereotypes, which is not rich and cheep. When you combine rich and cheep with that particular accent who do you conclude he is writing about?

[Mr. WEO]

19 hours ago, BillStime said:

1) Yea - shocker - developers taking advantage of public money. Find a publicly funded project that doesn’t. 

 

2) Not the governments fault Tesla hasn't met growth expectations and is still slowly ramping up.

 

3) Downtown stadium isn’t going to go to remote, unaccessible location like the Tesla plant.

 

And let’s keep repeating the same mistakes from the past 50 years and ensure there is zero economic impact to the region building in OP.

 

You said this:  "Areas like WNY only get one transformational opportunity a lifetime to capitalize on a billion plus dollar opportunity."

 

Buffalo got the billion (not just for a Tesla plant) from the State.  It was a criminal enterprise.

 

Another billion for a rarely used stadium (in OP, not downtown) cannot bring "transformation" and is always a bad (not good) public investment.

[That's No Moon]

1 hour ago, chris heff said:

Did you read his entire post? He also says everyone from Long Island is rich and cheep at best that statement is stereotyping at worst it is a racial trope. I lived on Long Island and no not everyone is Jewish, but that particular accent both you and the original poster mimicked would be stereotyping a NYC area Jewish American accent. You took Social Studies in 11th and 12th grade? The Franciscan nuns taught me Social Studies in 5th and 6th grade. If I recall correctly Social Studies combined geography with culture, I don’t remember it ridiculing regional accents.

Well if you want to be technical it was AP American History and AP World History but I didn't realize I needed to be that specific. To answer your question, no actually I didn't read his entire post. FTR I've had multiple people in my life, including quite recently insist that Long Island be pronounced the way I spelled it. Oddly, all of those people are actually from Long Island and all of them are Italian. I don't know what that means but it is what it is. Also, one can acknowledge linguist differences without mocking them. Finally, Long Island sucks.

[chris heff]

28 minutes ago, That's No Moon said:

Well if you want to be technical it was AP American History and AP World History but I didn't realize I needed to be that specific. To answer your question, no actually I didn't read his entire post. FTR I've had multiple people in my life, including quite recently insist that Long Island be pronounced the way I spelled it. Oddly, all of those people are actually from Long Island and all of them are Italian. I don't know what that means but it is what it is. Also, one can acknowledge linguist differences without mocking them. Finally, Long Island sucks.

I lived on Long Island for years, no one ever suggested I pronounce it that way and furthermore most of them didn’t pronounce it that way, even the Italian ones. In the original post that you admittedly didn’t read in its entirety, the poster objected to students from LI attending UB. His premise, as he mocked the accent, was that their rich and cheep parents should send them to private schools. “Rich and cheep” is an anti Semitic trope, centuries old, Shakespeare wrote a whole play about in the sixteenth century and it was probably centuries old then. If the original used that accent and the implied that the students from LI had a horse’s head cut off and put in the Dean’s bed, then he would have been talking about Italians.