Tim Graham at The Athletic suggests shaking things up and demoting Daboll this week

[Mat68]

Just now, GunnerBill said:

 

It is hard to plan draft strategy this far out. This past class was a really good OL group. If Brown pans out they have 3 good tackles. Dion's illness is something you just can't legislate for. I would look for upgrades at guard in free agency personally. 

I feel like Buffalo are going to draft 2 OLinman and 2 dbs forever.  They will win some and lose some.  Doyle has potential.  Brown I think is very good.  A few more bad games and he is on the field.  If the line is going to be a work in progress give me the 6-8 guy who moves like a Te.  

[BADOLBILZ]

28 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

That wasn't just bad oline play. It was an utter beat down. What plays do you wanna run when three Dlinemen were getting off the line practically untouched on some plays? 

 

 

Yesterday you said the Bills had time to throw deep?  Upon further review?

 

Yeah the OL play was bad.........but c'mon GB and @dave mcbride.........you gotta' adjust much sooner than Daboll did.   No excuse for the hard-headedness.

 

And it's not just 1 game.........their offense was bad in the playoffs last year as well.........Daboll needs to stop being Mike Martzesque and be willing to adapt.

[RiotAct]

18 minutes ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said:

'You be the OC' promotion for season ticket holders?! 🤔  I am seeing boffo big fan buy in, Timmah!

*
🙄

Joe from West Seneca who always calls into WGR drunkenly will finally get his chance!

[dave mcbride]

24 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Yesterday you said the Bills had time to throw deep?  Upon further review?

 

Yeah the OL play was bad.........but c'mon GB and @dave mcbride.........you gotta' adjust much sooner than Daboll did.   No excuse for the hard-headedness.

 

And it's not just 1 game.........their offense was bad in the playoffs last year as well.........Daboll needs to stop being Mike Martzesque and be willing to adapt.

See the Steelers D stats last season and DVOA numbers. See how the Bills have fared against them three years running. And factor in that while Daboll has flaws and is far from perfect, the Bills offense had arguably its best season ever last year outside of maybe 1991. I know it's really easy to criticize, and that's OK (it's a message board), but teams face adversity and failure all of the time. It's one game out of 17. They actually didn't play badly vs. the Ravens either; they missed 2 FGs and board favorite Gabe Davis dropped an easy TD pass. Plus they went into ball control mode after going up 17-3 and facing a garbage QB. That game is a bad example. KC destroyed them, sure, but partly because the line was utterly overwhelmed by Chris Jones and Frank Clark in a four-man rush.

Edited September 15, 2021 by dave mcbride

[GunnerBill]

34 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Yesterday you said the Bills had time to throw deep?  Upon further review?

 

Yeah the OL play was bad.........but c'mon GB and @dave mcbride.........you gotta' adjust much sooner than Daboll did.   No excuse for the hard-headedness.

 

And it's not just 1 game.........their offense was bad in the playoffs last year as well.........Daboll needs to stop being Mike Martzesque and be willing to adapt.

 

I said they threw deep a few times, it anything Josh failed to take throws that were there underneath. Hard to know whether that was scheme and design or reads. 

 

And I have consistently said - as had @dave mcbride that Daboll got plenty wrong on Sunday. But I don't believe there is much adjustment for OL play that bad that is going to make it look good. I gave the Dennison @ Jets example from 2017 where he took the opposite route to Daboll and the more we got beat up front the more he tried the big bodies in and the Quarterback boots off of that and that didn't work either.  While the coordinator deserves some criticism for his plan and playcalling Sunday, I am not at all sold there is much that works when you OL is that thoroughly beaten. 

 

EDIT: with regards specifically to Sunday I have said, which I think you agree with, that he could have tried more play action to freeze the rush, there was a noticeable lack of it. I have said Daboll's situational play calling - third/fourth down and redzone - was poor, and the idea early to use McKenzie out of the backfield (presumably as an outlet receiver on swing passes etc) was abandoned once he got nicked up when they could have tried to use Breida in that way... otherwise why is he on the team? I am not absolving Daboll of blame at all. But my word the offensive line was destroyed. To the extent it limits what any playcaller wants to do.

Edited September 15, 2021 by GunnerBill

[BADOLBILZ]

27 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I said they threw deep a few times, it anything Josh failed to take throws that were there underneath. Hard to know whether that was scheme and design or reads. 

 

And I have consistently said - as had @dave mcbride that Daboll got plenty wrong on Sunday. But I don't believe there is much adjustment for OL play that bad that is going to make it look good. I gave the Dennison @ Jets example from 2017 where he took the opposite route to Daboll and the more we got beat up front the more he tried the big bodies in and the Quarterback boots off of that and that didn't work either.  While the coordinator deserves some criticism for his plan and playcalling Sunday, I am not at all sold there is much that works when you OL is that thoroughly beaten. 

 

EDIT: with regards specifically to Sunday I have said, which I think you agree with, that he could have tried more play action to freeze the rush, there was a noticeable lack of it. I have said Daboll's situational play calling - third/fourth down and redzone - was poor, and the idea early to use McKenzie out of the backfield (presumably as an outlet receiver on swing passes etc) was abandoned once he got nicked up when they could have tried to use Breida in that way... otherwise why is he on the team? I am not absolving Daboll of blame at all. But my word the offensive line was destroyed. To the extent it limits what any playcaller wants to do.

 

 

I can't believe I am having to hear "the OL was bad......so nothing OC could do to notably address OL struggles".

 

The OL being bad and the OC not keeping a RB in and/or running the ball or using play action do not belong categorized separately.

 

If they don't allow a punt block for a TD was the OL just too bad for them to win?

 

It was a close enough game that not making REASONABLE if not OBVIOUS adjustments is damning.

[dave mcbride]

1 minute ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

I can't believe I am having to hear "the OL was bad......so nothing OC could do to notably address OL struggles".

 

The OL being bad and the OC not keeping a RB in and/or running the ball or using play action do not belong categorized separately.

 

If they don't allow a punt block for a TD was the OL just too bad for them to win?

 

It was a close enough game that not making REASONABLE if not OBVIOUS adjustments is damning.

I don’t think anyone here is saying that Daboll had a good game. They’re reacting to Graham’s supremely dumb and clickbait-y suggestion (reliant on a very skewed understanding of the Ravens game) and crazy suggestions like let Allen call all the plays. Allen, who should have had three td passes, Daboll, and the line all underperformed. But the opponent has players too, and they played great except for breakdowns on the back end that Allen was incapable of exploiting. Even on that second bomb into double coverage, he had a wide open deep out throw to the right side. He went for the no chance big play instead of the easy 20+ yards.

[GunnerBill]

20 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

I can't believe I am having to hear "the OL was bad......so nothing OC could do to notably address OL struggles".

 

The OL being bad and the OC not keeping a RB in and/or running the ball or using play action do not belong categorized separately.

 

If they don't allow a punt block for a TD was the OL just too bad for them to win?

 

It was a close enough game that not making REASONABLE if not OBVIOUS adjustments is damning.

 

I am not saying they couldn't have won. Or they couldn't have found ways to have a little more success. But when you get demolished that badly up front it is hard to make anything go. 

[Patrick Duffy]

2 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I am not saying they couldn't have won. Or they couldn't have found ways to have a little more success. But when you get demolished that badly up front it is hard to make anything go. 

And what makes it even worse is they did it with just rushing 4 majority of time. 

[RichRiderBills]

I would just sit down w Daboll and tell him to get me 10 more runs per game and 5-10 less empty sets where we can threaten the run or get some help pass blocking. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

7 hours ago, MJS said:

That's silly.

 

I suppose Tim needs something to write about.

[SectionC3]

4 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Yesterday you said the Bills had time to throw deep?  Upon further review?

 

Yeah the OL play was bad.........but c'mon GB and @dave mcbride.........you gotta' adjust much sooner than Daboll did.   No excuse for the hard-headedness.

 

And it's not just 1 game.........their offense was bad in the playoffs last year as well.........Daboll needs to stop being Mike Martzesque and be willing to adapt.

Four bad performances in a row.  I completely agree with you. 

[Scott7975]

7 hours ago, 2020 Our Year For Sure said:

Daboll is a top 10 offensive coordinator.

 

Disagree.  Im going to put myself out there and probably get bashed for this but I am going to say it anyways.  I think Daboll is a joke.  He is terrible at his job.  His offense only works with an elite QB and above average receivers that all play perfect games.  He has no feel for the flow of the game.  No idea how to mix up the play calling.  No idea how to get a run game working.  No idea how to help out a struggling QB.  No idea how to help out a struggling oline. No idea how to make adjustments.  

 

The guy formulates a game plan and that's what it is from start to finish.  He calls goofy head scratching stuff multiple times a game.  A top 10 offensive coordinator should be able to take crappy players and have a respectable offense.  This guy has playmakers and a top 10 QB.  Hasn't figured out how to beat a physical zone defense yet.  

 

Daboll is like the opposite of Greg Roman but Roman can at least take a mediocre running back and make him look good.  He has been an OC in the league for a long time and has only had one good season.  Even in that season our O has put out some clunkers.

 

I typically can't stand Tim Graham but Daboll needs to get over himself somehow, so I can't say I didn't like the article.

[Putin]

7 hours ago, Sheneneh Jenkins said:

He didn't call the game well , but LOL at demoting him week 2

Stop it we need to shake things up anyone still has Rick Dennison number ???

I wonder what ScottLaw is thinking 🤔 about all this 

[US Egg]

I bit on the $.99 a month/1 year introductory offer, because of raves about how good the Athletic was.

 

Read it for one day. 

 

Cancelled.

 

[OrtonHearsaWho]

15 hours ago, IronMaidenBills said:

Would you be open to allowing Josh call his own plays like Kelly did? 

At least put Moss in to chip away a defender. He shouldn’t have been a scratch. Anything. We never even tried. That’s the most frustrating part. 

 

I really didn't understand Moss being a healthy scratch at all.  If he's healthy then he should be active.  I'm so sick of a skill position player like Taiwan Jones being active only for special teams.  I get that special teams is important but so is the offense, so when Moss - statistically one of the best pas protecting RBs in the entire league last year, and a pretty versatile back in general - is a healthy scratch, I just don't get it.

 

The article does sound a bit alarmist but I think Daboll is a bit overrated.  He's clearly a good coordinator but I think criticism is justified.  Motor was looking pretty effective and he ends up with two more carries than JA...to me that's not great.

[Maynard]

18 hours ago, Gugny said:

 

Daboll is an OC with a top 5 QB.

Yup, was going to say the same! 

[Orlando Buffalo]

These kind of comments are simply click bait. Daboll needs to up his game this week but we should not forget how good he was last year. 

[clearwater cadet]

Holy crap, guy went from head coach candidate to offensive assistance?

[Fan in San Diego]

Typical game 1 overaction.