Speed: John Brown vs E Sanders

[Virgil]

1 hour ago, ProcessTruster said:

Anyone concerned that John Brown's ability to keep safeties deep was lost when E Sanders replaced him?   

Anyone have their relative 40 times?    I don't recall Sanders being a burner.   Hope I am wrong..

Concerned we have a great, but less fast WR group, and secondaries will accordingly play tighter to the line of scrimmage.  

Diggs and Davis are our outside burners, if we are so inclined to use them that way.  Beasley and Sanders are space eaters 

[klos63]

1 hour ago, ProcessTruster said:

Anyone concerned that John Brown's ability to keep safeties deep was lost when E Sanders replaced him?   

Anyone have their relative 40 times?    I don't recall Sanders being a burner.   Hope I am wrong..

Concerned we have a great, but less fast WR group, and secondaries will accordingly play tighter to the line of scrimmage.  

I can't get myself to be remotely concerned about our WR group.

[Bookie Man]

Sanders 75 / 850 / 6

Davis 65 / 750 / 8 

[ProcessTruster]

23 minutes ago, BarleyNY said:

Sanders isn’t a burner anymore, but he still can separate very well and he should be productive here.  It surprised me that the Bills did not make getting a deep threat a priority.  But on the other hand losing Brown last season didn’t seem to hurt the passing game so maybe separation is what works with Allen and this offense.  A deep threat is always helpful for an offense but maybe it’s not as important for this one.  I dunno. We shall see. 

so it seems...  we don't bust that Seattle game open last year without that John Brown speed , not sure I see a guy like that on today's roster.  

[Max Fischer]

What do Beane, McDermott and Daboll think?

 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

19 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

Since when is Davis a burner?….Diggs is as close to a burner as it gets on the roster at WR…. They don’t really have a pure speed guy at the position… I think the OP has a point. Will be interested to see how defenses play us and if the lack of speed becomes a bit of an issue.

Give me a bunch of guys that can run all the routes, get separation, catch the ball, get the feet down. And they can run a 4.DGAF 40 😉 

[BigDingus]

Sanders has been a solid deep threat for years, and is also great from the slot. He consistently get separation which is what matters most. He's also playing in an offense that spreads the field more, and he's got good speed off the line. 

 

Yes, he's a bit slower than Brown, but not even close to slow. I know Google says his 40 time was 4.4 seconds, but in game he's shown to be quite fast when it matters. 

 

So I think he'll still provide an upgrade overall as long as he stays healthy

[SectionC3]

31 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

Since when is Davis a burner?….Diggs is as close to a burner as it gets on the roster at WR…. They don’t really have a pure speed guy at the position… I think the OP has a point. Will be interested to see how defenses play us and if the lack of speed becomes a bit of an issue.

Stevenson. 

[billybrew1]

1 hour ago, Sheneneh Jenkins said:

Is it that much difference in their speed to make much difference? Either way, I'm sure Sanders will draw his share of attention from opposing defenses regardless. imo I think Sanders is a slight improvement over Brown.

Sanders is a slight improvement over Brown when Brown is at his peak and 100% healthy.

So, Sanders is a significant weapon.....

 

Our four-wide O might be the most potent in the whole NFL, we'll see....

 

(we'll also what it looks like from time to time with McKenzie and/or Kumerow in there as well.

Daboll will run plays for both of those receivers to limit the wear and tear on the top four whether the top four gets beat up or not. You gotta use everyone on a SB run. Using Breida, Moss, Gilliam and Knox as well. Even little Timmy Sweeney......

 

 

[Doc Brown]

1 hour ago, GETTOTHE50 said:

Sanders is a slot receiver, brown isnt. Davis is the #2. Both him and Diggs are good deep threats.

Sanders plays outside too so he’s more versatile compared to Brown.  I suspect you’ll see Sanders and Davis split time opposite Diggs as the Z receiver in 11 personnel.  Then you’ll see Beasley and Sanders in the slot with Diggs and Davis outside in 10 personnel.

[GETTOTHE50]

1 hour ago, The Dean said:

 

Are you simply making stuff up?  

 

 

yea i was

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

Considering he missed 6 games, 2 other games he combined for one reception, and not once he gained 100 yards, the answer is NO. 

 

Agree too with the "Speed is over rated " group.  If they need speed then throw Stevenson out there, by week 4 he'll likely be back.

 

Recall last year calculating the difference between Browns fastest 40 times and G Davis.  On a 40 yard fly pattern the difference n speed equated to Brown being about 5 feet further down the field.  For that 5 feet to matter though, the CB needs to not be able to keep up with him and more importantly the pass has to be perfectly thrown for him to catch it on a dead run.  Think the biggest reason long passes aren't completed all that often is the throw isn't perfect.

[GoBills!]

Gabe Davis will be the bigger threat with Sanders and Beasley going in spots 3 & 4. Brown lost his spot to Gabe not Sanders. 

[skibum]

The Bills are stacked at WR with a bunch of gifted, smart athletes (mostly vets) who can always get open all over the place. They can all go deep - even Beasley. This shouldn't even be a conversation. 

 

Edited September 3, 2021 by skibum

[Scott7975]

I read somewhere that the Bills actually wanted Sanders before Brown but Sanders signed with the Saints so Brown was the next option. 

Edited September 3, 2021 by Scott7975

[BarleyNY]

46 minutes ago, ProcessTruster said:

so it seems...  we don't bust that Seattle game open last year without that John Brown speed , not sure I see a guy like that on today's roster.  

Honestly, I agree.  I’m being hopeful, but I can see missing that piece coming back to bite us

[Hapless Bills Fan]

25 minutes ago, ProcessTruster said:

Anyone concerned that John Brown's ability to keep safeties deep was lost when E Sanders replaced him?   

Anyone have their relative 40 times?    I don't recall Sanders being a burner.   Hope I am wrong..

Concerned we have a great, but less fast WR group, and secondaries will accordingly play tighter to the line of scrimmage.  

 

So Back in Da Day, John Brown ran a 4.34 at the 2014 combine.

Further Back in Da Day, Emmanuel Sanders ran a 4.41 at the 2010 combine.  That's not as fast, but still faster than many corners.

 

Fair question is: how much of that speed does each of them retain, today - 11 years and 7 years later, after multiple foot and ankle injuries and surgeries?

 

John Brown was 1) Out for 7+ games last season and relatively ineffective in 2 more 2) IMHO, not as fast when he returned from injury

 

A look at how the Bills passing game fared in those games would probably be indicative of whether your concerns are warranted

 

 

10 minutes ago, Scott7975 said:

I read somewhere that the Bills actually wanted Sanders before Brown but Sanders signed with the Saints so Brown was the next option. 

 

Sanders was still with Denver in the 2019 offseason when the Bills signed Brown

I believe it may be true that the Bills were interested in trading for him, but unwilling to offer the 3rd and 4th (with a 5th back) that San Fran offered.

[Virgil]

1 hour ago, ScottLaw said:

Since when is Davis a burner?….Diggs is as close to a burner as it gets on the roster at WR…. They don’t really have a pure speed guy at the position… I think the OP has a point. Will be interested to see how defenses play us and if the lack of speed becomes a bit of an issue.

Deep threat is Moreso what I meant 

[Mr. WEO]

1 hour ago, ProcessTruster said:

so it seems...  we don't bust that Seattle game open last year without that John Brown speed , not sure I see a guy like that on today's roster.  

 

Because Brown wouldn't even make this roster.  No chance.

[billybrew1]

1 hour ago, ScottLaw said:

Since when is Davis a burner?….Diggs is as close to a burner as it gets on the roster at WR…. They don’t really have a pure speed guy at the position… I think the OP has a point. Will be interested to see how defenses play us and if the lack of speed becomes a bit of an issue.

While not burners, both Diggs and Davis are fast enough to get open deep. So can Sanders, McKenzie and Stevenson.

Sure, I'd like a real flyer on the Bills ala Tyreek Hill But the Bills receiver's are fast enough to form one of the very tip-top best offenses in the league, quite possibly; the best.

 

I'd say the best is who puts up the most points this year. I like Buffalo a lot in this regard. We're certainly going to finish in the top three unless injuries really derail us.

 

I think fans tend to overate deep speed. It is why Devin Singletary is not a popular Bill. But Devin is going to start this year and he is going to do very well.

 

Go Bills!