McDermott's Cover 4 trap

[Buffalo716]

Part 2, of why Sean McDermott's defense is special 

 

One of his favorite looks is a standard cover four with a twist... It's called palms or 2 trap 

 

  

What this is, is a cover 4.. that can morph into a cover 2 look 

 

All the defensive backs are keyed on the inside receivers... They are the key to the play

 

If he runs vertical... The play sticks as a normal cover 4... If the inside receiver breaks out... The play reroutes to cover 2 look .. safety's take outside man.. outside corner takes outbreaking route

 

 

This is complex and you need smart players to run this... The communication and awareness needs to be top notch

 

This is one of Tre's best coverages... Because it allows him to use his instincts, acceleration and recovery speed... On those outbreaking routes

 

Poyer and Hyde in the back half allow this complex variation to be ran 

 

Against trip formations, bunches , etc this gives our defense the freedom to react and play  

 

There are very few teams in the league that employ this, because most don't have the personnel

 

 

[eball]

Well I'm glad you're giving away all of McD's secrets to our opponents...you know they are all over this board, right?  Geesh.

[Buffalo716]

10 minutes ago, eball said:

Well I'm glad you're giving away all of McD's secrets to our opponents...you know they are all over this board, right?  Geesh.

Belichick is everywhere 😳

[Bubba Gump]

My head hurts.....thanks

[Buffalo716]

2 minutes ago, Bubba Gump said:

My head hurts.....thanks

With a diagram there's nothing really simple about it, sorry

 

But I feel like my explanation is quite simple and it explains what McDermott does a lot

 

It's just a hybrid cover 4 that can morph into a cover 2 based on the slot receivers route... 

 

Slot Receiver breaks out, corner and safety basically flip receivers... 

 

Safety takes outsider receiver.. corner take slot receiver breaking out

[Bubba Gump]

5 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

With a diagram there's nothing really simple about it, sorry

 

But I feel like my explanation is quite simple and it explains what McDermott does a lot

 

It's just a hybrid cover 4 that can morph into a cover 2 based on the slot receivers route... 

 

Slot Receiver breaks out, corner and safety basically flip receivers... 

 

Safety takes outsider receiver.. corner take slot receiver breaking out

 

I've had season tickets for years, but have never really gotten into the logistics of playbooks or what have you. Been a fan for over 40 years and still don't understand half the language they use. But what you just wrote explains a lot to me. Thanks man!!! I just learned what A gap and B gap means, lol

[Utah John]

My biggest concern for this year, aside from injuries and other absences, is that the OCs and DCs around the league will have been studying what the Bills do, trying to figure out some way to attack us.  Fortunately (for us if not for them) both our OC and DC are both very creative, and they keep adapting and building.  

56 minutes ago, eball said:

Well I'm glad you're giving away all of McD's secrets to our opponents...you know they are all over this board, right?  Geesh.

If there's an NFL coordinator out there who learns anything from fan boards, that guy needs a new job.  They all know so much more than we do.  

[Apocalypse Nuts]

Really appreciate these Buffalo716.  I'm not a X's and O's kind of guy but I find this stuff fascinating.  Helps me appreciate what we are currently fortunate enough to be experiencing in B'lo.  Finally.  I'm still getting used to our Bills being so good and having really great coaching (and FO leadership). 

[Shaw66]

Thanks.   Good stuff, again.  I never knew that. 

 

The thing about this is that you've only scratched the surface.   Every team in the league knows that's what the Bills do, and I'm sure they tinker with their rout trees to try to confuse the corners and the safeties.  When number 2 runs a short out and up, if Tre's bitten on the fake too much, the safety finds two guys running deep in his zone.  And I'm sure there are much more sophisticated variations off that, too.  

 

When you start to think about the ways the receivers can challenge this set, you begin to understand how complicated the defensive processing is back there.  The Bills four defensive backs don't get beaten very often, even though they are playing schemes that require them to make quality reads and off receivers to one another.   It's an intricate dance. 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

4 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

Part 2, of why Sean McDermott's defense is special 

 

One of his favorite looks is a standard cover four with a twist... It's called palms or 2 trap 

 

  

What this is, is a cover 4.. that can morph into a cover 2 look 

 

All the defensive backs are keyed on the inside receivers... They are the key to the play

 

If he runs vertical... The play sticks as a normal cover 4... If the inside receiver breaks out... The play reroutes to cover 2 look .. safety's take outside man.. outside corner takes outbreaking route

 

 

This is complex and you need smart players to run this... The communication and awareness needs to be top notch

 

This is one of Tre's best coverages... Because it allows him to use his instincts, acceleration and recovery speed... On those outbreaking routes

 

Poyer and Hyde in the back half allow this complex variation to be ran 

 

Against trip formations, bunches , etc this gives our defense the freedom to react and play  

 

There are very few teams in the league that employ this, because most don't have the personnel

 

 

Andy Ried attacked the scheme really effectively. I’m think that requires special personnel too execute as well. 

[3rdand12]

Very well presented

 but the heck is it called palms
Protection ? keeping everything under ?
  Good stuff 716

[Buffalo Junction]

24 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

Andy Ried attacked the scheme really effectively. I’m think that requires special personnel too execute as well. 

Yes. You need at least 2-3 of an accurate QB with a arm strong enough to through deep outs on a rail, a receiver who can stretch the defense,  a TE or slot receiver that can exploit the seam, an excellent PA offense, and a third option that can beat a 1:1. Chiefs have four, and after what they did in the regular season we had to respect their ground game as well. Basically, you have to outrun the LBer and force the CB and safety to make choices. Allen & Co are also capable of exploiting this. The kicker is that you need time to get to the intermediate depths, so a dominant pass rush can kill any offensive play against palms.

[Old Coot]

49 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

When you start to think about the ways the receivers can challenge this set, you begin to understand how complicated the defensive processing is back there.  The Bills four defensive backs don't get beaten very often, even though they are playing schemes that require them to make quality reads and off receivers to one another.   It's an intricate dance. 

It is an intricate dance.  This is why coaches study and classify tendencies by down, distance and location.  They then design plays to take advantage of what the opponent is likely to call.  For example, n offense might design a pass play so that the routes on one side will work if its cover 4 and the routes on the other side if cover 2.  Alternatively the receivers may have read routes so they are reading what their man does and reacting accordingly.  But wait, there's more.  The DB's are also reading the receivers.  This is one reason that defenses usually are built conservatively -- so they won't get beaten deep.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

9 minutes ago, Buffalo Junction said:

Yes. You need at least 2-3 of an accurate QB with a arm strong enough to through deep outs on a rail, a receiver who can stretch the defense,  a TE or slot receiver that can exploit the seam, an excellent PA offense, and a third option that can beat a 1:1. Chiefs have four, and after what they did in the regular season we had to respect their ground game as well. Basically, you have to outrun the LBer and force the CB and safety to make choices. Allen & Co are also capable of exploiting this. The kicker is that you need time to get to the intermediate depths, so a dominant pass rush can kill any offensive play against palms.

Hence picks #1 and #2

42 minutes ago, 3rdand12 said:

Very well presented

 but the heck is it called palms
Protection ? keeping everything under ?
  Good stuff 716

I always assumed because the zone drops look like a palm tree in the playbook, but good question. 

[Buffalo716]

1 hour ago, Shaw66 said:

Thanks.   Good stuff, again.  I never knew that. 

 

The thing about this is that you've only scratched the surface.   Every team in the league knows that's what the Bills do, and I'm sure they tinker with their rout trees to try to confuse the corners and the safeties.  When number 2 runs a short out and up, if Tre's bitten on the fake too much, the safety finds two guys running deep in his zone.  And I'm sure there are much more sophisticated variations off that, too.  

 

When you start to think about the ways the receivers can challenge this set, you begin to understand how complicated the defensive processing is back there.  The Bills four defensive backs don't get beaten very often, even though they are playing schemes that require them to make quality reads and off receivers to one another.   It's an intricate dance. 

Yes and you're absolutely correct 

 

McDermott runs a good amount of variations of cover 4.. 

 

If he stayed in the palms look too much.. he can get exploited by certain route combinations

 

It's all a chess match.. every team in the league has great athletes and great football players... You need the Chess Master to put them in the right spots 

 

Very rarely is a bills player playing a role he isn't best suited for

18 minutes ago, Old Coot said:

It is an intricate dance.  This is why coaches study and classify tendencies by down, distance and location.  They then design plays to take advantage of what the opponent is likely to call.  For example, n offense might design a pass play so that the routes on one side will work if its cover 4 and the routes on the other side if cover 2.  Alternatively the receivers may have read routes so they are reading what their man does and reacting accordingly.  But wait, there's more.  The DB's are also reading the receivers.  This is one reason that defenses usually are built conservatively -- so they won't get beaten deep.

Yes down distance and tendency are the keys to the chess match

 

Basically every coach has certain tendencies that they like to do in certain situations

 

And you try to game plan as much around that as you can..  McDermott mixes up his zone combinations better than anyone in the League

[Hapless Bills Fan]

5 hours ago, Utah John said:

My biggest concern for this year, aside from injuries and other absences, is that the OCs and DCs around the league will have been studying what the Bills do, trying to figure out some way to attack us. 

 

Of course they have, and in fact they'll be looking very hard at games like the AFCCG where the Bills struggled offensively.   But part of the ability to shut us down on offense or overcome our defense isn't just knowing what we do and having a good plan - it's having the personnel to execute that plan.

 

A lot of teams would like to shut the Ravens down, and many studied what the Bills and what Tennessee did last year, and had some success implementing it, so the Ravens offense wasn't quite so prolific.  The Ravens had the #7 offense instead of #1, and were 11-5 instead of 14-2.  But they still won 11 games and gained more than 400 yds 6x because having a plan isn't the same thing as executing it.

 

5 hours ago, Utah John said:

Fortunately (for us if not for them) both our OC and DC are both very creative, and they keep adapting and building.  

 

Yep, that's part of the key.  Having players with a growth mindset who keep improving is another part.

 

5 hours ago, Utah John said:

If there's an NFL coordinator out there who learns anything from fan boards, that guy needs a new job.  They all know so much more than we do.  

 

This. 

[GunnerBill]

3 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Of course they have, and in fact they'll be looking very hard at games like the AFCCG where the Bills struggled offensively.   But part of the ability to shut us down on offense or overcome our defense isn't just knowing what we do and having a good plan - it's having the personnel to execute that plan.

 

A lot of teams would like to shut the Ravens down, and many studied what the Bills and what Tennessee did last year, and had some success implementing it, so the Ravens offense wasn't quite so prolific.  The Ravens had the #7 offense instead of #1, and were 11-5 instead of 14-2.  But they still won 11 games and gained more than 400 yds 6x because having a plan isn't the same thing as executing it.

 

Yep. You can be the best Xs and Os guy in the world. You have to have talented players. Whether that is to stop the Bills or the Ravens or whatever team it is you think you have figured out. I used to say this a lot on here when the Bills were bad and fans would say "why don't they just do X and Y" and the answer was very often - they don't have the players to execute.

[K-9]

3 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yep. You can be the best Xs and Os guy in the world. You have to have talented players. Whether that is to stop the Bills or the Ravens or whatever team it is you think you have figured out. I used to say this a lot on here when the Bills were bad and fans would say "why don't they just do X and Y" and the answer was very often - they don't have the players to execute.

Like Marv always said, schemes don’t win games, players do. Gotta have the horses. That simple. 

[GunnerBill]

12 minutes ago, K-9 said:

Like Marv always said, schemes don’t win games, players do. Gotta have the horses. That simple. 

 

It's the Jimmys and Joes not the Xs and Os. We had this debate in the shoutbox last year. I think the NFL is broadly 2/3s talent and 1/3 coaching. Your coaching can be great... and a Sean McDermott can get the 2017 Bills to 9 wins rather than 7 wins and Bill Belichick can get the 2020 Patriots to 7 wins rather than 4 wins. But ultimately at the end of the day talent normally wins out and coaching is the fine margins. 

[HoofHearted]

High Schools and Colleges have been running this for years - it's funny to me that this is being played off in the NFL as something "new" and "innovative".