ColoradoBills Posted August 22, 2021 Posted August 22, 2021 18 minutes ago, EmotionallyUnstable said: Anyone have any clue how injury settlements work? I imagine it has to do with the specific players contract value? They can be quite complicated and confusing. First it's not a "settlement" it's more of an agreement that both sides have to approve. It is normally dependent on the type of players contract. Drafted players have different rights to money lets say than UDFAs. I will only use Phillips situation as an example. He is a drafted rookie. One way or another if the Bills "cut" him he still gets his guaranteed signing bonus. If his injury is determined that he would miss half of a season he gets game checks for that amount of time. That's is the crux of it. How long is the injury. One thing is a team that agrees to an injury settlement cannot re-sign the player when he gets better. 1
YoloinOhio Posted August 22, 2021 Author Posted August 22, 2021 (edited) Edited August 22, 2021 by YoloinOhio 15 4 5
Warcodered Posted August 22, 2021 Posted August 22, 2021 1 minute ago, YoloinOhio said: PUP? McDermott said potentially a week or two so I don't know maybe with how well he's playing and it being the same knee they're just going to sit him until the season starts. 2
Albanybillsbacker Posted August 22, 2021 Posted August 22, 2021 6 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said: PUP? A player that has participated in any practice or preseason game after training camp starts cannot be put on the PUP. 1
Hapless Bills Fan Posted August 22, 2021 Posted August 22, 2021 37 minutes ago, EmotionallyUnstable said: Anyone have any clue how injury settlements work? I imagine it has to do with the specific players contract value? It depends upon how many years the player has in the league as well as their contract. Many veterans have a contract where their salary is fully guaranteed for injury. As a 3rd round pick, I don't think Phillips has that nor, entering his 4th season, does the "vested veteran salary benefit" where he gets his full season salary even if cut, apply if he's on the roster Day 1. If a young player who does not have injury guarantees or a vested veteran benefit after 4 years in the league is injured, the team can place him on IR (in which case he gets paid, but can't play). For a player like Phillips in a contract year, he may want to return and show he can play so as to earn a better contract next season. Or, he may want to rehab and rehabilitate away from the team facility, at a place of his own choosing. In that case, the player asks for an injury settlement. The team and the player's representatives first agree on the normal course of rehabilitating the injury. Say Phillips has a sprained (but not torn) ACL, which is a 4-6 week rehab. The parties agree on a 5 week settlement. There's 3 weeks until Opening Day. Phillips would be released with 2 weeks salary (5 weeks - 3 weeks of preseason), which for him would be about $102,000. The team also pays the cost of his medical treatment and rehabilitation, as well as for a 2nd medical opinion if he wants one. This is an old article but I don't believe it's changed substantially. https://www.nationalfootballpost.com/columns/off-the-field/what-is-an-injury-settlement/ 1 2
Giuseppe Tognarelli Posted August 22, 2021 Posted August 22, 2021 8 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said: PUP? Less than an hour ago, McDermott did not give this impression; many were saying it sounded like IR is coming (I haven't had a chance to listen yet, but I'm going based off MLJ's tweet and others). Now this from Rapoport right away. Methinks this is coming from Phillips' agent.
Motorin' Posted August 22, 2021 Posted August 22, 2021 18 minutes ago, Bangarang said: As soon as Harry starts playing really well he gets injured. Hate seeing that Wasn't that Eric Woods first few years too?
Hapless Bills Fan Posted August 22, 2021 Posted August 22, 2021 14 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said: They can be quite complicated and confusing. First it's not a "settlement" it's more of an agreement that both sides have to approve. It is normally dependent on the type of players contract. Drafted players have different rights to money lets say than UDFAs. I will only use Phillips situation as an example. He is a drafted rookie. One way or another if the Bills "cut" him he still gets his guaranteed signing bonus. If his injury is determined that he would miss half of a season he gets game checks for that amount of time. That's is the crux of it. How long is the injury. One thing is a team that agrees to an injury settlement cannot re-sign the player when he gets better. This last is not quite correct. The team can re-sign the player, but not until the end of his injury settlement + 6 weeks. So, using the example of a 5 week injury settlement with 3 weeks left in the pre-season, the Bills could re-sign Phillips after week 8. 2
Warcodered Posted August 22, 2021 Posted August 22, 2021 2 minutes ago, Giuseppe Tognarelli said: Less than an hour ago, McDermott did not give this impression; many were saying it sounded like IR is coming (I haven't had a chance to listen yet, but I'm going based off MLJ's tweet and others). Now this from Rapoport right away. Methinks this is coming from Phillips' agent. The interview is on Bills Twitter and they talk injuries right away. McDermott said they didn't have any long term injuries and the longest he said was potentially a week or two. 4 1
SCBills Posted August 22, 2021 Posted August 22, 2021 I think a lot of us really want Harry to succeed - he’s such a good dude, and when healthy, a good player. That said, the staff loves Zimmer, and Harry isn’t noticeably better than Butler… Love to keep all of them, but if we have to choose, you’ve got to pick the guy who stays healthy.
LabattBlue Posted August 22, 2021 Posted August 22, 2021 He is a guy that is the perfect fit on a team that wants to use a sizeable rotation on the DL...and he’s a good guy. I wish him only the best with his recovery. 1 1
YoloinOhio Posted August 22, 2021 Author Posted August 22, 2021 6 minutes ago, Albanybillsbacker said: A player that has participated in any practice or preseason game after training camp starts cannot be put on the PUP. Short term IR could be an option, would be only min 3 weeks … plus 3 weeks until week 1 would give him 6 but, sounds like it might be even less than that needed
Captain Caveman Posted August 22, 2021 Posted August 22, 2021 (edited) 23 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Right. So what we did last year with (I believe it was) Tommy Sweeney could work. Sweeney, who had a foot injury, was on the initial 53. To accomodate him, we actually cut a player we truly wanted to keep, Andre Roberts, whom other teams immediately tried to sign. Roberts had a "gentleman's agreement" with Beane, which he honored. As soon as the season began, Sweeney was placed on IR and Roberts was re-signed at his original contract, but with his season's salary fully guaranteed as it would have been if he'd been on the 53 man roster opening day. One thing though, in order for this to work the player cut has to not be open to Waivers (cause if they are and another team claims them they don't have the option to sign with the Bills.) Edited August 22, 2021 by Captain Caveman 1
CSBill Posted August 22, 2021 Posted August 22, 2021 (edited) I do hope it is not serious. Right now Phillips is better than Butler. I would much rather have Harry getting snaps than him. Edited August 23, 2021 by CSBill 1 5
jkeerie Posted August 22, 2021 Posted August 22, 2021 2 minutes ago, SCBills said: I think a lot of us really want Harry to succeed - he’s such a good dude, and when healthy, a good player. That said, the staff loves Zimmer, and Harry isn’t noticeably better than Butler… Love to keep all of them, but if we have to choose, you’ve got to pick the guy who stays healthy. I think I disagree. I think Phillips took a step and looked markedly better than Butler this preseason, particularly against Chicago. You didn't notice Butler when he was in there. You did notice Phillips. He was getting nice push up the middle. 2 5
ColoradoBills Posted August 22, 2021 Posted August 22, 2021 9 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: If a young player who does not have injury guarantees or a vested veteran benefit after 4 years in the league is injured, the team can place him on IR (in which case he gets paid, but can't play). For a player like Phillips in a contract year, he may want to return and show he can play so as to earn a better contract next season. Or, he may want to rehab and rehabilitate away from the team facility, at a place of his own choosing. That is all true but any player accepting a settlement becomes a FA but cannot resign with the original team once he is cleared to play. That rule is there so teams don't use this technique to stash players for future use.
Process Posted August 22, 2021 Posted August 22, 2021 Sucks but if we make it through TC and preseason with this being the worst injury we are in really good shape. 1
ColoradoBills Posted August 22, 2021 Posted August 22, 2021 10 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: This last is not quite correct. The team can re-sign the player, but not until the end of his injury settlement + 6 weeks. So, using the example of a 5 week injury settlement with 3 weeks left in the pre-season, the Bills could re-sign Phillips after week 8. I thought that got changed. The article you quoted is dated 2014. Like I said I thought that got changed when the newer IR rules came out but I could be wrong on that one point. It really doesn't matter too much though because these are usually players with smaller contracts.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted August 22, 2021 Posted August 22, 2021 Just now, ColoradoBills said: That is all true but any player accepting a settlement becomes a FA but cannot resign with the original team once he is cleared to play. That rule is there so teams don't use this technique to stash players for future use. again, not quite - there is a 6 week "signing moratorium" but the player can be re-signed (and the NFL doesn't control the terms of the new contract). Let's use Phillips as an example. Suppose Phillips accepts a 5 week injury settlement starting now. He gets 3 weeks of preseason plus 2 weeks of his $51,000 per game salary, then the Bills can't re-sign him for 6 weeks (costing him $306,000 in salary). Suppose the offers he gets to sign are from teams he really doesn't want to play for - the Lions, Jets, and Bengals, say. The Bills could re-sign him in Week 9 at a salary of $85,000/week, which would cover his missing 6 weeks of salary. This is all theoretical of course.
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