GunnerBill Posted July 23, 2021 Posted July 23, 2021 2 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said: The disparity in quality of ILB/MLB players between the AFC and NFC is huge. I understand why casual observers don't understand this.............but this can happen at a devalued position and it can not be reflected by the play of the teams in those conferences. Because defenses aren't built from the MLB outward anymore. They are built around edge rushers and lock down CB's. If the Bills intend their D to be built around their MLB as so many Edmunds excuse makers claim........and Edmunds doesn't improve significantly.........they will continue to be a paper tiger defense. I agree. It can even happen at critical positions too - look at the Quarterback disparity currently - the AFC is stacked with young talented QBs and the NFC has 2 or 3 older guys hanging on. The difference of course being that disparity gets reflected eventually in wins and losses. Off the ball linebackers do not affect the bottom line in the same way. On the final point I do think McDermott's scheme does ask more of the MLB than a lot of others in the league so it is less devalued in Buffalo than elsewhere. Pete Carroll's Seattle's defense does too - which is why it has always made sense for them to pay Bobby Wagner. The issue is at the moment Tremaine Edmunds is no Bobby Wagner. The Bills need better play and more consistent play than they got out of Edmunds last year for certain. Otherwise they need to think about how they replace him because his play so far does not justify the sort of money Warner just got.
BarleyNY Posted July 23, 2021 Posted July 23, 2021 22 hours ago, thurst44 said: My favorite is he "never makes a big play." He may not rack up stats (yet), but I've re-watched games and see so many examples. He sacked a guy in the end zone for a safety. I also don't get the "lack of instincts" tag. He's captaining a lot of the defensive schemes, and led a top 3 D two years ago. Last year was ridiculous, so I'll give them a pass on the middle-of-the-league defense. Maybe when you think he's showing "bad instincts" he's actually doing what he's supposed to do? That “never makes a play” straw man comment is just wrong. Even those of us with concerns about Edmunds’ play talk about him making plays. The main criticism of him is that he’s inconsistent. That’s generally attributed to below average instincts, which was a concern well covered in his draft profiles. Great splash plays mixed with missed assignments. But it did occur to me that he might be playing as coached, as you mention. I just don’t think that’s the case though. He’s too prone to do things like leave his assignment and overpursue, leaving RBs free to run through his gap. I just can’t see coaches telling a player to take those chances. He gets lost in coverage a fair bit too. The caveat is that MLB is a very difficult position to play and few grade out all that well. But those players who do cost what Edmunds will. And since you can get a more consistent, but less spectacular MLB for a much smaller contract, you can expect to find similar overall production for a lot less. The Bills are definitely at the point where the cap dictates decisions between which players to pay. That’s what it boils down to: Is Edmunds worth the very large contract it will cost to keep him after 2022? If he can clean up the miscues while still making big plays, then he probably will be worth it. If we get more of what we’ve seen so far, then probably not. But some team will probably take the risk and give it to him. I don’t want that to be Buffalo unless he takes that next step.
BADOLBILZ Posted July 23, 2021 Posted July 23, 2021 7 hours ago, GunnerBill said: I agree. It can even happen at critical positions too - look at the Quarterback disparity currently - the AFC is stacked with young talented QBs and the NFC has 2 or 3 older guys hanging on. The difference of course being that disparity gets reflected eventually in wins and losses. Off the ball linebackers do not affect the bottom line in the same way. On the final point I do think McDermott's scheme does ask more of the MLB than a lot of others in the league so it is less devalued in Buffalo than elsewhere. Pete Carroll's Seattle's defense does too - which is why it has always made sense for them to pay Bobby Wagner. The issue is at the moment Tremaine Edmunds is no Bobby Wagner. The Bills need better play and more consistent play than they got out of Edmunds last year for certain. Otherwise they need to think about how they replace him because his play so far does not justify the sort of money Warner just got. Yeah Wagner is an interesting case in point as it relates to the Bills and their defense...........because the Seahawks went from being both the youngest team in the NFL and the SB champion in the same season..........to very flawed in just a couple years once they paid their defensive standouts. As it so happened, aside from Sherman, the big names on that defense were off-ball LB and safeties........and once they paid those guys they couldn't afford to roll the DL like they once used to and the defense went from great to middling(and worse). They sacrificed on the lines on both sides of the ball to pay big names that, in hindsight, really needed to be supported by excellent edge/island and interior DL play to field a championship type defense. That doesn't necessarily mean a "top 5" statistical defense.........but one that can support a high powered offense by rushing the passer or being great in coverage. They put the frosting before the cake, IMO. If the Bills win one SB like the Seahawks did.......then we could probably happily accept 5-7 years of Josh Allen trying to carry a flawed team to the WC or divisional round like what's been going on in Seattle..........but I think the lesson to be learned from the Seahawks is not to do what they did. You shouldn't fall in love with off-ball LB and safeties and have them eating up huge amounts of cap space. 1
GunnerBill Posted July 23, 2021 Posted July 23, 2021 (edited) 29 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said: Yeah Wagner is an interesting case in point as it relates to the Bills and their defense...........because the Seahawks went from being both the youngest team in the NFL and the SB champion in the same season..........to very flawed in just a couple years once they paid their defensive standouts. As it so happened, aside from Sherman, the big names on that defense were off-ball LB and safeties........and once they paid those guys they couldn't afford to roll the DL like they once used to and the defense went from great to middling(and worse). They sacrificed on the lines on both sides of the ball to pay big names that, in hindsight, really needed to be supported by excellent edge/island and interior DL play to field a championship type defense. That doesn't necessarily mean a "top 5" statistical defense.........but one that can support a high powered offense by rushing the passer or being great in coverage. They put the frosting before the cake, IMO. If the Bills win one SB like the Seahawks did.......then we could probably happily accept 5-7 years of Josh Allen trying to carry a flawed team to the WC or divisional round like what's been going on in Seattle..........but I think the lesson to be learned from the Seahawks is not to do what they did. You shouldn't fall in love with off-ball LB and safeties and have them eating up huge amounts of cap space. Yea I do agree that they had too much money tied up in lower priority positions - you could throw Lynch and for a period Jimmy Graham in there too (that Unger for Graham trade was the moment their dynasty hopes died IMO - one of the stupidest decisions I can remember). But I struggle to make a case that they should have moved on from Bobby Wagner. They were still paying Bennett and Avril decent money as their edge guys at the time he wasn't stopping them doing that. They probably should have chosen 1 of the safeties not both but for me the biggest issue in Seattle was their constant wasting of high draft picks. No team has a worse day 1 drafting record than Seattle in the past decade. It is literally the worst in the league. In fact in the last 5 drafts before 2021 they have made 10 selections in the first two rounds and of them only DK Metcalf has proven himself more than a replacement level player to this point. When you draft that poorly it is really, really difficult to stay competitive for Championships. Even when you have Russell Wilson. The Bills have to draft better than Seattle have. Edited July 23, 2021 by GunnerBill 2
Starr Almighty Posted July 24, 2021 Posted July 24, 2021 Well PFF 👈🤣🤣🤣 hates Edmunds https://billswire.usatoday.com/2021/07/23/pro-football-focus-tremaine-edmunds-hype-linebacker-rankings-matt-milano/
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