Voice of the Eagles Merrill Reese: the word is Bills are close to finalizing deal with Zach Ertz

[Rochesterfan]

2 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Yeah that's what the topic was.  If this year we add a 4th RB with the signing of Breida.  He gives us that speed dynamic.  

Unless we find someone that can contribute on ST likes Jones but not at the RB position.  

I wonder if there's a change Singletary is moved?  I think they like Moss.

 

Honestly depending on pre-season - my guess would be Brenda takes the place of Yeldon and most weeks is sat.  The only difference is if Kumerow beats out Jones as a gunner and then Jones is cut.

 

I would expect 3 RBs active each week.

 

I also would not be surprised (depending on the Ertz situation) if Knox, Hollister, and Sweeney are the only active TEs with Hollister taking Gilliam’s ST role.

[Logic]

12 hours ago, 4merper4mer said:

Tony Gonzalez also blows now.  Should we sign him or maybe Antonio Gates?  

Zach Ertz is 30. Not 36 or 37, but 30. He had ONE bad year, during which he played through injuries, horrendous QB play, and team dysfunction.

Prior to that, he had 900, 1100, and 800 yard seasons.

 

Comparing him to a retired player doesn’t add any credibility to your argument. One down year doesn’t mean the guy “blows”.

[Royale with Cheese]

3 minutes ago, Rochesterfan said:

 

Honestly depending on pre-season - my guess would be Brenda takes the place of Yeldon and most weeks is sat.  The only difference is if Kumerow beats out Jones as a gunner and then Jones is cut.

 

I would expect 3 RBs active each week.

 

I also would not be surprised (depending on the Ertz situation) if Knox, Hollister, and Sweeney are the only active TEs with Hollister taking Gilliam’s ST role.

 

I personally like Kumerow and wouldn't mind if that happens.  He gives us that big WR redzone target and I think has sure hands.  

I hope Breida isn't sat just because I think we need that speed.  Teams that were aggressive coming after us up front, having Breida on a screen pass could be deadly.  Singletary let us down last year twice with drops.  The AZ game he would have walked into the endzone....and of course the AFCCG.  I think McDermott doesn't forget that.

 

2 minutes ago, Logic said:

Zach Ertz is 30. Not 36 or 37, but 30. He had ONE bad year, during which he played through injuries, horrendous QB play, and team dysfunction.

Prior to that, he had 900, 1100, and 800 yard seasons.

 

Comparing him to a retired player doesn’t add any credibility to your argument. One down year doesn’t mean the guy “blows”.

 

Tony Gonzalez is 45 years old lol. 

This guy has been leading the parade of Ertz hate for whatever reason.

Edited July 2, 2021 by Royale with Cheese

[YoloinOhio]

10 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Yeah that's what the topic was.  If this year we add a 4th RB with the signing of Breida.  He gives us that speed dynamic.  

Unless we find someone that can contribute on ST likes Jones but not at the RB position.  

I wonder if there's a change Singletary is moved?  I think they like Moss.

I don’t see them having 4 active. One is always banged up. If they are all healthy, They will activate Jones plus the two that match up best with the defense they play that week. 

[Rochesterfan]

Just now, SCBills said:

I agree with some of this, but Josh clearly utilized Beasley as his “move the chains” guy… No reason to think he wouldn’t use Ertz as well.  
 

Also, from all the observations of Ertz at this point in his career, he’s a sure-handed, leverage-reading zone killer.  Sure would be nice to have that weapon to pull out of the bag, because no team wants to go man against Diggs, Beasley and Sanders while turning their backs to Allen. 

 

Totally agree, but he didn’t use Beasley like you would Ertz.  Beasley would come off the line flying and he would hit him after breaks as he gained separation.

 

Ertz doesn’t really gain a ton of separation- he finds that soft spot turns around and posts up - that is something Josh has not really utilized- even when we saw TEs like Kroft do that for him.  
 

Like I said - I get the reasons Ertz could be a huge plus - I just think on the current Bills offense - he is still the 5th option (much like Knox and Kroft were) and his targets and plays would be hugely limited.  He would be a nice target near the goal line as that is we’re Josh seems to really find his TEs.

[Blainorama5]

9 minutes ago, Rochesterfan said:

He would be a nice target near the goal line as that is we’re Josh seems to really find his TEs.

THIS.  I'll take Ertz catching TDs instead of Lee Smith ANY day of the week.  🤪

[4merper4mer]

43 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

LOL, you're defending your statement.  Why don't you just use Mike Ditka then.

Ertz was hurt last year with terrible QB play.  Knox has had a 24 and 28 catch season so far in a pass heavy offense and All Pro QB...but Ertz is terrible?

 Ertz's numbers before that were top tier.  In 2019, he had 88 receptions lol.  One year removed from that and now he's terrible.

Excuse-o-meter set to kill.  
 

The two offenses are not the same and comparing Ertz catch numbers to Knox is flat out silly.  Look, Ertz was decent, albeit overrated, at one point in his career but those days are obviously gone.  Throwing a chunk of the salary cap on wishful thinking is not Beane’s MO.

[ngbills]

Allen is not “wired” to throw to WR’s. He is “wired” to be a QB. He will throw the ball to any target that gets open or can make plays. Your selling Allen short if you say he would not know how to utilize a TE. 

[Royale with Cheese]

2 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said:

Excuse-o-meter set to kill.  
 

The two offenses are not the same and comparing Ertz catch numbers to Knox is flat out silly.  Look, Ertz was decent, albeit overrated, at one point in his career but those days are obviously gone.  Throwing a chunk of the salary cap on wishful thinking is not Beane’s MO.

 

Ertz has had seasons that have tripled and quadrupled Knox's production lol and it's not like that was only 5 years ago...it's been within 2 years.

For whatever reason, you don't believe a Quarterback or injuries makes a difference.  

 

Beane sounds like he was satisfied with the Tight End position.

 

“We just never really got that position,” Bills General Manager Brandon Beane said. “At the end of the year, I thought we did a little bit. Dawson started to get his groove. But it was never where the opposing defense was like, ‘Man, we’ve got to stop their tight ends from going off.’ So we’ll look to that group.”

[Einstein's Dog]

10 minutes ago, ngbills said:

Allen is not “wired” to throw to WR’s. He is “wired” to be a QB. He will throw the ball to any target that gets open or can make plays. Your selling Allen short if you say he would not know how to utilize a TE. 

I agree with you.  I'd add that people are also selling Allen short if they think he can't improve (scary thought for our competition).

 

The improvement to Allen's game in using the TE, and game management, would be greatly facilitated if he has the right weapons.  Adding Ertz would be for TEs in the middle of the range between Diggs - J Brown was in the WR category.  

[Virgil]

20 pages!!!  We did it everyone!!!!

[Patrick Duffy]

1 hour ago, Logic said:

Zach Ertz is 30. Not 36 or 37, but 30. He had ONE bad year, during which he played through injuries, horrendous QB play, and team dysfunction.

Prior to that, he had 900, 1100, and 800 yard seasons.

 

Comparing him to a retired player doesn’t add any credibility to your argument. One down year doesn’t mean the guy “blows”.

Yeah, looks like his "math" that he speaks of so very often is off once again......

[Draconator]

Until Ertz is traded to Buffalo or any other team, this is what Ertz twitter talk has become for me...

 

 

 

Don't get me wrong, I'll still participate. I like pain.

[Patrick Duffy]

1 hour ago, 4merper4mer said:

Excuse-o-meter set to kill.  
 

The two offenses are not the same and comparing Ertz catch numbers to Knox is flat out silly.  Look, Ertz was decent, albeit overrated, at one point in his career but those days are obviously gone.  Throwing a chunk of the salary cap on wishful thinking is not Beane’s MO.

Is your opinion about him strictly because of the down season he and the whole Eagles team had last season? I assume it is since it's basically the only bad season he has had. Are you purposely not taking the horrible play of Wentz into account? I mean a pass catcher can only do so much when the one throwing the ball is playing so bad.

 

 

[ndirish1978]

I see too many people here making the same mistakes of years past - getting infatuated with a player's potential rather than his history of production. We have a TE who has made some nice plays but has also dropped critical passes and does has not been a consistent player for this team. Knox is being overvalued. I see the inverse logic being applied to the veteran here. Ertz has consistently been productive with the exception of last year for which we could come up with a myriad of excuses for him. People are pitting potential over a proven commodity and I don't think that's appropriate. We know Ertz is good, we hope Knox could be. Hollister is whatever, if he's good that's a bonus.

[Logic]

Here's what seems to me to have happened with the Zach Ertz discussion amongst Bills fans:

When it was first announced that the Bills might acquire him, way back when, some fans got overly excited and misunderstood who he was/is as a player. Seeing his past statistical output, some assumed he was a Kelce/Gronkowski type player who would completely change the offense. This, of course, is not true. He's more of a "find the soft spot on the zone and make a crucial 3rd down catch" type TE, not the "Sportscenter Top 10 Plays" type tight end.

As a pushback to this over-excitement and misunderstanding, some fans ( folks like @4merper4mer, though he's certainly not the only one ) went too far in the OTHER direction, saying he's useless, he blows, he's awful, he has nothing to offer. This ALSO is not true.

While Zach Ertz would not completely change the Bills offense, and while he is not a Kelce or Gronk or Waller type, he absolutely DOES have something to offer. He was and IS a good player. While those who thought he was a game-wrecker were wrong, so are those who say he has nothing to offer. And the folks who say he's completely washed up just because he had one bad season? The height of over-reaction, recency bias, and hyperbole.

What Ertz isn't: Travis Kelce. 

What Ertz IS: A savvy veteran tight end who would bring championship experience to the position, teach the youngsters in the room a thing or two, and provide an effective possession receiving and third down outlet for Josh Allen. A definite upgrade over Tyler Kroft and Lee Smith and Reggie Gilliam and Jacob Hollister and Tommy Sweeney. An insurance policy in case Dawson Knox doesn't take the step we all hope he'll take.

If the compensation is right and a reasonable deal can be worked out, I think he'd improve the Bills offense. I think and hope that Knox will break out and become the long term answer at the tight end position, but "hope" is not a strategy.

 

Edited July 2, 2021 by Logic

[Alphadawg7]

On 7/1/2021 at 8:23 AM, Rochesterfan said:

 

 

I don’t disagree with either of these on a whole, but if someone expects that Ertz is coming in and giving you anything like he produced in Philadelphia in the past that is crazy.  
 

If your expectations are that Ertz gets you 40-50 catches, between 400-500 yards, and 5 TDs.  Then you might be right on.  The question becomes what are you willing to trade and how much are you willing to pay for that kind of production?  
 

Are you willing to give up a mid round pick in what could be the deepest draft in a long, long time after the pandemic and pay him 4/5 of your remaining salary cap space - because I am not sure I am willing to do that for basically the name.  
 

For me - I am not overly concerned if we get him or not.  I would be fine if it was a 7th and Philadelphia maintained 60% of his salary - so we got him at ~3.5 million or if Philadelphia took back salary like Addison and a 7th or Butler and a 7th for Ertz, but if we start pushing 5th round and his full salary - I would rather see Beane wait and try to get him after cuts.

 

Yeah, that is why I said he wont be featured here like Philly, we just have too many weapons.  The key value of Ertz is to be a reliable target when called upon, not to put up Kelce like numbers.  Knox has not been reliable and made too many key mistakes, and most importantly he isnt a guy that draws a lot of attention from the defense.  

 

Ertz being on the field alone will help the overall offense as the defense still needs to respect him.  He also can be a key mentor to Knox to try and help him reach his potential.  Plus, Knox and Ertz on the field at the same time will create some matchup issues.  

 

Ertz value is going to really be a red zone threat, chain mover, and mentor to Knox development.  I am on board for that, especially in a year we are expected to challenge for a Super Bowl.  But I also don't want to over pay for that either and I trust Beane to make smart decisions around the compensation to get Ertz (if we get him)

[sfbillsfan]

Nothing is going to happen until he first plays for Carolina.  Then, we can speculate on his trade to the Bills.

 

[buffaloboyinATL]

I won’t believe it until Cynthia Frelund confirms it.  

[eball]

3 minutes ago, buffaloboyinATL said:

I won’t believe it until Cynthia Frelund confirms it.  

In a sleeveless mini dress.