KennyDavisEyes Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Freak-O said: The less people that are vaccinated the higher the risk of the virus mutating to something new that the current vaccines won't stop. It might also mutate to something worse. That's why people are upset. Do you want the govt to corral ppl to the town square, strap them down, and inject them? If not, then it’s best for the upset ppl to just let it go bc all the consternation and resentment only effects the individual suffering from those emotions. Edited June 19, 2021 by KennyDavisEyes
oldmanfan Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 5 minutes ago, Green Lightning said: Reading comprehension would be nice. I did not, nor am I, asking anyone to do anything. Unlike you I have tolerance for others and don't feel like I have all the answers. Reread without an agenda and you will find I wrote that people should make the decision for themselves but follow the rules based on their decisions. No, it's herd immunity however we reach it. Your words. Not mine. What I said is herd immunity if done without vaccines would cause millions more deaths. Which is true, because it would entail everyone getting it, and having many more die. That is how natural immunity works. The rest you are correct on. People can make their own decisions. Some make responsible ones and some make irresponsible ones. 2
HalftimeAdjustment Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 3 minutes ago, BigDingus said: It's also worth stating the evidence HIGHLY indicates that those who are vaccinated, even if they somehow manage to contract the virus, are exponentially less at risk for any severe symptoms, and very, very, VERY few are hospitalized. Again, people need to stop th inking the only 2 options are A) LIve or B) die. There's an entire spectrum of symptoms between those, many being life-altering & highly dangerous. You know what the vaccine prevents? Damn near everything on the severe end of that spectrum aside from just death. You could get vaccinated, be unlucky & catch COVID, but then just have mild symptoms & get over it. Or you could just get COVID without any vaccine protection whatsoever, and gamble with whatever symptoms, regardless of severity that you may incur. I'd prefer not to risk hospitalization or debilitating effects that I could've prevented. There's an inmate at the jail I work for who just caught COVID a second time. He passed on the vaccine because he thought since he caught it last summer he'd be good to go. Well now he's had 2 surgeries, had his eyeballs drained, has necrosis on his left wrist that almost killed him, and a host of other complications that came from his last stint with the virus. And guess what? Right before we sent him out to the hospital this morning for more follow up treatment, the jail announced we were offering another round of vaccinations on the 29th. I asked him if he'd like the paperwork to at least read about it, and he said "well I already caught it twice, so I doubt I'll catch it again. I don't think I'll need it." He sounds like someone with a history of poor decision making.
Beach Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 this thread is still open? this MUST be a trap now! 1 1
Capco Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 (edited) 5 minutes ago, KennyDavisEyes said: Do you want the govt to corral ppl to the town square, strap them down, and inject them? If not, then it’s best for the upset ppl to just let it go bc all the consternation and resentment only effects the individual suffering from those emotions. I want people to stop being obstinate, selfish know-it-alls. I want them to be willing to get vaccinated. But if the government decided it was in the best interest of the welfare of its citizens to compel vaccinations, I would have no qualms about it. It shouldn't have to even get to that point in the first place though. Edited June 19, 2021 by Capco 1 1 1
just1hugheser Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 thank god polio and smallpox etc were essentially vaxed out of existence before this time in history, its really quite amazing how angry people get at people who are trying to help them. its also quite amazing how uneducated this country is, besides reading instagram, twitter, and facebook I'm not sure more than a couple million people out of 330million have actually read a book in the last 20 years. I'm all for personal choice and responsibility but when those choices come outside of the home and affect the health, safety and lives of those around people making those choices, laws rules and regulations have to be put in place. For example person sitting on couch drunk no problem, person sitting behind the wheel drunk need law to deter and enforce consequences. And like the Beas says, if your convictions are that strong then you make your decision and face the consequences aka being fined and suspended and if he does that and becomes unavailable and a distraction McBeane would have every right and plenty of incentive to cut him. Again make any decision you want, but there are always consequences and if you don't like what the consequences are you don't get to be a whiny B word and say the rules, laws, and regs are crap and shouldnt apply to 'me' when they are put in place for the better of 'all'. 3 1 1
Frat-Train Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 Man... This turd won’t flush. Friggen sponge candy...
just1hugheser Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 2 minutes ago, Frat-Train said: Man... This turd won’t flush. Friggen sponge candy... lol that is literally everyday for me, had my entire large intestine removed, so if i dont chew the bejesus out of everything i eat it just comes out whole now if that tmi doesnt stop this thread nothing will 7
Reader Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 17 minutes ago, KennyDavisEyes said: Do you want the govt to corral ppl to the town square, strap them down, and inject them? If not, then it’s best for the upset ppl to just let it go bc all the consternation and resentment only effects the individual suffering from those emotions. Are you honestly saying our only two options are physically forced vaccinations or essentially the opposite?
Don Otreply Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 19 minutes ago, BuffaloBob said: OK, this explains a different reason why you aren't getting it it, so technically it really doesn't answer my question. And of course, the incidents of myocarditis and blood clots are literally orders of magnitude lower than the chances of getting COVID, and especially now that the Delta variant is here. That variant is by far more the most contagious and is thought to be more deadly because of increased viral load at the inception of infection. All but a few rare instances of the already rare instances of myocarditis did not resolve themselves without any intervention, or simple anti-inflammatory agents. Same with the blood clots, now that people know to watch for the symptoms and doctors know not to treat them with heparin. BTW, I know of no one in my rather large family who had anything more than a sore arm for a day and a half. As an example; I’m prone to clots, have been for thirty years, that and a congestive heart failure diagnosis three and a half years ago, and I got the J&J one shot as did my wife, my wife had a headache and a low grade fever for less than twenty four hours, one Tylenol took care of it, there were no other issues for either of us. There have been something to the tune of a hundred and twenty million Americans and growing who have been successfully vaccinated, plus the many hundreds of millions world wide that too have been successfully vaccinated, how big a sample size do the anti vaccination folk need? The world beat Polio with by comparison a much worse efficacy rating vaccine, yet they won’t get a shot that’s way better than what was used to beat Polio…, and on top of that it’s free. There really is no longer an acceptable argument to be made against getting a shot, except for the tiny percentage of folk who have a valid medical diagnosis for not getting it. 3 1 1
boater Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 SDS said no COVID discussion on the main board. (I'm one those warned) The mods have let this thread move fast and furious. 1
BobbyC81 Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 10 hours ago, Chandler#81 said: As a Marine, embarking on an extended Mediterranean Sea ‘cruise’, I lost count after 30 or so vaccinations required, given what we’d encounter. The machine looked like a walk-through metal detector and as you stepped in it, 2 vax guns whapped both arms and you exit hold gauze on each arm. HEY!😡 C’mon, it’s enough different.
Beach Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 has anyone changed their mind to the opposite side yet? 5
Batman1876 Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 49 minutes ago, Green Lightning said: More like flip flopped and back tracked. We have no idea what the long term effects of the vaccine will be. For me it was worth the risk. I know plenty of people who had Covid and are fine and full of antibodies. Not the route I'd take but their lives and bodies. As this thread is making clear, tolerance is in short supply these days. But when you flip flop about the necessity to not go swimming in lake Erie in January via July it's a good and reasonable thing.
ExiledInIllinois Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 Some people just simply don't want to be told what to do. Bye Felicia!
Batman1876 Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 1 hour ago, KennyDavisEyes said: Because it’s not your life. Why resent them. If the medicine you injected in your body works, then it works. Relax. You gonna be strapping ppl down in the town square and injecting them unwillingly? Cuz that’s what it’s gonna take. Save your energy. I don't resent you, I'm just being honest. The shot is 90-95% effective, that means your choice does impact me and others who have had the shot because 14-21 million of us could still get sick. Your choice also impacts those that would get the shot but can't, people with cancer, medical conditions and the immuno compromised. So yes you can say I'm "fine risking others safety, and I will gladly risk their safety of others rather than getting a harmless shot." That's your choice, your freedom, but don't pretend that it only impacts you, your choice does impact others. 1 1
Motorin' Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 8 minutes ago, BobbyC81 said: C’mon, it’s enough different. Yeah, the sacrifice unvaccinated players are being asked to make is nothing compared to what Marines go through. And they probably get paid less in one year than what Beasley makes in one practice. 1 1
QCity Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 30 minutes ago, KennyDavisEyes said: If not, then it’s best for the upset ppl to just let it go bc all the consternation and resentment only effects the individual suffering from those emotions. The "upset" people are the unvaccinated ones that want to do whatever they want. This thread is about an unvaccinated player that is refusing to comply to Covid protocols. If he would have just followed the rules and kept his mouth shut, we wouldn't be discussing it. But he can't do that because he's a drama queen and loves the attention. If you don't wan to get your shots, I don't have an issue with that - but don't whine and cry if you aren't allowed into the stadium this year. 3 1
Hapless Bills Fan Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 34 minutes ago, KennyDavisEyes said: Because it’s not your life. Why resent them. If the vaccines were perfect, 100% protective, and if everyone could be vaccinated, why indeed? You'd be Right On. But they're not. ~80-88% against the new variant Delta. So there's an equation - you plug in fraction immune, fractional vaccine effectiveness, Ro, and calculate how many immune people are needed before disease transmission chains are more likely to break than propegate. Vaccinated people are infection chain-breakers. Unvaccinated, unimmune people are transmitters. You impact me and mine. Maybe not directly. Maybe you attend church with my mom's hairdresser or the unvaccinated nurse's aide who works at my FIL nursing home. You're infected asymptomatically, you infect them. Then my vaccinated mom or FIL have 12-20% chance of getting infected. Since they have underlying conditions and maybe their vaccination didn't "take", they might still get very sick. We hear "let's get back to normal - but I'm not getting vaccinated, if you're afraid, YOU stay home!". That's seen as shirking your Individual Part to End a Societal Problem. It's talking about YOU getting back to normal, avoiding inconvenience, and not caring about the transmission chains you might start. That's why some feel resentment towards people who won't get vaccinated. Me, It Is What It Is. 34 minutes ago, KennyDavisEyes said: You gonna be strapping ppl down in the town square and injecting them unwillingly? Cuz that’s what it’s gonna take. No one is strapping people down and injecting them unwillingly. The guy you're responding to said "The factual best way to end this pandemic is for unvaccinated people to get vaccinated. Period. Look at the history of viral diseases that no longer threaten the population." He's correct, from epidemiology. That doesn't mean we think it will happen in large numbers. We understand at this point that many people won't get vaccinated. I'd like you at least understand in return why people who see vaccination as the best and fastest way to return to normal for EVERYONE, might resent people who choose to not get vaccinated. It's because we see them as impacting our lives. 4 1 2
K-9 Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 7 hours ago, Magox said: Yes, but they are grown adults. They have access to the vaccine and they have been informed and educated on the efficacy of the vaccine. The ones who have decided to not take the virus are at a statistically very low odds of dying. There were nearly 300 known positive cases from active NFL players and to my knowledge none of them died. The point is, they have the choice to take the vaccine, if they contract it and have medical complications then that is their own fault. We aren't in the same place we were months ago, things now have changed dramatically and the risks of having complications from COVID are declining precipitously week over week and the options to protect ourselves are increasing. We all make decisions every day that has some sort of risk ramifications to them, there is always a risk cost - benefit analysis in the decisions we make. To get back to the crux of it all, the dictates/guidelines are too draconian and should be revised and amended. Well, the league obviously feels differently. And until further notice, players will just have to live with the inconvenience. Just like they did last year. I don’t feel the need to debate the philosophical aspects of the issue. It’s a waste of time.
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