GoBills808 Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 16 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said: Hey Capco, I can't think of anything more personal than what you allow someone else to put into your body. Cole Beasley should have no say in what you choose to put in your body and you should have a say in what Cole puts in his. Ultimately, that how I see it. I agree with you that vaccinations are a public health issue, but I don't believe that a public health concern trumps your right as an individual to say what happens to your body. Remember that in this particular instance, we are talking about a vaccine being used under an emergency use authorization. The usual process to get FDA approval for a vaccine takes over a decade. I looked at the data as we understand it today, and decided that getting the vaccine was the right choice for me. It's not my place or the government's place to force this vaccine on someone who doesn't want it. We'll just have to agree to disagree on this one. 🍻 Nobody is forcing anyone to get vaccinated. 1
Nelius Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 10 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said: The best part is, after labelling his post "Public Service Announcement", this guy prints out one of the least intelligible screeds ever penned by a pro athlete: "I'd rather die actually living" (vaccine may interfere with "Beasley-style" livin'?) "I have family members who's days are numbered" (It's called natural selection, son) "build up my immunity that way. Eat better. Drink water." (he left out the bleach) "I'll get to live freely........forever" (yeah, sure...why not?) Gotta feel and hear the Pegula's collective cringing after seeing this. Anyone's decision to take the vaccine is a personal one. But why would this guy demonstrate his wacked out nature with this kind of publication? Just don't get it if you don't want it. Why let your crazy out? A real head scratcher. Dude new album, no joke. You just provided half a dozen titles and more than enough lyrics. "Build up my immunity that way, eat better (ugh), I'll get to live freely....forever (what)" followed by Cole jumping out of bush or something smeared in warpaint pointing to the sky 1
Figster Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 2 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said: Hey Capco, I can't think of anything more personal than what you allow someone else to put into your body. Cole Beasley should have no say in what you choose to put in your body and you should have a say in what Cole puts in his. Ultimately, that how I see it. I agree with you that vaccinations are a public health issue, but I don't believe that a public health concern trumps your right as an individual to say what happens to your body. Remember that in this particular instance, we are talking about a vaccine being used under an emergency use authorization. The usual process to get FDA approval for a vaccine takes over a decade. I looked at the data as we understand it today, and decided that getting the vaccine was the right choice for me. It's not my place or the government's place to force this vaccine on someone who doesn't want it. We'll just have to agree to disagree on this one. 🍻 My favorite nephew is studying to become a minister and the discussions we have had concerning vaccinations has shown me just how sensative and personal it can get. My mostly science driven arguments are all for not with him. I respect his beliefs. 1
Inigo Montoya Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 Just now, GoBills808 said: Nobody is forcing anyone to get vaccinated. The post I was responding to said "Vaccination is a broader public health issue that goes beyond the individual." Thank you for your contribution.
GoBills808 Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 1 minute ago, Inigo Montoya said: The post I was responding to said "Vaccination is a broader public health issue that goes beyond the individual." Thank you for your contribution. Which is correct, and has very little to do with your assertion that ‘it’s not my place or the government’s to force this vaccine on someone who doesn’t want it’. 1
Mr. WEO Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 12 minutes ago, GoBills808 said: Nobody is forcing anyone to get vaccinated. That bit of nuance was lost on the Beasley clan... 1
Hapless Bills Fan Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 14 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said: 43 out of 50 states disagree because you can be exempt from vaccine's in school because personal or religious beliefs That's a hard majority I can't wrap my head around the concept of a state "disagreeing", but allowing vaccine exemptions for personal or religious belief doesn't mean that those states disagree that "Vaccination is a broader public health issue that goes beyond the individual. " To the contrary, I think public health officials in those states agree that vaccination is a broader public health issue that goes beyond the individual, but they also recognize that public health and religious freedom can be balanced provided the number of "opt outs" are small enough that herd immunity can accommodate them. It's also proven to be an issue because the exemptions are usually not random - they tend to cluster in a geographical area around a group of families that tend to have regular contact, and outbreaks have flared. The number of states that allowed religious exemptions was larger, until outbreaks occurred in several of them: https://gothamist.com/news/city-declares-public-health-emergency-as-measles-cases-spike-in-ultra-orthodox-neighborhoods Nit: it's not 43 states that allow exemption for "personal" belief, that's a smaller number - 12 or 15. 1
JoPoy88 Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 8 minutes ago, Figster said: My favorite nephew is studying to become a minister and the discussions we have had concerning vaccinations has shown me just how sensative and personal it can get. My mostly science driven arguments are all for not with him. I respect his beliefs. And that’s all good. Beasley is not trying affect beliefs, he’s trying to change policy to suit both his comforts and beliefs. He’s being selfish, bottom line. 1 1
GoBills808 Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 2 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said: That bit of nuance was lost on the Beasley clan... I don’t think he’s that stupid. What he’s actually saying is that he refuses to be even slightly inconvenienced.
Buffalo716 Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: I can't wrap my head around the concept of a state "disagreeing", but allowing vaccine exemptions for personal or religious belief doesn't mean that those states disagree that "Vaccination is a broader public health issue that goes beyond the individual. " To the contrary, I think public health officials in those states agree that vaccination is a broader public health issue that goes beyond the individual, but they also recognize that public health and religious freedom can be balanced provided the number of "opt outs" are small enough that herd immunity can accommodate them. It's also proven to be an issue because the exemptions are usually not random - they tend to cluster in a geographical area around a group of families that tend to have regular contact, and outbreaks have flared. The number of states that allowed religious exemptions was larger, until outbreaks occurred in several of them: https://gothamist.com/news/city-declares-public-health-emergency-as-measles-cases-spike-in-ultra-orthodox-neighborhoods Nit: it's not 43 states that allow exemption for "personal" belief, that's a smaller number - 12 or 15. I said religious or philosophical. Or I wasn't wrong And nobody can stop you from saying I'm a Scientologist and I'm not getting my kid vaccinated My point was sure it's a public health issue but it's doesn't mean they can force vaccinate everyone who doesn't want it.. there's a lot of avenues in this country There's definitely unvaccinated kids in New York who are homeschooled.. now I'm not sitting here saying I'm anti polio vaccine.. I'm not But if you want to be a dumb parent that chooses that I'm not going to stop you Edited June 19, 2021 by Buffalo716
Hapless Bills Fan Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 26 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said: My link is posted And it's not hard to get it. You can't get it in New York but it's not hard to get it in the States you can It's called philosophical exemption for reason. If it's against your philosophies you can't be forced to take it Same with religion. Just need to say it's against your religion The requirements vary a bit more than that, @Buffalo716. In the 12 or 14 or whatever states that allow philosophical exemption, you're correct. In some of the other states, you have to demonstrate that you're a practicing member of a religion that absolutely objects to vaccines, such as Christian Scientists or groups that believe in faith healing. That's a small point, I know, but the point is in most states, it's more than "it's against my philosophies" "OK" Force isn't the issue; if you want your children to attend daycare or public school, then vaccination is mandatory (with very limited exceptions).
Motorin' Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 37 minutes ago, Buffarukus said: ok explain it cause all i read is what was in the OP. it pretty clearly states that he wants to make a "personal choice" on his health in several different ways and is uncompromised in that choice regardless of what happens career or healthwise. what did i miss? You missed the whole thing where he said he won't follow the NFL Covid protocols put in place even if he has to retire. 1 1
Inigo Montoya Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 12 minutes ago, GoBills808 said: Which is correct, and has very little to do with your assertion that ‘it’s not my place or the government’s to force this vaccine on someone who doesn’t want it’. You deliberately take things out of context and argue just to argue. You are the first poster in over 3 years on this website that I've decided to block. You're not worth the aggravation. Cheers
JoPoy88 Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 2 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: The requirements vary a bit more than that, @Buffalo716. In the 12 or 14 or whatever states that allow philosophical exemption, you're correct. In some of the other states, you have to demonstrate that you're a practicing member of a religion that absolutely objects to vaccines, such as Christian Scientists or groups that believe in faith healing. That's a small point, I know. Which is what I asked him as well. And citing X States vs. Y States means less than nothing to me. Show actual population polls then maybe I’d consider it.
EC-Bills Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 9 hours ago, Kelly the Dog said: Why doesn’t Cole just sit and talk to (read: listen to) Tommy Sweeney for two hours instead of being on Twitter. God's will? 1 1 3
Hapless Bills Fan Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 21 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said: The post I was responding to said "Vaccination is a broader public health issue that goes beyond the individual." Thank you for your contribution. Both can be true, correct? One can simultaneously recognize that vaccination is a broader public health issue that goes beyond the individual, AND not "force" people to be vaccinated? 2 minutes ago, JoPoy88 said: Which is what I asked him as well. And citing X States vs. Y States means less than nothing to me. Show actual population polls then maybe I’d consider it. This I don't understand.
Pabstblueribbon Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 11 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: There have been a number of outbreaks in skilled nursing facilities and care homes where the residents were 90% vaccinated, but the staff only ~50%. The staff brought the infection in with them and objectively and factually infected the residents they cared for and other staff members (including some who were vaccinated). People died who didn't need to. Okay, now do all residents of the skilled nursing facilities in NY that died unnecessarily because someone threw all common sense out the window and decided that the correct course of action was to force those facilities into taking in and cross contaminating covid positive patients with the general population. The point is, there is a level of abject stupidity that defies common sense at play here. Ie "you must lock yourself in your room without visitors so you don't get sick inorder to destroy yourself out on the field on prime-time tv." They are creating a caste system and punishing anyone who dares to go against it.
JoPoy88 Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 1 minute ago, EC-Bills said: God's will? Good point. Tommy lost almost a year of development and ended up with a potentially serious complication because, ya know, god’s will. 2 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: This I don't understand. because saying “X number or states think this” is misleading. I’d rather see the number of people that ascribe to A (or B.) states have populations ranging from what 40+ million vs 700K? That’s all i’m saying
Hapless Bills Fan Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 17 minutes ago, Pabstblueribbon said: Okay, now do all residents of the skilled nursing facilities in NY that died unnecessarily because someone threw all common sense out the window and decided that the correct course of action was to force those facilities into taking in and cross contaminating covid positive patients with the general population. The point is, there is a level of abject stupidity that defies common sense at play here. Ie "you must lock yourself in your room without visitors so you don't get sick inorder to destroy yourself out on the field on prime-time tv." They are creating a caste system and punishing anyone who dares to go against it. Could you rewrite the first two lines in English please? Also, have you actually read the NFL's protocols for non vaccinated players? There is no requirement to "lock yourself in your room without visitors". I agree that they're creating a caste system with punishments for violations. But there are health impacts of those who aren't vaccinated on those who are. So I'm not sure how one could allow freedom of choice about vaccination without (effectively) creating a caste system by having different restrictions on unvaccinated folks.
JoPoy88 Posted June 19, 2021 Posted June 19, 2021 6 minutes ago, Pabstblueribbon said: Okay, now do all residents of the skilled nursing facilities in NY that died unnecessarily because someone threw all common sense out the window and decided that the correct course of action was to force those facilities into taking in and cross contaminating covid positive patients with the general population. The point is, there is a level of abject stupidity that defies common sense at play here. Ie "you must lock yourself in your room without visitors so you don't get sick inorder to destroy yourself out on the field on prime-time tv." They are creating a caste system and punishing anyone who dares to go against it. i get you, but again, the primary factor in vaccine effectiveness is enough people getting it. Pushing against people pushing for more people getting vaccinated is ridiculous in my book. It’s what we have to do in order for all money, all those shots to mean something. I’m low risk but I got the shot asap. It wasn’t for me it was for the people around me.
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