stevewin Posted June 22, 2021 Posted June 22, 2021 3 hours ago, SoCal Deek said: Not really. That’s not why SoFi was so expensive. Putting it into the ground can actually save money when it’s done wisely like was done with Rich Stadium, but that’s not what they did in Los Angeles. There they actually dug a hole, built a huge retaining wall around the perimeter (like a moat) and built a conventional stadium at the bottom of the hole. So there’s actually an entire floor level down at field level. That’s not true in Orchard Park where the lower seating bowl’s concrete was poured right on the dirt. Hope that makes sense and helps. There was also tons of engineering/expense poured into the stadium (pun intended) to make it earthquake resistant
SoCal Deek Posted June 22, 2021 Posted June 22, 2021 19 minutes ago, stevewin said: There was also tons of engineering/expense poured into the stadium (pun intended) to make it earthquake resistant True to a point but almost nothing spent on snow load! 😉
Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted June 22, 2021 Posted June 22, 2021 (edited) 14 hours ago, Beast said: The same reason they moved from the open air Rockpile to the open air Rich Stadium. They need a new stadium. And for those that think there are some games being played so the Bills can get a downtown stadium…..why would the Pegula’s have sunk the money they have into the Bills training facility to make it the best in the league? The Bills are staying in Orchard Park while construction takes place and the stadium will be right next to the current one. The Bills will reduce capacity by 10-15 thousand during the two years the stadium is being built for parking purposes. You heard it here first. Why can't they keep their training facility in Orchard Park even with a downtown stadium? Can't see them building a big dome downtown if they were to move there. Don't know who owns the land the facility is on, also leased, regardless I'm sure they could work out a deal for that. I will agree didn't see anything suggesting the new stadium is on the same identical site. Think I did read would take 2 years to complete, that seems awful fast if a tear down needs to occur first in order to build a new one. 3 hours ago, SoCal Deek said: Not really. That’s not why SoFi was so expensive. Putting it into the ground can actually save money when it’s done wisely like was done with Rich Stadium, but that’s not what they did in Los Angeles. There they actually dug a hole, built a huge retaining wall around the perimeter (like a moat) and built a conventional stadium at the bottom of the hole. So there’s actually an entire floor level down at field level. That’s not true in Orchard Park where the lower seating bowl’s concrete was poured right on the dirt. Hope that makes sense and helps. And then 1 inch of Astroturf was laid on top!!! Field is done!! Edited June 22, 2021 by Ed_Formerly_of_Roch
May Day 10 Posted June 22, 2021 Posted June 22, 2021 If the stadium was done in-place, I would think they would just expand the crater in the ground. Would probably be cheaper than it would to demo, then backfill/compact it (thats a lot of backfill). That will still be really expensive if they need to do that after-the fact. Really looking forward to more information/renderings. Really hoping it resembles Seattle's stadium. Also, give our crowd an acoustic sound deflecting roof and it will be really loud.
Bulldog Posted June 22, 2021 Posted June 22, 2021 I prefer to watch & talk football. Stadiums planned to be paid for with public money are bound to become embroiled in the swampy world of local & state politics. Jerry Jones might be a good choice as a consultant in the political field - where influence & the ability to put pressure on the right people can make the difference between a project being completed or that project never making it off the drawing board. This guy might have also have been a good choice as a consultant :
Coffeesforclosers Posted June 22, 2021 Posted June 22, 2021 28 minutes ago, Bulldog said: I prefer to watch & talk football. Stadiums planned to be paid for with public money are bound to become embroiled in the swampy world of local & state politics. Jerry Jones might be a good choice as a consultant in the political field - where influence & the ability to put pressure on the right people can make the difference between a project being completed or that project never making it off the drawing board. This guy might have also have been a good choice as a consultant : If Don Corleone ran the Bills, the stadium would be a palace of marble, Tom Brady would be stocking shelves with the other 6th rounders, and Belichick would wake up with Ernie Adams head in his sheets. 1
stevewin Posted June 22, 2021 Posted June 22, 2021 2 hours ago, SoCal Deek said: True to a point but almost nothing spent on snow load! 😉 Not the frozen kind - heyyy-ooohhh A while back I randomly came upon some "most extreme" type show that detailed some of the engineering for earthquake protection - was amazing the extent of some of what they put into it
SoCal Deek Posted June 22, 2021 Posted June 22, 2021 28 minutes ago, stevewin said: Not the frozen kind - heyyy-ooohhh A while back I randomly came upon some "most extreme" type show that detailed some of the engineering for earthquake protection - was amazing the extent of some of what they put into it They did an entire show on the SoFi stadium a while back. It’s an interesting facility for sure. Most would think it’s a dome but it’s not. It’s a conventional outdoor stadium with a translucent umbrella roof over the top of the entire thing. And as previously stated unlike stadiums are built into the dirt, it’s actually again rather conventional. It’s just that they lowered the existing level of the site DEEP into the ground and built the whole place in a hole. The other interesting thing is that it’s not just one venue. In the teardrop end of the roof they built an entire indoor theater venue that can host other entertainment events with a covered plaza in the gap between the two venues. Money was clearly not an obstacle.
red hots Posted June 22, 2021 Posted June 22, 2021 https://www.wkbw.com/news/local-news/poloncarz-on-bills-stadium-theres-no-agreement Quote Poloncarz on Bills stadium: "There's no agreement" "There is no agreement to build a new stadium" BUFFALO, NY (WKBW) — Erie county says there's no agreement on the table to build a new Buffalo Bills stadium. “While we have met and discussed issues with the stadium — there's no agreement — I want people to understand that,” declared Mark Poloncarz, Erie County Executive. Poloncarz says lease negotiations between the state, county and Buffalo Bills is underway, but disputes a report that there is an agreement to build a new stadium on Abbott Road near the current stadium in Orchard Park. Reaction comes after word surfaced Friday that the Buffalo Bills and Pegula Sports and Entertainment hired a consultant to explore options for a possible new stadium. “So, I just want the public to understand — that while the Pegula's may be preparing as they are for the discussions and hiring counsel — we hired counsel to assist us, but there is no agreement to build a new stadium and when there is an agreement we will talk about it,” Poloncarz said. An article by Venues sparked speculation of a new stadium. Pegula Sports and Entertainment has hired legends global sales to sell premium seats and sponsorship for what it described as a new venue for the Buffalo Bills and to study construction of a new stadium. The current stadium lease expires in 2023. “The issue is what's going to happen, is there going to be a new stadium or is there going to be a major renovation — similar to what was done in Green Bay to that facility,” Poloncarz stated. Built in 1973, the stadium has undergone upgrades — a cost that is shared by the county, the state and bills. Improvements made several years ago cost $130-million. But paying for a new stadium could cost a billion or more. “What we've been seeing in recent years is that NFL stadiums are running a billion and upward,” remarked Andrew Zimbalist, economic professor, Smith College, Massachusetts. He points to the $5-billion costs of the SoFi stadium in Los Angeles, home to the L.A. Rams. But it includes an entertainment center and was built with private dollars and tax incentives. “Which just seems astronomical?" Buckley asked. “And frankly the news is still more depressing for Buffalo because those host cities that tend to have a smaller population and a smaller footprint to the large corporation, they don't have as much bargaining power as the larger cities do and they owners know that and take advantage of that,” Zimbalist. And that means in the smaller cities, life Buffalo — it relies on taxpayer contribution to help pay for it. The county executive would not discuss any details, only saying it will be some time before a stadium deal is announced. But Poloncarz says he can reassure bills fans that he expects the team will be in Buffalo for a very long time. “I feel very confident the bills will be the Buffalo Bills for as long as I’m alive — I feel confident in that situation,” said Poloncarz. A spokesman for the Buffalo Bills say the organization is not commenting on this topic at this point.
Chicharito Posted June 22, 2021 Posted June 22, 2021 The Pegulas have bought large chunks of land downtown. Like the whole perry projects. Other big investors and developers have also bought up everything around the area as well. With that being said I believe they are holding the lease and saying that they are going to be in the road for 2 years as a bargaining chip for tax breaks and lower lease price. No way will the county or state lose out on the money that the bills bring in. The stadium will be a downtown stadium.
WhoTom Posted June 22, 2021 Posted June 22, 2021 4 hours ago, Coffeesforclosers said: If Don Corleone ran the Bills ... ... then at least the term "Bills Mafia" would make sense. 3
Bleeding Bills Blue Posted June 22, 2021 Posted June 22, 2021 19 hours ago, LeGOATski said: 1. A hard-core crowd like Buffalo's is best served by an open stadium. It maximizes the noise. 2. A lot of winning teams play in open stadiums (Pats, Packers, Niners, Steelers, Seahawks, Chiefs...). It really has no bearing on a team's success or stats. 3. Football is supposed to be played in the elements. Period. 4. Domes are obviously more expensive and I bet the increase in profits from the apparent versatility is marginal. During the winter months, it's all football. And in a place with a mild summer like Buffalo, an open stadium still works. Keep the cost down as much as possible; keep ticket prices down as much as possible; but you still have a state of the art upgrade that the league is pushing for. A lot of the dome teams built them for the purposes of securing super bowls (which bring in a ton of money). Buffalo will never get one, so the dome aspect isn't there. You might be able to use it for concerts or something, but they play football in the winter so... you can have concerts in the spring/summer in an open air stadium probably just as much. 1 hour ago, Chicharito said: The Pegulas have bought large chunks of land downtown. Like the whole perry projects. Other big investors and developers have also bought up everything around the area as well. With that being said I believe they are holding the lease and saying that they are going to be in the road for 2 years as a bargaining chip for tax breaks and lower lease price. No way will the county or state lose out on the money that the bills bring in. The stadium will be a downtown stadium. Yep - everythings a negotiation tactic. Same goes for them saying " we could play at penn state or somewhere else" when the lease is up. They're just saying that to get favorable terms. 5 hours ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said: Why can't they keep their training facility in Orchard Park even with a downtown stadium? Can't see them building a big dome downtown if they were to move there. Don't know who owns the land the facility is on, also leased, regardless I'm sure they could work out a deal for that. I will agree didn't see anything suggesting the new stadium is on the same identical site. Think I did read would take 2 years to complete, that seems awful fast if a tear down needs to occur first in order to build a new one. And then 1 inch of Astroturf was laid on top!!! Field is done!! Could you imagine playing on that? I rolled up on my toe just thinking about it.
galept Posted June 22, 2021 Posted June 22, 2021 1 hour ago, Chicharito said: The Pegulas have bought large chunks of land downtown. Like the whole perry projects. Other big investors and developers have also bought up everything around the area as well. With that being said I believe they are holding the lease and saying that they are going to be in the road for 2 years as a bargaining chip for tax breaks and lower lease price. No way will the county or state lose out on the money that the bills bring in. The stadium will be a downtown stadium. Bold prediction, but not without merit. There are heavy incentives to bring the team downtown which is why they have been considering it for years.
beerme1 Posted June 22, 2021 Posted June 22, 2021 1 hour ago, Chicharito said: The Pegulas have bought large chunks of land downtown. Like the whole perry projects. The stadium will be a downtown stadium. Maybe that area is for a new arena and entertainment zone around the arena. Perry St projects is my preferred area by the way for a stadium. By far and I've stated that consistently and many times over. But there's more land available in OP and it would be cheaper than razing all the projects. It would be such a huge win for Buffalo to get rid of the shithole area and rebirth it as a stadium entertainment zone. But all of that goes for an arena also with a much smaller footprint.
JakeFrommStateFarm Posted June 22, 2021 Posted June 22, 2021 1 hour ago, red hots said: https://www.wkbw.com/news/local-news/poloncarz-on-bills-stadium-theres-no-agreement From the article: "And that means in the smaller cities, life Buffalo — it relies on taxpayer contribution to help pay for it" If voters vote yes to a tax hike, the stadium will be built. If they vote no, Pegula will threaten to move the team. This is exactly what happened in San Diego and Atlanta 1
red hots Posted June 22, 2021 Posted June 22, 2021 11 minutes ago, beerme1 said: Maybe that area is for a new arena and entertainment zone around the arena. Perry St projects is my preferred area by the way for a stadium. By far and I've stated that consistently and many times over. But there's more land available in OP and it would be cheaper than razing all the projects. It would be such a huge win for Buffalo to get rid of the shithole area and rebirth it as a stadium entertainment zone. But all of that goes for an arena also with a much smaller footprint. This rendering was found online a few weeks ago and subsequently taken down, seemingly it was not meant to be out to the public yet. However on the same site there was also a rendering of a renovated "New Era Field" which was also removed, so no idea how old this is, or if its a genuine plan or merely a rendering of one of many ideas. Populous the stadium architects are behind it I believe. 2 1
Albany,n.y. Posted June 22, 2021 Posted June 22, 2021 (edited) 20 hours ago, Bob Chandler's Hands said: Agree with the post except the last line. Not hard to arrange buses from remote lots for fans. Also, the off-premises lots would increase as a result of increased demand, fans just have to walk farther in some cases. No way they reduce attendance to due to parking. Park cars at McKinley Mall & shuttle people to Highmark to replace some of the lost parking. The mall just sold & is barely occupied. According to an internet search, there are over 6,800 parking spots. Edited June 22, 2021 by Albany,n.y.
JakeFrommStateFarm Posted June 22, 2021 Posted June 22, 2021 (edited) @YoloinOhio yes a tax hike will be required. Why did you delete your post ? So doing the math, a new domed stadium will cost around 2-3 billion. If PSLs can only get 200M-300M, where is the rest of the money coming from ? I'll tell you. The taxpayers. Pegula will not put much of his money up. He will try to shake down the tax payers of Buffalo. I hope the taxpayers vote no and force the billionaire to pay for his own stadium. In no way should tax payers pay for a billionaires stadium. If I go to see a movie should I help pay for the movie theater? Edited June 22, 2021 by JakeFrommStateFarm 1 1
YoloinOhio Posted June 22, 2021 Author Posted June 22, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, JakeFrommStateFarm said: @YoloinOhio yes a tax hike will be required. Why did you delete your post ? So doing the math, a new domed stadium will cost around 2-3 billion. If PSLs can only get 200M-300M, where is the rest of the money coming from ? I'll tell you. The taxpayers. Pegula will not put much of his money up. He will try to shake down the tax payers of Buffalo. I hope the taxpayers vote no and force the billionaire to pay for his own stadium. In no way should tax payers pay for a billionaires stadium. If I go to see a movie should I help pay for the movie theater? I didn’t have time to write the whole thing so had to come back. I don’t know about Atlanta but it’s not the same as San Diego as in they don’t need a certain number of signatures to get it put on the ballot. In NYS it can just be placed on the ballot. SD didn’t support the team regardless as far as whether it will require a tax hike to build this particular stadium, maybe. We have no details yet, at all. Edited June 23, 2021 by YoloinOhio
The Dean Posted June 22, 2021 Posted June 22, 2021 3 hours ago, red hots said: https://www.wkbw.com/news/local-news/poloncarz-on-bills-stadium-theres-no-agreement From the WKBW article Quote “Which just seems astronomical?" Buckley asked. Who is Buckley? There is no other mention of him/her in the article. And that doesn't look like a question to me.
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