Critical Race Theory

[SoCal Deek]

5 hours ago, Doc Brown said:

 

CRT advocates would argue that racial profiling is a direct result of systemic racism in our legislation and public policy going back all the way to slavery.  In your example it doesn't matter why the cops are profiling black kids.

I have no doubt that CRT advocates would take that position and there’s obviously some racial bias in all sorts of profiling but that doesn’t make it racism. There’s a difference. Racism, as the term is commonly used, would be where someone considers another race inferior. In the case of policing it’s an indication that officers are trained to look for people who they believe are more likely to commit crimes. It doesn’t mean they are inferior. The cops profiling is way more specific than casting a broad race based net. Is it systemic? Well that’s the argument. I believe it has more to do with professional experience than some boogeyman system.

Edited July 20, 2021 by SoCal Deek

[Motorin']

1 hour ago, SoCal Deek said:

I have no doubt that CRT advocates would take that position and there’s obviously some racial bias in all sorts of profiling but that doesn’t make it racism. There’s a difference. Racism, as the term is commonly used, would be where someone considers another race inferior. In the case of policing it’s an indication that officers are trained to look for people who they believe are more likely to commit crimes. It doesn’t mean they are inferior. The cops profiling is way more specific than casting a broad race based net. Is it systemic? Well that’s the argument. I believe it has more to do with professional experience than some boogeyman system.

 

So racial discrimination and racism are two different things in your mind. If that's the case, we've been talking about two different things the whole time. Because  what we mean by systemic racism is that there is discrimination in how certain legal and economic systems function. 

Edited July 20, 2021 by Motorin'

[SoCal Deek]

20 minutes ago, Motorin' said:

 

So racial discrimination and racism are two different things in your mind. If that's the case, we've been talking about two different things the whole time. Because  what we mean by systemic racism is that there is discrimination in how certain legal and economic systems function. 

Oh brother. Police are not making judgements on a persons worth are merit. That’s not their role. 

[Motorin']

46 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

Oh brother. Police are not making judgements on a persons worth are merit. That’s not their role. 

 

We were having a much longer conversation about many other things than just policing. And the differentiation you are making is that discrimination is not racism if there's no judgement of inferiority. 

[B-Man]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[SoCal Deek]

2 hours ago, Motorin' said:

 

We were having a much longer conversation about many other things than just policing. And the differentiation you are making is that discrimination is not racism if there's no judgement of inferiority. 

The discussion we were having right now is/was indeed about policing. And yes there is a distinction between being discriminating and a downward judgement that could be categorized more accurately as racism.  You make discriminating selections every minute of the day.  They do not rise to the level of disdain or complete rejection of the product, restaurant, movie, paint color, shirt style, or whatever you choose to select.  It's how our brains work.

[Chef Jim]

43 minutes ago, B-Man said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'm not so sure.  Can we truly compare the historical paths of Asians and African Americans in this country?   

[B-Man]

1 minute ago, Chef Jim said:

 

I'm not so sure.  Can we truly compare the historical paths of Asians and African Americans in this country?   

 

 

It is not necessary for the "Paths" of Asians and African Americans to be similar for this author's point about CRT to be valid.

 

 

 

 

 

[Chef Jim]

1 minute ago, B-Man said:

 

 

It is not necessary for the "Paths" of Asians and African Americans to be similar for this author's point about CRT to be valid.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Absolutely it is.  CRT says that there has been systemic racism in our cultural, social and legal systems that has held blacks back.  The fact that the Asian experience has been different with regard to these systems it does not invalidate CRT at all.  It's an apples/oranges comparison. 

[B-Man]

1 minute ago, Chef Jim said:

 

Absolutely it is.  CRT says that there has been systemic racism in our cultural, social and legal systems that has held blacks back.  The fact that the Asian experience has been different with regard to these systems it does not invalidate CRT at all.  It's an apples/oranges comparison. 

 

 

No it is not.

 

CRT says that there has been systemic racism in our cultural, social and legal systems that has held blacks  MINORITIES back.

 

It is the inherent racism of white people that is taught through a filter in all classes............not just history.

 

The author's point IS valid.

 

 

 

 

[Chef Jim]

7 minutes ago, B-Man said:

 

 

No it is not.

 

CRT says that there has been systemic racism in our cultural, social and legal systems that has held blacks  MINORITIES back.

 

It is the inherent racism of white people that is taught through a filter in all classes............not just history.

 

The author's point IS valid.

 

 

 

 

 

So I've been looking at CRT from the wrong angle I guess.  The theory is that whites have considered themselves superior to all other races not just blacks?   Ok then it is a valid point.  

[Motorin']

12 minutes ago, Chef Jim said:

 

So I've been looking at CRT from the wrong angle I guess.  The theory is that whites have considered themselves superior to all other races not just blacks?   Ok then it is a valid point.  

 

Part of the white nationalist framework is their belief that Asians are actually superior to white people, and that white people are superior the rest of the races. 

 

Feelings about superiority aside, CRT is about laws and their social effect even after those have have been changed on the books. There were specific laws that discriminated uniquely against specific races. To what extent the remnants of those laws still have any effect is certainly up for debate. But you are correct in asserting that the laws and social implications for Asians and for blacks are not the same thing, and they are certainly not the same thing as a collective feeling of superiority.  

 

 

 

 

Edited July 20, 2021 by Motorin'

[Chef Jim]

19 minutes ago, Motorin' said:

 

Part of the white nationalist framework is their belief that Asians are actually superior to white people, and that white people are superior the rest of the races. 

 

Feelings about superiority aside, CRT is about laws and their social effect even after those have have been changed on the books. There were specific laws that discriminated uniquely against specific races. To what extent the remnants of those laws still have any effect is certainly up for debate. But you are correct in asserting that the laws and social implications for Asians and for blacks are not the same thing, and they are certainly not the same thing as a collective feeling of superiority.  

 

 

 

 

 

And my point has also been to what extent the remnants of any discrimination are still having effects today.  In my mind there likely are some lingering effects but they are not holding blacks back to the extent many think they are.   People need to do a much better job of looking inward to their own culpability in issues such as this. 

[unbillievable]

33 minutes ago, Chef Jim said:

 

So I've been looking at CRT from the wrong angle I guess.  The theory is that whites have considered themselves superior to all other races not just blacks?   Ok then it is a valid point.  

 

You also have to consider the path of Immigrants, who also invalidate CRT.

 

 

 

2 minutes ago, Chef Jim said:

 

And my point has also been to what extent the remnants of any discrimination are still having effects today.  In my mind there likely are some lingering effects but they are not holding blacks back to the extent many think they are.   People need to do a much better job of looking inward to their own culpability in issues such as this. 

 

We do have a systematic discrimination against ghetto culture. You can't be successful in this country if you embrace violence and drugs.

[Motorin']

4 minutes ago, Chef Jim said:

 

And my point has also been to what extent the remnants of any discrimination are still having effects today.  In my mind there likely are some lingering effects but they are not holding blacks back to the extent many think they are.   People need to do a much better job of looking inward to their own culpability in issues such as this. 

 

I didn't get a chance to respond to a previous post you made where you questioned at what point do we need to stop making excuses. What I wanted to say was that it isn't about making excuses. It's about continuing to build a more fair society. And what it certainly is not about is brainwashing techniques to engender learned helplessness. Rocky and Bullwinkle are not needed to break Natasha and Boris' brain washing CRT machine. 

 

 

[unbillievable]

Have to admit that we have come a long way when activists have to manufacture implicit racism to have something to fight.

 

 

[Chef Jim]

1 minute ago, Motorin' said:

 

I didn't get a chance to respond to a previous post you made where you questioned at what point do we need to stop making excuses. What I wanted to say was that it isn't about making excuses. It's about continuing to build a more fair society. And what it certainly is not about is brainwashing techniques to engender learned helplessness. Rocky and Bullwinkle are not needed to break Natasha and Boris' brain washing CRT machine. 

 

 

 

Oh but it is about making excuses.  "The reason for my lack of success today is due the the treatment of my ancestors is in the past."  There is some truth to that but it should become less and less over time however the excuses seem to be not diminishing. 

[B-Man]

 

 

 

 

 

 

[SoCal Deek]

2 hours ago, unbillievable said:

 

We do have a systematic discrimination against ghetto culture. You can't be successful in this country if you embrace violence and drugs.

Thank you!  Someone finally had the guts to state the obvious. People are no different from most other creatures; we make judgements with our eyes first, and then if possible move on to deeper probing for a better assessment. If your outward appearance is that of what is commonly referred to as a 'street thug', that's the first thing most people are going to judge you by...no matter what color skin you happen to be 'wearing'.  Once again.....it isn't complicated. You all know it to be true from you own life experience.  Nobody in 21st Century America references back to when blacks were slaves to make these judgements.  They make the judgements (unfortunate but true) on their current life experience in modern culture.  I'm willing to guess you've each made these same visual judgements countless times this very day, and will again tomorrow, and the day after that.  It's not rocket science. 

Edited July 20, 2021 by SoCal Deek

[B-Man]

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