Etienne thought he was going to be a Bill

[US Egg]

McBeane values every pick as if it's a 1st round.

[Thurman#1]

8 hours ago, DJB said:

 

 

Talbot said he "believed" this, and the word is too strong. Etienne said he "was thinking." 

 

Guess is a more reasonable verb there. Better yet, why not use his own word, thinking.

 

 

23 minutes ago, I am the egg man said:

McBeane values every pick as if it's a 1st round.

 

 

No, he values every pick as if it's valuable. And they are. He's very cognizant of the differences of value between picks in different rounds.

Edited May 23, 2021 by Thurman#1

[Thurman#1]

5 hours ago, Logic said:

Personally, I believe that the "Bills want to trade up for ETN" smoke was real. I believe they tried. I believe ETN was the player they were targeting.

Beane literally said that if a running back added something to the room that they didn't already have, they'd absolutely take him. He want on just a few sentences later to admit that something they lack in the room is "a home run hitter". He also explained that guys like CMC and Kamara are worth first round picks because they improve both the run and pass game. Now we hear that ETN is cross-training as a WR in Jacksonville.

We'll never know for sure how serious the Bills' interest in ETN was, but it is my personal opinion that they were very interested.

 

 

Fair enough, but my personal opinion is that they weren't.

 

In the Embedded video they show the Bills room when Etienne was taken. There were no heads shaking, no obvious expressions of disappointment.

 

Beane may have said it again, but originally that "home run hitter" being missing comment came before they picked up Breida, who is a home run hitter. No, he's no Etienne, but yeah, he's a guy who can hit home runs.

[JMF2006]

I am also sure that a bunch of players thought other teams were interested in them too.

 

 

[GunnerBill]

11 hours ago, Victory Formation said:

And if Etienne does end up being a Christian McCafferry talent, do you pay a RB $16M/yr when it comes to their second contract?

 

If he becomes McCaffery or Kamara I think you can justify that. The problem is anything short of that and I struggle to justify much more than $8m per. The number of running backs who are in that offensive weapon tier is very small. Etienne being good not great would almost certainly mean letting him walk after his rookie deal. 

3 hours ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

Fair enough, but my personal opinion is that they weren't.

 

In the Embedded video they show the Bills room when Etienne was taken. There were no heads shaking, no obvious expressions of disappointment.

 

Beane may have said it again, but originally that "home run hitter" being missing comment came before they picked up Breida, who is a home run hitter. No, he's no Etienne, but yeah, he's a guy who can hit home runs.

 

Beane definitely said it again. He said it in the pre-draft presser. I think the interest in Etienne was real. Whether he was a guy they were trying to trade up for or whether they'd have taken him over Rousseau if he was there at #30 I am not sure. But I 100% believe they had interest in him. 

[GunnerBill]

8 hours ago, Logic said:

I disagree. Beane is a pretty straight shooter. Case in point: He talked leading up the draft about needing to "affect the opposing quarterback" more effectively, and then they drafted two edge rushers in the first two rounds. How do you explain that?

 

 

I agree. I have watched or listened to about every interview or presser Brandon Beane has done as Bills GM. He isn't into playing games or smokescreens. McDermott likes giving the press absolutely nothing but Brandon Beane is pretty honest and frank with his assessment of the roster. His moves are often exactly what he tells you he is going to do. Examples?

 

He told us after 2018 that he had done a "horrible job" his own words, with the offensive personnel and would need to attack that unit in free agency and the draft. Followed by multiple free agents - Morse, Spain, Feliciano, Kroft, Brown and Beasley and then drafted Singletary, Ford and Knox. 

 

He told us after 2019 that he still needed an elite difference maker at receiver and traded for Stefon Diggs. 

 

He told us after this year we needed to affect the Quarterback more consistently and he spent his first 2 picks on edge rushers.

 

Obviously he doesn't name names with specific players but he isn't Buddy Nix. He isn't going to tell you Cordy Glenn is a guard at the next level only to draft him and immediately say he is going to be our left tackle. Just isn't who he is. When Beane says an area needs something - you better believe he really thinks it needs it.

Edited May 23, 2021 by GunnerBill

[dollars 2 donuts]

Why is this making me a little bit sick?

 

ugh.  Because I would have liked the shiny new toy,

[BADOLBILZ]

14 hours ago, StHustle said:

 

How can you say this? If Etienne ends up a HOF and Rousseau is out of the league after his rookie contract would your view still hold water? A top level RB who can also line up wide and catch as good as a starting caliber slot receiver is more valuable than an average pass rusher any day.

 

 

Name a RB that the Bills passed over in round 1 in the past 25 years that was a regrettable decision.

 

It's simple math...........but every year somebody thinks this time is different.

 

[Doc]

12 hours ago, Logic said:

I disagree. Beane is a pretty straight shooter. Case in point: He talked leading up the draft about needing to "affect the opposing quarterback" more effectively, and then they drafted two edge rushers in the first two rounds. How do you explain that?

 

The difference is that there were 5-6 DEs with 1st round potential, and the consensus top DE, Phillips, was sure to be long gone by 30 and the rest were mostly a coin flip.  ETN OTOH was the only RB with "homerun" ability and RBs have been devalued.

Edited May 23, 2021 by Doc

[BADOLBILZ]

12 hours ago, Logic said:

Personally, I believe that the "Bills want to trade up for ETN" smoke was real. I believe they tried. I believe ETN was the player they were targeting.

Beane literally said that if a running back added something to the room that they didn't already have, they'd absolutely take him. He want on just a few sentences later to admit that something they lack in the room is "a home run hitter". He also explained that guys like CMC and Kamara are worth first round picks because they improve both the run and pass game. Now we hear that ETN is cross-training as a WR in Jacksonville.

We'll never know for sure how serious the Bills' interest in ETN was, but it is my personal opinion that they were very interested.

 

 

I agree.

 

We have seen Beane trade up for a guard with RT flexibility in the second round and draft RB's in the 3rd round two years in a row.

 

It's in his nature.

 

Like his mentor Dave Gettleman.......big uglies and RB's are probably too high on Beane's personal list.

 

Sometimes you gotta' be lucky and have fate intervene to prevent stupid mistakes like drafting a RB in round 1.    The Bills haven't "regrettably" passed on one RB that went in round 1 in at least 25 years.   Thinking that would change with one of these high mileage Etienne/Harris models would have been the epitome of impulse buying irrationality.

 

Pass rushers are second only to QB's in value in today's NFL........they are also high risk but the potential return is very high.

 

So having the draft fall that way was a stroke of good fortune for the organization, IMO........dodged a bullet this time........but the reality is that CB and WR need to be higher priorities in today's NFL.................I trust that Beane will grow out of his remaining Gettlenutz tendencies as he gains further perspective on what works and what does not.     

 

Returns on investments like Tre White and Stefon Diggs have been second only to Josh Allen.........it's best to value those positions far above RB in todays NFL.

[whorlnut]

20 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Name a RB that the Bills passed over in round 1 in the past 25 years that was a regrettable decision.

 

It's simple math...........but every year somebody thinks this time is different.

 

Disagree. This year WAS different.  We are finally in a spot where we can make luxury picks. It’s what good teams do. A guy like Etienne would have put this offense over the top. Can anyone tell me that it would be a bad thing to have a guy like Alvin Kamara on the team?  That’s who he has been compared to...

[BADOLBILZ]

2 minutes ago, whorlnut said:

Disagree. This year WAS different.  We are finally in a spot where we can make luxury picks. It’s what good teams do. A guy like Etienne would have put this offense over the top. Can anyone tell me that it would be a bad thing to have a guy like Alvin Kamara on the team?  That’s who he has been compared to...

 

You didn't answer my question.     There ISN'T a first round RB that the Bills have passed on in the past 25 years that was in the least bit regrettable.

 

As for the mythical "putting the offense over the top".........the Bills offense was literally second in the NFL in scoring last season.    

 

The reason was because they threw the ball downfield a lot.......and effectively.

 

Etienne isn't very likely to be like Alvin Kamara..........in fact the beating he took in college makes it more likely that he'll be JAG with the Jags.

 

But even if Etienne met any unreasonable expectation and did become a great RB.......feeling compelled to hand it off......or even dump it off........to an Alvin Kamara instead of throwing it downfield is a recipe for less than what the Bills did offensively in 2020.

 

As good as Kamara and McCaffrey are for RB's.........they average around 8 yards per reception for their careers............that juice is hardly worth the squeeze of putting it in the air when you have receivers that average 12-17 yards per reception.    

 

The position is devalued because there is only so much difference a RB can make in today's game.

 

And no, there is NEVER a good time to use round 1 for a "luxury pick".    Free agency changes rosters in a heartbeat now.    

[DrDawkinstein]

15 hours ago, Victory Formation said:

And if Etienne does end up being a Christian McCafferry talent, do you pay a RB $16M/yr when it comes to their second contract?

 

If ETN ends up a McCaffery talent, added to THIS offense, then we win at least 1 (if not 2) Super Bowls. And when his 5 years are up, we let him walk and draft another RB high.

 

While folks are right to hold the general rule of "dont draft a RB in the 1st", that is more true for regular or even losing teams like we have been in the past. The situation changes for a winning team that has most of the rest of their roster in place. When you have pretty much everything else set, or can address it elsewhere, getting into a cycle of drafting a top-talent RB in the 1st every 5 years isn't the worst place to be.

[whorlnut]

17 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

If ETN ends up a McCaffery talent, added to THIS offense, then we win at least 1 (if not 2) Super Bowls. And when his 5 years are up, we let him walk and draft another RB high.

 

While folks are right to hold the general rule of "dont draft a RB in the 1st", that is more true for regular or even losing teams like we have been in the past. The situation changes for a winning team that has most of the rest of their roster in place. When you have pretty much everything else set, or can address it elsewhere, getting into a cycle of drafting a top-talent RB in the 1st every 5 years isn't the worst place to be.

Exactly. The argument to never draft a running back in the first is for crappy teams. We are one of the top teams in the league now and a guy like Etienne is someone that could be a serious weapon for the next five years at a minimum. People will argue Breida, but there is no guarantee he will be here after this year. A long term home run threat at RB is still a need. 

[BADOLBILZ]

18 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

If ETN ends up a McCaffery talent, added to THIS offense, then we win at least 1 (if not 2) Super Bowls. And when his 5 years are up, we let him walk and draft another RB high.

 

While folks are right to hold the general rule of "dont draft a RB in the 1st", that is more true for regular or even losing teams like we have been in the past. The situation changes for a winning team that has most of the rest of their roster in place. When you have pretty much everything else set, or can address it elsewhere, getting into a cycle of drafting a top-talent RB in the 1st every 5 years isn't the worst place to be.

 

 

There is zero frame of reference for that take.

 

Who are these organization changing RB's?

 

How many times did we have to watch the Saints face-plant in the playoffs to realize that the impact of an Alvin Kamara doesn't really make much of a difference?

 

Teams without great regular season RB play have been consistently winning SB's for decades now.    It's not important to have an exceptional RB.

 

As for the notion that whatever RB you pick in round 1 will be good.............and therefore you can just pick one every 5 years.............I think you should look at the list of RB's drafted in round 1 over the decade previous to this season.     Basically,  if they were drafted from 10-32 they were mostly underwhelming or outright busts.........and if they were picked in the top 10 they were about 50/50 to succeed.

[Boxcar]

11 hours ago, Putin said:

Agree with this ^^^ and our first two picks probably confirmed ^^^^^

The fact that Ben Allbright was riding the ETN train all the way, plus the fact that ETN himself believed he would be taken by the Bills (meaning extensive communication between the two parties) leads me to believe he would have been the pick at 30. The Basham pick was explained: he was simply so much higher than the others on their board that they couldn't pass him up. They didn't think he'd be there. If guys pan out and you ended up having too many stars at DE, you can always trade one for a premium because that's a very valuable position.

 

Of course, PFF would poop on taking a RB in the first but who's complaining if we ended up with a Kamara or CMC?

[Mr. WEO]

Etienne was excited about living in New York City....

[Gugny]

17 hours ago, StHustle said:

 

How can you say this? If Etienne ends up a HOF and Rousseau is out of the league after his rookie contract would your view still hold water? A top level RB who can also line up wide and catch as good as a starting caliber slot receiver is more valuable than an average pass rusher any day.

 

[BADOLBILZ]

1 hour ago, Boxcar said:

Of course, PFF would poop on taking a RB in the first but who's complaining if we ended up with a Kamara or CMC?

 

By that logic, who would complain if the Bills ended up with Quenton Nelson instead of Josh Allen?

 

Nelson looked like a HOF'er the moment he took the field.

 

If positional value doesn't matter then that would have been a win.

 

But,  positional value is important.

 

RB's are still a relative dime a dozen.    

 

The most explosive RB in the league is not Kamara or CMC........it's Raheem Mostert........who was a UDFA that kicked around with 4 teams before making it in SF.

 

Mostert is the kinda' guy you want when you have a QB like Josh Allen who can utilize the whole field with his great arm and athleticism.    A true burner,  not a 4.5 guy like Etienne,  and a guy you don't have to give 200+ touches to in order to justify the investment........... because taking the ball out of Allen and his WR's hands is not recommended.

 

If you have a noodle armed check down pocket passer like Drew Brees or Teddy Bridgewater maybe you want to get your RB the ball a lot more.........in Buffalo the goal should be stretching the field more.

 

[3rdand12]

15 hours ago, Doc said:

Again there is no way that Beane would tell everyone that the Bills were targeting ETN, who is the only running back he could have been talking about.

Nope of course not, but it did have the feel they were looking at RBs anywhere on the Board as a real possibility. and rightly so

 Wish this kid well. he is going to be a good player for the Jags