nedboy7 Posted May 19, 2021 Posted May 19, 2021 Well that's why you play the game. For PFF's off-season rankings. 1
Gambit Posted May 19, 2021 Posted May 19, 2021 2 hours ago, Jay_Fixit said: How is it laughable? Josh is better and there's no debating it.
Nextmanup Posted May 19, 2021 Posted May 19, 2021 (edited) "That's right — 23 turnover-worthy plays, but only 16 turnovers, which was still a top-10 figure among quarterbacks. It looks as though there was definite potential for worse, which was only exceeded by that of Wentz in his abysmal 2020 campaign with the Philadelphia Eagles." Edited May 19, 2021 by Nextmanup
Buftex Posted May 19, 2021 Posted May 19, 2021 1 hour ago, Doc said: Brady's offense was stacked Even before the addition of Brown. Yeah, like I said, I will take Josh over the rest at this point..but you aren't going to win a lot of arguments saying that he is better than Brady...even if we know it. Brady has been doing it for decades (literally) with varying levels of talent around him... 1
LABILLBACKER Posted May 19, 2021 Posted May 19, 2021 He's #1 in FF rankings...that says all you need to know.
Big Turk Posted May 19, 2021 Posted May 19, 2021 23 hours ago, Warcodered said: Did Wilson manage to get a MVP vote in a year he seemed destined to get at least one. Wilson seems to do the same thing every year...he has stretches of the year where he is amazing then at some point the offense basically stops being able to move the ball and he has either games where he is invisible or long stretches of a game where he does nothing. Happens year after year but nobody calls him out on how he just seems to disappear at times?
CorkScrewHill Posted May 19, 2021 Author Posted May 19, 2021 2 hours ago, Nextmanup said: "That's right — 23 turnover-worthy plays, but only 16 turnovers, which was still a top-10 figure among quarterbacks. It looks as though there was definite potential for worse, which was only exceeded by that of Wentz in his abysmal 2020 campaign with the Philadelphia Eagles." I also wonder if more of Josh's turnover worthy plays that are not turnovers are due to how hard he throws. I would think it would take some getting used to. If you are not expecting the ball to get there so hard and so quickly I could see "drops" by DBs.
WideNine Posted May 19, 2021 Posted May 19, 2021 (edited) 5 hours ago, Bangarang said: Not sure why you’re criticizing his pre-snap reads. That seemed to be an area where he knew what he was doing and was making proper checks at the line depending on the defense. I think Allen was getting better too, but KC was throwing him off by changing alignment right before the snap... and that was causing him a lot of confusion. Perhaps his presnap process was getting a bit too predictable so it was easier to time when to throw in the monkey wrench. Not sure how you prevent that other than throw in some no-huddle to force more base defense looks and/or call runs and such that do not rely upon much pre-snap coverage reads and protections and start dictating cadence more.... Edited May 19, 2021 by WideNine
Jay_Fixit Posted May 19, 2021 Posted May 19, 2021 4 hours ago, Gambit said: Josh is better and there's no debating it. There’s actually quite a bit to debating it. Hence why I asked the question. 1
Ya Digg? Posted May 20, 2021 Posted May 20, 2021 6 hours ago, Gambit said: Josh is better and there's no debating it. Well why didn't someone just say this at the beginning of this thread?? Then this wouldn't have carried on for 4 pages! Take off you Bills colored glasses for a second and it's certainly debatable. Josh had a better season this past season, but Watson has been at a very high level since he entered the league - can't say the same about Josh
Gambit Posted May 20, 2021 Posted May 20, 2021 2 hours ago, Ya Digg? said: Well why didn't someone just say this at the beginning of this thread?? Then this wouldn't have carried on for 4 pages! Take off you Bills colored glasses for a second and it's certainly debatable. Josh had a better season this past season, but Watson has been at a very high level since he entered the league - can't say the same about Josh Watson also had Hopkins until last year. Josh gets his number 1 and works his ass off and it showed. My Bills colored glasses? It's not like I said he was better than Mahomes or Rodgers.
Ya Digg? Posted May 20, 2021 Posted May 20, 2021 6 hours ago, Gambit said: Watson also had Hopkins until last year. Josh gets his number 1 and works his ass off and it showed. My Bills colored glasses? It's not like I said he was better than Mahomes or Rodgers. And without Hopkins he still threw for almost 5000 yards, only had 7 interceptions, 112 rating, and did all this with really no one to throw to. What I’m taking aim at in your comments is you said it’s not even debatable that Josh is superior. While it looks like Watson is a creep, the guy is an incredibly talented quarterback and you saying it shouldn’t even be debated is laughable. Obviously as a Bills fan I want Allen ranked higher and i do in fact think he will end up being the better QB but I’m also not discounting or degrading what Watson can do on the field 1
Boxcar Posted May 20, 2021 Posted May 20, 2021 (edited) On 5/18/2021 at 8:00 PM, Doc said: He needs to cut down on the fumbles when scrambling or getting sacked, I think we can all agree. As for the "turnover-worthy plays," I believe there was a video of them and the vast majority would have taken superhuman effort to turn them into INTs. Especially compared to the ones from Mahomes, which were mostly just drops. Hopefully a sign for the future. I don't really understand how you can have a subjective standalone stat. For example, Tyreek Hill had 11 drops last year with one outlet, and 5 with another. If there's no objective measure as to what constitutes a "dropped pass" or "turnover worthy play" then that stat is completely worthless. I mean, number of receptions is a pretty meaningless stat because a quick screen and a 40 yard bomb are both receptions in the books, but at least in both cases the receiver objectively caught the ball and advanced his team on the field. You see this in every sport, the analytics crowd starts to form and then you have sites like PFF, which are somewhat useful but unfortunately staffed by conceited a-holes who aren't smart enough to be employed in an NFL front office, so they spend their time talking down to the common "dumb fans" to make themselves feel better. For analytics driven people (supposedly) they sure seem to have a hard time being objective when it comes to retracting old, ice cold takes. What's worst about PFF is that, unlike analytic sites in other sports, you have to pay like 35 bucks a month just to be able to see their stats. It's ridiculous. There's value in being a dumb fan. I used to run a Blue Jays podcast that was gaining traction, doing pretty well, but I was always analyzing things from an analytic perspective. There's no nuance. Something is either the correct decision or the wrong decision. Your best hitter should not hit 3rd. Starting pitchers should not pitch more than twice through the batting order, etc. etc. Eventually, it just sucks all the fun out of the game and I got burnt out to the point where I no longer watch baseball because I don't enjoy it. The Rays ruined baseball and I hate them, and I'm glad that them "following analytics" cost them the WS last year. Edited May 20, 2021 by Boxcar 1
Gambit Posted May 20, 2021 Posted May 20, 2021 8 hours ago, Ya Digg? said: And without Hopkins he still threw for almost 5000 yards, only had 7 interceptions, 112 rating, and did all this with really no one to throw to. What I’m taking aim at in your comments is you said it’s not even debatable that Josh is superior. While it looks like Watson is a creep, the guy is an incredibly talented quarterback and you saying it shouldn’t even be debated is laughable. Obviously as a Bills fan I want Allen ranked higher and i do in fact think he will end up being the better QB but I’m also not discounting or degrading what Watson can do on the field Neither am I. I think Watson is a damn good QB. Just not top 3 good imo. My bad for saying it's not debatable. I also never once brought up his off field issues.
Jay_Fixit Posted May 20, 2021 Posted May 20, 2021 9 hours ago, Ya Digg? said: And without Hopkins he still threw for almost 5000 yards, only had 7 interceptions, 112 rating, and did all this with really no one to throw to. What I’m taking aim at in your comments is you said it’s not even debatable that Josh is superior. While it looks like Watson is a creep, the guy is an incredibly talented quarterback and you saying it shouldn’t even be debated is laughable. Obviously as a Bills fan I want Allen ranked higher and i do in fact think he will end up being the better QB but I’m also not discounting or degrading what Watson can do on the field Refreshing post.
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