BillStime Posted March 17, 2023 Author Posted March 17, 2023 6 minutes ago, B-Man said: Meanwhile, it's day 864 of you freaks trying to excuse Conald's big loss. idiots Seriously, do think at all? 1
B-Man Posted March 17, 2023 Posted March 17, 2023 10 minutes ago, redtail hawk said: no mystery here. She isn't very likable and "deplorables" put a dagger in her campaign. Agreed. That's why the "Big lie" about Russian Collusion is false (not interference, the Russians have always tried to interfere in every election) . 1 1
BillStime Posted March 17, 2023 Author Posted March 17, 2023 4 minutes ago, B-Man said: That's why the "Big lie" about Russian Collusion is false Meanwhile, she got how many more votes than Crump? 1
SoCal Deek Posted March 17, 2023 Posted March 17, 2023 44 minutes ago, redtail hawk said: Sure they are for medium to small biz. My biz too. Look at what Apple and the alphabet companies pay proportionally. or the "nonprofits" like hospital systems. oh, and mr. trump...the are many mr trump's out there. With much respect….You’re being cunningly lied to. All corporations pay taxes. And if/when they don’t retain the money, which they cannot forever, they then distribute those funds to owners and shareholders who, you guessed it….pay taxes. It’s a complete leftist wet dream that taxes are somehow magically not being paid. The money doesn’t disappear. 1
Joe Ferguson forever Posted March 17, 2023 Posted March 17, 2023 (edited) 12 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: With much respect….You’re being cunningly lied to. All corporations pay taxes. And if/when they don’t retain the money, which they cannot forever, they then distribute those funds to owners and shareholders who, you guessed it….pay taxes. It’s a complete leftist wet dream that taxes are somehow magically not being paid. The money doesn’t disappear. Really? How are we getting this or similarly foreign profit taxes money back? "The returns also show that Trump paid more in foreign taxes than in US federal income taxes in 2017, the first year of his presidency. In 2017, Trump paid just $750 in US federal income taxes because of large carry-forward losses that he claimed in prior years, negating virtually all of his American tax liability. Yet Trump paid nearly $1 million in taxes to foreign countries that year. The fact that Trump paid foreign taxes isn’t in itself surprising, but it shows how Trump’s companies and businesses interests span the globe, and how those businesses are subject to local tax laws and regulations." https://www.cnn.com/2022/12/30/politics/donald-trump-tax-returns-released/index.html Edited March 17, 2023 by redtail hawk
SoCal Deek Posted March 17, 2023 Posted March 17, 2023 13 minutes ago, redtail hawk said: Really? How are we getting this or similarly foreign profit taxes money back? "The returns also show that Trump paid more in foreign taxes than in US federal income taxes in 2017, the first year of his presidency. In 2017, Trump paid just $750 in US federal income taxes because of large carry-forward losses that he claimed in prior years, negating virtually all of his American tax liability. Yet Trump paid nearly $1 million in taxes to foreign countries that year. The fact that Trump paid foreign taxes isn’t in itself surprising, but it shows how Trump’s companies and businesses interests span the globe, and how those businesses are subject to local tax laws and regulations." https://www.cnn.com/2022/12/30/politics/donald-trump-tax-returns-released/index.html Geeez. What it shows is that he paid the taxes he owed. Somehow the term losses escaped you and like all devoted leftists you focus only on the gains. I had a now retired business partner who never got this simple concept. There is literally no hiding anything! If you don’t pay the taxes the government has this unquenchable thirst for this year, you’ll pay them next year. Once again…the money doesn’t evaporate!!!
Joe Ferguson forever Posted March 17, 2023 Posted March 17, 2023 (edited) 7 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: Geeez. What it shows is that he paid the taxes he owed. Somehow the term losses escaped you and like all devoted leftists you focus only on the gains. I had a now retired business partner who never got this simple concept. There is literally no hiding anything! If you don’t pay the taxes the government has this unquenchable thirst for this year, you’ll pay them next year. Once again…the money doesn’t evaporate!!! Really? I use all tax breaks that I can too. And have written off losses. I don't use tax shelters and foreign banks. Are you saying there are no loopholes for the uber wealthy? https://www.capitalism.com/tax-loopholes-the-rich-use-to-pay-zero-taxes-with-examples/ Edited March 17, 2023 by redtail hawk
SoCal Deek Posted March 17, 2023 Posted March 17, 2023 Just now, redtail hawk said: Really? I use all tax breaks that I can too. And have written off losses. I don't use tax shelters and foreign banks. Are you saying there are no loopholes for the uber wealthy? Once again….geez! What you call tax breaks and loopholes are just part of the overall Tax Code! The base tax rate you’re fixated on is the MAXIMUM amount you pay, not the MINIMUM. That’s true for everyone, not just the ultra wealthy. Believe me when I say that I pay an absolutely obscene percentage of my income in taxes.
Joe Ferguson forever Posted March 17, 2023 Posted March 17, 2023 (edited) 2 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: Once again….geez! What you call tax breaks and loopholes are just part of the overall Tax Code! The base tax rate you’re fixated on is the MAXIMUM amount you pay, not the MINIMUM. That’s true for everyone, not just the ultra wealthy. Believe me when I say that I pay an absolutely obscene percentage of my income in taxes. well California, yeah. Why do you choose to live in the land of fruits and nuts? Edited March 17, 2023 by redtail hawk
Joe Ferguson forever Posted March 17, 2023 Posted March 17, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, SoCal Deek said: Once again….geez! What you call tax breaks and loopholes are just part of the overall Tax Code! The base tax rate you’re fixated on is the MAXIMUM amount you pay, not the MINIMUM. That’s true for everyone, not just the ultra wealthy. Believe me when I say that I pay an absolutely obscene percentage of my income in taxes. Here's an example of tax law that I benefit from and most people living at or near paycheck to paycheck don't: Medical Savings accounts. taken right off taxable income and not taxed when spent. I love it but... Many more examples where the tax laws favor the wealthy. Not many that I benefit from. I'm not saying it's illegal, I'm saying it's wrong. Even if every penny earned is counted. Geez... Edited March 17, 2023 by redtail hawk
SoCal Deek Posted March 17, 2023 Posted March 17, 2023 3 hours ago, redtail hawk said: Here's an example of tax law that I benefit from and most people living at or near paycheck to paycheck don't: Medical Savings accounts. taken right off taxable income and not taxed when spent. I love it but... Many more examples where the tax laws favor the wealthy. Not many that I benefit from. I'm not saying it's illegal, I'm saying it's wrong. Even if every penny earned is counted. Geez... Then your problem is (or should be) with Joe, Chuck, Nancy, and Mitch…not Trump. Those four have all been in Washington long enough to change all of it, but they don’t. 1
SoCal Deek Posted March 17, 2023 Posted March 17, 2023 3 hours ago, redtail hawk said: Here's an example of tax law that I benefit from and most people living at or near paycheck to paycheck don't: Medical Savings accounts. taken right off taxable income and not taxed when spent. I love it but... Many more examples where the tax laws favor the wealthy. Not many that I benefit from. I'm not saying it's illegal, I'm saying it's wrong. Even if every penny earned is counted. Geez... By the way, my understanding of a medical savings account was NOT that it was written to benefit the wealthy. It’s there so mostly middle class earners can set aside money for known and recurring medical costs rather than being taxed on them first and then writing them off later. If you’re healthy it has no benefit because you have no costs, regardless of your income status. 1
Joe Ferguson forever Posted March 17, 2023 Posted March 17, 2023 4 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: By the way, my understanding of a medical savings account was NOT that it was written to benefit the wealthy. It’s there so mostly middle class earners can set aside money for known and recurring medical costs rather than being taxed on them first and then writing them off later. If you’re healthy it has no benefit because you have no costs, regardless of your income status. You can only write off medical expenses if they are over 7.5% of income. MSA's don't require that. And I guess it depends on how you define middle income. I suspect (and I'm sure the data is out there) that mostly upper income folks fund them. This was the case in my biz.
SoCal Deek Posted March 17, 2023 Posted March 17, 2023 3 minutes ago, redtail hawk said: You can only write off medical expenses if they are over 7.5% of income. MSA's don't require that. And I guess it depends on how you define middle income. I suspect (and I'm sure the data is out there) that mostly upper income folks fund them. This was the case in my biz. I’m not sure we’re talking about the same thing. We did have a program where you could set aside money, pre-tax, for reoccurring annual medical expenses that you knew you’d have. It didn’t make any difference how much you made and nobody in my company was considered ultra wealthy. I personally had no such recurring expenses so it was of know benefit to me. On the former, I always used to laugh that for my expenses to be 7.5% of my annual income I’d have to cut off either a leg or arm every year; and you couldn’t possibly keep that up for too many years. 😉
Joe Ferguson forever Posted March 17, 2023 Posted March 17, 2023 6 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: I’m not sure we’re talking about the same thing. We did have a program where you could set aside money, pre-tax, for reoccurring annual medical expenses that you knew you’d have. It didn’t make any difference how much you made and nobody in my company was considered ultra wealthy. I personally had no such recurring expenses so it was of know benefit to me. On the former, I always used to laugh that for my expenses to be 7.5% of my annual income I’d have to cut off either a leg or arm every year; and you couldn’t possibly keep that up for too many years. 😉 My biz (and my employer after I sold it) had decent base insurance that everyone got. MSA's were also available to put away pre tax $s for out of pocket. As i recall, we needed a certain percentage to participate for the company to be eligible. We did that with the partners and a few other higher earners. The majority didn't participate probably because they didn't want a smaller paycheck. 1
SoCal Deek Posted March 17, 2023 Posted March 17, 2023 1 minute ago, redtail hawk said: My biz (and my employer after I sold it) had decent base insurance that everyone got. MSA's were also available to put away pre tax $s for out of pocket. As i recall, we needed a certain percentage to participate for the company to be eligible. We did that with the partners and a few other higher earners. The majority didn't participate probably because they didn't want a smaller paycheck. So what that means is that you had a healthy staff….which is good! It doesn’t say anything about perks for high earners.
Joe Ferguson forever Posted March 17, 2023 Posted March 17, 2023 (edited) 7 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: So what that means is that you had a healthy staff….which is good! It doesn’t say anything about perks for high earners. Actually, we had several with significant health issues. They couldn't afford the extra taken out or at least didn't think they could. It's much easier to fund an MSA if you are a high earner so it's mostly a perk to them. I'm almost happy when I pull out my MSA debit card to pay for stuff, even glasses or OTC meds. They aren't getting that benefit. Again, I'm sure data is available for participation at varying income levels but common sense (and my experience) says they're used by high earners much more often and I''m too lazy to look. It's just one example. but look how long it took to get to this point on this one. Many wealthy people pay a lower percentage of their income in taxes than do middle income folks. we'll have to agree to disagree unless you have data to refute that statement... Edited March 17, 2023 by redtail hawk
SoCal Deek Posted March 17, 2023 Posted March 17, 2023 2 minutes ago, redtail hawk said: Actually, we had several with significant health issues. They couldn't afford the extra taken out or at least didn't think they could. It's much easier to fund an MSA if you are a high earner so it's mostly a perk to them. I'm almost happy when I pull out my MSA debit card to pay for stuff, even glasses or OTC meds. They aren't getting that benefit. Again, I'm sure data is available for participation at varying income levels but common sense (and my experience) says they're used by high earners much more often and I''m too lazy to look. I think you’re looking at the symptom not the cause (poor analogy). This program doesn’t change how much the doctor charges you for glasses. It’s just a pay me now or pay me later program. Anyway, and I may be wrong here, I don’t think this was ever written as a perk for high earners. In fact, I generally thought of it as the exact opposite. 1
Joe Ferguson forever Posted March 17, 2023 Posted March 17, 2023 (edited) 4 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: I think you’re looking at the symptom not the cause (poor analogy). This program doesn’t change how much the doctor charges you for glasses. It’s just a pay me now or pay me later program. Anyway, and I may be wrong here, I don’t think this was ever written as a perk for high earners. In fact, I generally thought of it as the exact opposite. Perhaps, that's not how it is working out. and No, it's pay me with pre tax or pay me with post tax$. Why do I feel you're purposefully being opaque?🤔 I'll stop after posting the 1st thing I found on a search: "This shows that the tax system is not progressive when it comes to the wealthy. The richest 1% pay an effective federal income tax rate of 24.7%. That is a little more than the 19.3% rate paid by someone making an average of $75,000. And 1 out of 5 millionaires pays a lower rate than someone making $50,000 to $100,000." Fact Sheet: Taxing Wealthy Americans Edited March 17, 2023 by redtail hawk
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