McShay- Bills trying to move up above 23 for Etienne

[The Jokeman]

43 minutes ago, BuffaloRebound said:

I don’t like taking a RB in the 1st round, but this is a unique year.  The lack of info on these prospects probably pushes RB’s up the draft board because RB’s are easier to scout and project.  
Do you roll the dice on a guy like Farley or take more of a sure thing in Etienne?  

Farley isn't a great fit for the Bills zone defense, he's more of man corner that relies on his size to jam guys and then run with them. 

[BillsShredder83]

15 hours ago, Reed83HOF said:

No one knew Allen or any other pick of ours; they are air tight there..

 

Now has a team told someone we called, it's possible, but would they know who we want? Not a chance in hell. It feels like somewhere along the chain someone attached Etienne's name

I doubt any team knows, but if they did and leaked it, that's the end of a working relationship between the 2. There's on 31 other gms, that kinda practice is very bad business id assume

[ExWNYer]

7 minutes ago, The Jokeman said:

Farley isn't a great fit for the Bills zone defense, he's more of man corner that relies on his size to jam guys and then run with them. 

 

He definitely needs to work on his zone coverage skills but he's a 'Top 10', talent, if healthy, and a probable 'shut down' corner. You find a way to make him fit. He's a rare talent who trumps scheme and he would bring some versatility that would allow McDermott to change up his coverage packages, if necessary.

[TheBeaneBandit]

8 minutes ago, BillsShredder83 said:

I dont think Beanes the type to let ego get in the way, and I think its only admitting Singletary, Moss is gunna be a nice back for us IMO. Not saying we will do this, just that if Beane thinks it's best case scenario, he'll pull the trigger

Right on man, and I'm not even saying it's my first choice (DE, CB, WR in that order) but like I said it's a gut feeling/BPA situation for me. 

[mjt328]

1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said:

We are returning players on a team that went 13-3.  It's not like we are returning players from a 7-9 team.

 

I believe we can win 13 games again.  I believe we can win the AFC East again.  I believe we can make the AFC Championship again.

My problem is believing we can defeat the Kansas City Chiefs.  We were 0-2 last year, and I don't think we've taken the steps necessary to vault above them.

 

Quote

You're looking at it as 100% on the players.  We had no problem scoring on even better defenses than the Chiefs but for whatever reason, couldn't score on the Chiefs.  We have the players on offense to score on the Chiefs, we just need a better game plan....healthy WR too.

 

We tried two different gameplans, and failed both times.  And honestly, neither game was particularly close.

The first time we tried playing "keep away" from Patrick Mahomes, and got totally stampeded by their run game.  The second time we played our regular McDermott zone defense and hoped our offense could outperform theirs.  The offense choked and the pass defense was absolutely destroyed.

 

In contrast, Tampa Bay showed the way to beat the Chiefs is by getting heavy pressure.  

 

I agree our offense played bad in the Championship Game.  But our solution for beating the Chiefs can't just be... "Score 40 points and cross your fingers!"  Our defense needs to be able to make some stops against them.  The McDermott defense is dependent on having a strong pass rush from the D-Line.  Our guys can't seem to handle that job, so I would say more talent is needed.  That is players.  Not just gameplan.

 

Quote

Efe I think will give us more than Jefferson.  Star coming back helps with a fat man in the middle, hopefully freeing up Oliver more.  Epenesa is in year 2 and will need him to take the next step.  Plus we have the draft.  This offseason isn't over.

 

Be honest.  You never heard of Efe Obada before he signed with Buffalo.  He is not the answer to our pass rush.

Star Lotulelei should help a little, but he's getting up there in age and sat out an entire season.  

I am also hoping for a big step from AJ Epenesa, but it's also realistic to expect Jerry Hughes/Mario Addison to take a step back.

 

The offseason isn't over.  But that's kind of the point of this thread.  

If we waste a 1st Rounder (and more) to land Travis Etienne, you can say goodbye to upgrading the D-Line in 2021.

 

Edited April 27, 2021 by mjt328

[blacklabel]

I'm fine with them grabbing one of the top backs early. I've said before, I believe with their first two picks they want players that can contribute early. They're in the window for a championship right now and don't wanna spend draft capital on a guy that isn't really gonna make much impact until his second or third season. So you have to look at which position groups have players ready to go in 2021. RB fits that, WR, CB, I think those are the deeper groups in this class. RB definitely seems likely. I also think they could potentially look for an LB or DB for their big nickel spot. Whatever they do, I'm fine. 

[Max Fischer]

Why this is "leak" is absurd to me:

1. I think we can all agree it would not be in the Bills best interest to leak interest in any player. 
2. I think we can all agree that Beane runs a very tight ship, leaks have not happened. 
3. Let's name the number of times the Bills telegraphed ANY move:  Um, never?
4. How would this information get out? If they are talking trade, why would they TELL the other team their target?

 

Bonus: Trading UP for a first round RB makes zero sense. 

 

Edited April 27, 2021 by Max Fischer

[SCBills]

1 hour ago, mjt328 said:

 

I'll be completely honest.  This has been a terrible and horribly disappointing offseason for the Bills.  At least so far.

Our biggest free agent additions have been a backup quarterback (on a one-year deal) and swapping John Brown for Emmanuel Sanders (basically a wash if both guys are healthy).  Nothing has been done to upgrade the pass rush.  Nothing has been done to improve the secondary.  

 

To make matters worse, our rivals in the AFC East have made some nice improvements.  The Dolphins are loaded with draft picks to upgrade an already strong roster.  The Jets are a few days away from getting a potential franchise QB, and also have a ton of selections.  And after filling tons of holes in free agency, don't be surprised if Justin Fields falls in Bill Belichick's lap on Thursday night.  Yuck.

 

This offseason was Brandon Beane's golden opportunity to solidify the Bills among the NFL's elite teams.  Our performance in the AFC Championship Game was awful.  It was disgustingly bad.  We didn't even look like legit competition for the Chiefs.  Then two weeks later, the world saw Tampa Bay lay-out the blueprint for beating them.  And it wasn't by featuring a Pro-Bowl running back.  I don't understand how anyone could watch Chiefs receivers running open all game, and be fine with the exact same players in coverage.  I don't understand how anyone could watch the Super Bowl, and be fine with trotting out the exact same group of pass rushers.

 

I want to trust Beane.  And in many ways, he's earned our trust as Bills fans.  But I cannot imagine how picking a RUNNING BACK in the first round (especially with a trade-up) could possibly be the answer.  Just look to the #4 team picking in the draft (Atlanta) to see how quickly a championship-caliber roster can fall apart due to bad decisions.  

 

 

I can understand the criticisms regarding our defense.  I think we have way too many solid players on that side of the ball at the detriment to game-changers.  No idea why Addison is still on this team and if Edmunds doesn't break out this year, just admit the mistake and move on.  Obada seems like another solid rotation player of which we have wasted a ton of cap space on already, and we have to hope Star's return can free up Oliver to live up to his draft hype.    Not out of the realm of possibilities that this unit improves a lot, but their improvement relies on a handful of player upping their game.  Meanwhile KC runs the conference with 3 defensive studs, while scheming around them.  

 

On offense, I disagree.  Our OL was very good last year and if Beane believes they can run block better, I trust that they can.  Sanders over Brown, imo, was done because of KC.  He can win one v one, whereas Brown is an oft injured speed threat who hasn't come through for us in the playoffs.  This is an upgrade.  

 

I do think we need another elite threat on Offense... in my opinion, Etienne is that guy.  He's the most explosive player in the Draft that we can realistically get.  He's also more than a RB, in my view... He's a legit #2 weapon, elite level potential, to throw at teams when they try to shut down the QB/WR pass game.   

 

I'd also be ok addressing EDGE/CB/Hybrid LB in RD 1.  

[YoloinOhio]

1 hour ago, ExWNYer said:

 

Agreed, which is primarily why I don't want Etienne in the 1st Round, especially at the cost of additional draft assets. Even if you hit on one who makes it to his second contract, it's questionable at best whether allocating those resources to that position is a smart move. Dave Gettleman is about to find that out very soon.

There is a little difference in assets used. Gettleman used the #2 pick. He really does need to re-sign barkley to justify that. This is most likely the 30th pick. I don’t buy they would move up but even if they did it is still bottom of the draft vs pick 2. I’m not worried about a second contract because I think the RB role is one you use up at a young age and then replace. If he’s really good you could have him 6 years on a pretty cheap deal with the 5th yr option plus the tag. The option and tag for a RB isn’t that high. I don’t see pick 30 as some egregious place to take a RB with the WR capabilities that he has.  Daboll knows he needs to evolve the offense this year to add another element if he’s going to be as good or better than last year because teams have spent all offseason studying film to defend them. I would be excited but I’m sure it will be a corner, which is fine. 

Edited April 27, 2021 by YoloinOhio

[Royale with Cheese]

10 minutes ago, mjt328 said:

 

I believe we can win 13 games again.  I believe we can win the AFC East again.  I believe we can make the AFC Championship again.

My problem is believing we can defeat the Kansas City Chiefs.  We were 0-2 last year, and I don't think we've taken the steps necessary to vault above them.

 

 

We tried two different gameplans, and failed both times.  And honestly, neither game was particularly close.

The first time we tried playing "keep away" from Patrick Mahomes, and got totally stampeded by their run game.  The second time we played our regular McDermott zone defense and hoped our offense could outperform theirs.  The offense choked and the pass defense was absolutely destroyed.

 

In contrast, Tampa Bay showed the way to beat the Chiefs is by getting heavy pressure.  

 

I agree our offense played bad in the Championship Game.  But our solution for beating the Chiefs can't just be... "Score 40 points and cross your fingers!"  Our defense needs to be able to make some stops against them.  The McDermott defense is dependent on having a strong pass rush from the D-Line.  Our guys can't seem to handle that job, so I would say more talent is needed.  That is players.  Not just gameplan.

 

 

Be honest.  You never heard of Efe Obada before he signed with Buffalo.  He is not the answer to our pass rush.

Star Lotulelei should help a little, but he's getting up there in age and sat out an entire season.  

I am also hoping for a big step from AJ Epenesa, but it's also realistic to expect Jerry Hughes/Mario Addison to take a step back.

 

The offseason isn't over.  But that's kind of the point of this thread.  

If we waste a 1st Rounder (and more) to land Travis Etienne, you can say goodbye to upgrading the D-Line in 2021.

 

 

I never heard of Lorenzo Alexander before we signed him either.  I also never heard of Jordan Phillips before he signed here 3 years ago.  I don't think "never heard of him" is strong evidence that a player won't be good. 

Efe is raw and still learning.  He has great upside.  Doesn't mean he will succeed 100% but he's definitely worth a shot at $1.5 million.

https://pantherswire.usatoday.com/2021/02/15/panthers-efe-obada-pandemic-obstacles-video/

 

Obada saw his defensive snap count increase dramatically (from 306 in 2019 to 415 in 2020) and took advantage of the opportunity. He finished the year with 5.5 sacks, 15 quarterback hits, and 21 pressures, all career highs.

Most impressive was Obada’s versatility – he took to lining up inside as well as on the edge and proved capable at doing so. He’s a restricted free agent, so it’s a no-brainer for the Panthers to sign him for another year. Obada is an important piece for a defensive line rotation that’s growing.

 

So the game plan vs the Chiefs didn't work 2 times.  Why can't it change with a 3rd?  The Colts were 0-3 against the Pats in their first 3 playoff games before they figured it out.

[McBean]

Warming up more to ETN!

 

Didn’t know he held the record for ACC all time Leading rusher!!🤩🤩

[appoo]

 

this move means the Bills wouldn’t need any offensive player in this draft other than a TE prospect and OL depth, and upgrade the Bills to the best offense in the league.

 

Julio as your #2 weapon is absurd in this offense 

[mikemac2001]

Or this is just smoke to get other teams to trade up for that RB 

 

[ExWNYer]

25 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

There is a little difference in assets used. Gettleman used the #2 pick. He really does need to re-sign barkley to justify that. This is most likely the 30th pick. I don’t buy they would move up but even if they did it is still bottom of the draft vs pick 2. I’m not worried about a second contract because I think the RB role is one you use up at a young age and then replace. If he’s really good you could have him 6 years on a pretty cheap deal with the 5th yr option plus the tag. The option and tag for a RB isn’t that high. I don’t see pick 30 as some egregious place to take a RB with the WR capabilities that he has.  Daboll knows he needs to evolve the offense this year to add another element if he’s going to be as good or better than last year because teams have spent all offseason studying film to defend them. I would be excited but I’m sure it will be a corner, which is fine. 

 

I'm on record in several threads saying that while I wouldn't be thrilled with Etienne as their 1st Round pick, I get why they would do it. If they do, I'm okay with it. If they move up and use more assets to do it, then I am not. I'm not jumping off a cliff either way no matter what they do. I've also said that we can't control what they do or don't do as an organization so once the player is chosen, I'm pulling like hell for him to succeed as a Buffalo Bill whether or not I liked or disagreed with their choice. My personal preference is that they not take Etienne but I realize what he can bring to the offense. I'm hoping for a CB or WR but, regardless, I hope that whoever it is can be a long-time contributor and success.  

 

6 minutes ago, appoo said:

 

this move means the Bills wouldn’t need any offensive player in this draft other than a TE prospect and OL depth, and upgrade the Bills to the best offense in the league.

 

Julio as your #2 weapon is absurd in this offense 

 

Did Screamin' A suggest (yell) exactly what they should surrender for a 32 year-old WR with a big cap hit and discuss whether or not it's a good idea to commit that kind of money at the position when Diggs will be commanding a pay raise sooner rather than later? 

[Ta111]

15 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said:

We don't want the Bills to draft Etienne but what will we be saying if the Pats, Fins or Jets get him?

Good luck watching the playoffs from your couch?

[LABILLBACKER]

19 hours ago, NI Bills Fan said:

All for trading up... but not for Etienne. One of the top CBs or DEs I could see the justification in moving up for.

Yes he's fast and can catch the ball out of the backfield but his pass blocking is terrible. I like Phillips but I don't know if I trust his motivation or injury history. We need a pass rusher desperately but there's no compelling edge guys in our 30 range. Basham is more of a 2nd round guy. Too many unknowns??

[billieve420]

The case for taking a RB to protect Allen doesn't hold much water with me. Improving the O-line will do that as well and will make even the most average running back look decent.

[BaaadThingsMan]

19 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

Or bills want everyone to think they want etienne so someone jumps up for him and other guys fall 

Could go either way. I'm leaning this way also. They want someone and need them to fall a bit. 

[Reed83HOF]

1 hour ago, YoloinOhio said:

There is a little difference in assets used. Gettleman used the #2 pick. He really does need to re-sign barkley to justify that. This is most likely the 30th pick. I don’t buy they would move up but even if they did it is still bottom of the draft vs pick 2. I’m not worried about a second contract because I think the RB role is one you use up at a young age and then replace. If he’s really good you could have him 6 years on a pretty cheap deal with the 5th yr option plus the tag. The option and tag for a RB isn’t that high. I don’t see pick 30 as some egregious place to take a RB with the WR capabilities that he has.  Daboll knows he needs to evolve the offense this year to add another element if he’s going to be as good or better than last year because teams have spent all offseason studying film to defend them. I would be excited but I’m sure it will be a corner, which is fine. 

Nice post

1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

I never heard of Lorenzo Alexander before we signed him either.  I also never heard of Jordan Phillips before he signed here 3 years ago.  I don't think "never heard of him" is strong evidence that a player won't be good. 

Efe is raw and still learning.  He has great upside.  Doesn't mean he will succeed 100% but he's definitely worth a shot at $1.5 million.

https://pantherswire.usatoday.com/2021/02/15/panthers-efe-obada-pandemic-obstacles-video/

 

Obada saw his defensive snap count increase dramatically (from 306 in 2019 to 415 in 2020) and took advantage of the opportunity. He finished the year with 5.5 sacks, 15 quarterback hits, and 21 pressures, all career highs.

Most impressive was Obada’s versatility – he took to lining up inside as well as on the edge and proved capable at doing so. He’s a restricted free agent, so it’s a no-brainer for the Panthers to sign him for another year. Obada is an important piece for a defensive line rotation that’s growing.

 

So the game plan vs the Chiefs didn't work 2 times.  Why can't it change with a 3rd?  The Colts were 0-3 against the Pats in their first 3 playoff games before they figured it out.

TB had a nice game plan against them, but KCs OL was missing its 2 starting OTs and their interior was banged up as well. 

 

KCs DBs were allowed to hold and mug us in the AFCCG whereas in the SB it was called. That was the biggest impact on our offense and we did not have a running game or a reliable RB underneath the pull the Chiefs out of their defensive strategy...

[Rico]

Consider what happened the last time we traded up to take a weapon from Clemson and just say NO.