DCOrange Posted April 21, 2021 Posted April 21, 2021 (edited) https://theathletic.com/2532416/2021/04/21/nfl-draft-confidential-zach-wilson-to-the-jets-in-that-market-with-that-play-style-woof/ One of my favorite reads of the year where Bruce Feldman interviews position coaches from NFL teams to discuss different prospects. Some excerpts on players that might be of interest to Bills fans: Re: Terrace Marshall: Quote WR Coach 2: You see him on film split guys at Mizzou and at Mississippi. State. He was also a lot thicker than I thought he’d be at pro day. He can bend; catch low balls and stay in stride. He made those young quarterbacks look a little better last year. Re: Kadarius Toney: Quote WR Coach 1: They tell you his ball skills are phenomenal. I don’t know what to believe on that one. Are they good enough? Yes. I don’t know if he’s an every-down player. WR Coach 3: I liked his personality. He’s got a little Marshawn Lynch quality where he knows who he is and he’s not gonna fake it. He’s talented but really is a one-year guy. Re: Rondale Moore: Quote WR Coach 1: He’s game-changing fast, but his ball skills are fine, not great. WR Coach 3: Slot only, but he is so dynamic. Got a chance to be a steal if you can keep healthy. Re: Elijah Moore: Quote WR Coach 1: He can do a lot of stuff. They really had no route tree there and were just going as fast as they can. He was impressive in interviews; really candid. Was mature. Re: Jayson Oweh: Quote Defensive Coach 1: I know he didn’t have any sacks last year, but he was still really disruptive. He does things that don’t show up on the stat sheet. You watch their Indiana game, and he hit the quarterback like 10 times. Defensive Coach 2: I think he’s a 4-3 end; I didn’t think he could be a 3-4 outside linebacker. I don’t think he’s flexible. He is very tight-hipped. …He could become a 15-sack guy or he could just as easily be out of the league in three years. Re: Azeez Ojulari: Quote Defensive Coach 3: He’s a good all-around player; but not a freak pass rusher or special athlete in coverage. To me, he’s a pro-style 3-4 outside linebacker. Re: Greg Rousseau: Quote Defensive Coach 1: This kid is really raw. But he’s so long, and you just can’t find those guys with his kind of length and frame, and he ran mid-4.6s at his pro day, which was really impressive. He is like (Ravens defensive end) Calais Campbell. In a couple years, he could be really special. Re: Zaven Collins: Quote Defensive Coach 2: He has some freaky stuff to him, but he has to be in a particular scheme like Philly, Indy, Minnesota or Dallas where he can stack and run and hit; he’s not the most physical guy. I know people compare him to Anthony Barr, but I think Barr was more fluid. Re: Jeremiah Owusu-Koramoah: Quote Defensive Coach 3: I ***** love that guy. He’s an explosive athlete. I think he’s more ready to play linebacker in the NFL than Isaiah Simmons was. I think even if this guy is only a cover guy, he’s gonna be so impactful as a coverage LB, and he’s gonna be a demon on special teams. Defensive Coach 2: He moves like a good DB. Some teams will have him rated ahead of Parsons. He’s a specialty player. He’s a freak with his transitions and he’s physical. He’s a heat-seeking missile. Re: Najee Harris: Quote Scout 1: He is a true three-down back. He has elite bend and elite hands. No running backs are great in protection, but he’s solid. He’s a smart kid but he overanalyzes things. He will train three times a day if you let him; he just needs to settle down. Edited April 21, 2021 by DCOrange 1 7 11
mannc Posted April 21, 2021 Posted April 21, 2021 Thanks! I'd love to have any of those four WRs...Toney in particular has insane YAC ability, something our receivers seem to lack.
BornAgainBillsFan Posted April 21, 2021 Posted April 21, 2021 Thanks, DCOrange! These are the opinions that matter. Not the network/internet blowhards. 2
BillsShredder83 Posted April 21, 2021 Posted April 21, 2021 11 minutes ago, DCOrange said: https://theathletic.com/2532416/2021/04/21/nfl-draft-confidential-zach-wilson-to-the-jets-in-that-market-with-that-play-style-woof/ One of my favorite reads of the year where Bruce Feldman interviews position coaches from NFL teams to discuss different prospects. Some excerpts on players that might be of interest to Bills fans: Re: Terrace Marshall: Re: Kadarius Toney: Re: Rondale Moore: Re: Elijah Moore: Re: Jayson Oweh: Re: Azeez Ojulari: Re: Greg Rousseau: Re: Zaven Collins: Re: Jeremiah Owusu-Koramoah: Re: Najee Harris: Thanks for putting this together! Good stuff
DCOrange Posted April 21, 2021 Author Posted April 21, 2021 They have a lot of thoughts on all the QBs, including one of them specifically saying he thinks Zach Wilson will have a really hard time in New York and mentions how he doesn't have the legs to bail him out while he's learning how to be a QB like our own Josh Allen did. I had originally included the QB stuff in here too but then I realized it was the length of a short novel. Happy to post more excerpts if there's certain players people are interested in. The ones they discuss that I left off are: All of the top 8 QBs Kyle Pitts All the top WRs (including Rashod Bateman who I almost included in the OP) Seth Williams Dynami Brown Nico Collins Amari Rogers Josh Palmer Micah Parsons Jaelan Phillips Kwity Paye Christian Barmore Nick Bolton Jabril Cox Jamin Davis Dylan Moses Jevon Holland Jaycee Horn Patrick Surtain Penei Sewell Rashawn Slater Sam Ehlinger Payton Turner Racey McMath
GunnerBill Posted April 21, 2021 Posted April 21, 2021 Interesting on Ojulari that is pretty much word for word my scouting notes. Solid all around player, nice burst, but not a special pass rusher, inconsistent hand technique, 3-4 OLB only. 2
mannc Posted April 21, 2021 Posted April 21, 2021 15 minutes ago, DCOrange said: They have a lot of thoughts on all the QBs, including one of them specifically saying he thinks Zach Wilson will have a really hard time in New York and mentions how he doesn't have the legs to bail him out while he's learning how to be a QB like our own Josh Allen did. I had originally included the QB stuff in here too but then I realized it was the length of a short novel. Happy to post more excerpts if there's certain players people are interested in. The ones they discuss that I left off are: All of the top 8 QBs Kyle Pitts All the top WRs (including Rashod Bateman who I almost included in the OP) Seth Williams Dynami Brown Nico Collins Amari Rogers Josh Palmer Micah Parsons Jaelan Phillips Kwity Paye Christian Barmore Nick Bolton Jabril Cox Jamin Davis Dylan Moses Jevon Holland Jaycee Horn Patrick Surtain Penei Sewell Rashawn Slater Sam Ehlinger Payton Turner Racey McMath Would love to hear what they said about Phillips and Dyami Brown... 1
Hapless Bills Fan Posted April 21, 2021 Posted April 21, 2021 Awesome find - and great job pulling out key soundbites. Thanks! 12 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: Interesting on Ojulari that is pretty much word for word my scouting notes. Solid all around player, nice burst, but not a special pass rusher, inconsistent hand technique, 3-4 OLB only. So what are your scouting notes on Jayson Oweh? Feel free to just link if you've already posted elsewhere.
DCOrange Posted April 21, 2021 Author Posted April 21, 2021 4 minutes ago, mannc said: Would love to hear what they said about Phillips and Dyami Brown... Re: Phillips: Quote Defensive Coach 1: He reminds me a lot of Bradley Chubb. He doesn’t play the run as good as Chubb but rushes the passer as well. ... Did well in his interviews. He was not bashful; I thought he was mature; sounded like he’s figured it out. He didn’t shy away from the questions people have about him. He attacked it all head-on. Re: Dyami: Quote WR Coach 1: He’s got a long way to go. That offense that he played in is so different. I do think he can do it and make up for it, but it’s gonna take him some time. I also think he’s big enough to help you on special teams. WR Coach 3: He has inconsistent hands; but catches more deep balls than anybody. He gets on top of guys. He eats their cushion fast; he’s got subtleness to his routes. Everybody knows he’s going deep and he still gets by guys. 1
BarleyNY Posted April 21, 2021 Posted April 21, 2021 I’m interested to read what they say about Horn. Can you please post that? TIA
GunnerBill Posted April 21, 2021 Posted April 21, 2021 (edited) 4 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: So what are your scouting notes on Jayson Oweh? Feel free to just link if you've already posted elsewhere. I've alluded to it elsewhere but not sure I have completely set out my thinking.... high end athlete, speed, strength size guy. Like his speed to power conversion and think he is a solid tackler. He is the definition of "toolsy" but his lack of production to me as much as anything comes down to his lack of situational awareness. Think he bites on misdirection, doesn't really yet demonstrate an understanding of how blockers play him and so misses counter opportunities. In the run game he plays the inside run well and can crash down from the edge, but again it is a bit instinct and not insight and he loses contain in the outside run game too often. I am interested in the comment above that his hips are a bit stiff to play as a 3-4 OLB. I thought that initially as well but kind of allowed myself to be persuaded otherwise. I think he could play in either scheme, but in whatever scheme you put him I think he is a long term project. I don't expect him to be a difference maker as a rookie and patience would be needed. I suspect he was one of the guys Beane was thinking of when he said yesterday "some guys might come in and learn behind a starter in the last year of his deal and make a difference longer term". Edited April 21, 2021 by GunnerBill 1
DCOrange Posted April 21, 2021 Author Posted April 21, 2021 12 minutes ago, BarleyNY said: I’m interested to read what they say about Horn. Can you please post that? TIA Quote Scout 2: He’s a badass. He’s got great quickness. He loves to get physical. He’ll get too handsy, but I love how competitive he is. He’s the most talented corner in this class. One of the WR coaches also mentions regarding Seth Williams that Jaycee Horn dominated him head to head. 1
fergie's ire Posted April 21, 2021 Posted April 21, 2021 6 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: I've alluded to it elsewhere but not sure I have completely set out my thinking.... high end athlete, speed, strength size guy. Like his speed to power conversion and think he is a solid tackler. He is the definition of "toolsy" but his lack of production to me as much as anything comes down to his lack of situational awareness. Think he bites on misdirection, doesn't really yet demonstrate an understanding of how blockers play him and so misses counter opportunities. In the run game he plays the inside run well and can crash down from the edge, but again it is a bit instinct and not insight and he loses contain in the outside run game too often. I am interesting in the comment above that his hips are a bit stiff to play as a 3-4 OLB. I thought that initially as well but kind of allowed myself to be persuaded otherwise. I think he could play in either scheme, but in whatever scheme you put him I think he is a long term project. I don't expect him to be a difference maker as a rookie and patience would be needed. I suspect he was one of the guys Beane was thinking of when he said yesterday "some guys might come in and learn behind a starter in the last year of his deal and make a difference longer term". Thanks for this. I have been curious why his numbers don't match his athletic ability...and while I have seen many reference the athletics and others the numbers, I haven't seen much discussion about why there is a disconnect. This description makes him sound a bit like an edge version of Edmunds.
DCOrange Posted April 21, 2021 Author Posted April 21, 2021 (edited) 2 minutes ago, fergie's ire said: Thanks for this. I have been curious why his numbers don't match his athletic ability...and while I have seen many reference the athletics and others the numbers, I haven't seen much discussion about why there is a disconnect. This description makes him sound a bit like an edge version of Edmunds. Seems like a lot of people also think he was kinda like how we've seen Hughes the last couple years; a lot of pressures and disruptive plays but not quite able to get the sacks. As one of the guys mentioned in the OP, he hit the Indiana QB an insane number of times but never recorded a sack. I didn't watch much film on him but from what I did see, I would agree with Gunner's assessment; seems to be able to turn his speed into power well but if that doesn't work, he doesn't really know what to do from there yet. Edited April 21, 2021 by DCOrange
jahnyc Posted April 21, 2021 Posted April 21, 2021 Starting to believe that there is a lot of risk associated with almost all of the edge prospects (more than usual given the opt outs and the overall odd past college season). Even with the clear need for a better pass rush, I am starting to think that the Bills should draft a CB, RB or offensive lineman in the first round this year based on the limited information that I have seen.
H2o Posted April 21, 2021 Posted April 21, 2021 @DCOrange what's their take on Payton Turner/DE/Houston?
YoloinOhio Posted April 21, 2021 Posted April 21, 2021 16 minutes ago, DCOrange said: One of the WR coaches also mentions regarding Seth Williams that Jaycee Horn dominated him head to head. Tre White mentioned that about Horn on that Collinsworth podcast he was on a couple weeks ago.
mannc Posted April 21, 2021 Posted April 21, 2021 1 hour ago, DCOrange said: They have a lot of thoughts on all the QBs, including one of them specifically saying he thinks Zach Wilson will have a really hard time in New York and mentions how he doesn't have the legs to bail him out while he's learning how to be a QB like our own Josh Allen did. I had originally included the QB stuff in here too but then I realized it was the length of a short novel. Happy to post more excerpts if there's certain players people are interested in. The ones they discuss that I left off are: All of the top 8 QBs Kyle Pitts All the top WRs (including Rashod Bateman who I almost included in the OP) Seth Williams Dynami Brown Nico Collins Amari Rogers Josh Palmer Micah Parsons Jaelan Phillips Kwity Paye Christian Barmore Nick Bolton Jabril Cox Jamin Davis Dylan Moses Jevon Holland Jaycee Horn Patrick Surtain Penei Sewell Rashawn Slater Sam Ehlinger Payton Turner Racey McMath Any discussion of Kellen Mond or Mac Jones?
GunnerBill Posted April 21, 2021 Posted April 21, 2021 43 minutes ago, DCOrange said: Re: Dyami: On Dyami I am with them. I think his best fit is somewhere where there is an established #1 and he can be the #2. I think he can become a #1 receiver but it won't be as a rookie. I also agree on the subtlety of his route running. He doesn't run a lot of routes (that is a product of the offense he is in) but the ones he runs he runs as well as anyone in this class. I have said it before but I see a bit of Stef Diggs in him.
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