Pete King on Wentz

[1ManRaid]

9 hours ago, Billy Claude said:

 

New England did it pretty regularly -- 2016 Brissett (3rd).  2014 Garoppolo (2nd), 2011 Mallett (3rd)

 

To be fair, that time NE used their 2nd for Garoppolo, was when Belichick wanted to trade Brady but Kraft put his foot down so they traded Garoppolo instead.

 

So maybe it seems 2nd/3rd round is the line between "insurance backup" and "become an Pro Bowler or you're replaced".

[Billy Claude]

37 minutes ago, 1ManRaid said:

 

To be fair, that time NE used their 2nd for Garoppolo, was when Belichick wanted to trade Brady but Kraft put his foot down so they traded Garoppolo instead.

 

So maybe it seems 2nd/3rd round is the line between "insurance backup" and "become an Pro Bowler or you're replaced".

 

Also Wentz's reaction is pretty common.  I don't remember if Brady was angry at the time of the pick but clearly he was later.  Also Roethlisberger was angry about the Rudolph pick and obviously Rodgers is mad about the Love pick.  

 

I guess they felt they needed backup if Wentz failed and hope that Wentz would see it as a challenge rather than throw a hissy fit.

 

[machine gun kelly]

10 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

What if your QB is a head case who can't answer the bell?

 

 

was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor?

Forget he’s rolling.

 

 

10 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

What if your QB is a head case who can't answer the bell?

 

 

was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor?

As far as Wentz, I love it.  Indy is a pretty complete team and Wentz just made them weaker.

[GunnerBill]

5 hours ago, mannc said:

 

Wentz was literally the worst starting QB in the NFL last year.  It’s incredible what the Eagles were able to get in return for him.  And I can’t believe the Colts are handing over the keys to him...That’s a team that’s ready to contend.

 

Yep. This. I suspect we see some Jacob Eason this season.

5 hours ago, mannc said:

 

Wentz was literally the worst starting QB in the NFL last year.  It’s incredible what the Eagles were able to get in return for him.  And I can’t believe the Colts are handing over the keys to him...That’s a team that’s ready to contend.

 

Yep. This. I suspect we see some Jacob Eason this season.

[Doc Brown]

5 hours ago, mannc said:

It was this past fall.

Wentz was literally the worst starting QB in the NFL last year.  It’s incredible what the Eagles were able to get in return for him.  And I can’t believe the Colts are handing over the keys to him...That’s a team that’s ready to contend.

Reich worked with him for two years.  I'm pretty sure he knows what he's getting.  The Eagles front office was a circling firing squad that couldn't shoot straight.

[mannc]

13 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

Reich worked with him for two years.  I'm pretty sure he knows what he's getting.  The Eagles front office was a circling firing squad that couldn't shoot straight.

Sorry, I’m not buying the “Wentz as victim” card.  He stunk.  Obviously Reich thinks he can be saved, though.  Seems like a pretty big gamble, with no real back-up plan, for a team that could contend.

[GunnerBill]

7 minutes ago, mannc said:

Sorry, I’m not buying the “Wentz as victim” card.  He stunk.  Obviously Reich thinks he can be saved, though.  Seems like a pretty big gamble, with no real back-up plan, for a team that could contend.

 

Me neither. I mean just go and watch the film. The evidence is there. He was not reading coverages, he had happy feet in the pocket he was failing to take the simple throws that are the staple of the offense, he was holding the ball for eons and then trying to force balls into double coverage. He was absolutely atrocious. Nobody is trying to argue that the Eagles skill players were elite or that their oline down 3 starters was stellar but my god their Quarterback play was pathetic. 

 

EDIT: I'll say this... if Reich revives Wentz's career at this point it is one of the great coaching jobs of the last 20 years that I have been watching the league. He was beyond gone last season and he should have been benched long before he was. IF they still had a vet behind him like Foles or McCown he would have been. He only lasted so long because they were loathe to throw Hurts into the fire. 

Edited April 18, 2021 by GunnerBill

[Thurman#1]

10 hours ago, Miyagi-Do Karate said:

I care so little about the Eagles and Carson Wentz, and so it’s tough for me to muster up enough interest in what went down. 
 

But I do tend to agree with you. Just tracing this guy’s career, he’s not the sort of guy and was in not the sort of position/head space that you wanted to create a QB controversy by picking Hurts.  
 

The comparisons to Brady are ridiculous. Brady was well entrenched as a superstar when they were drafting guys like Garappalo, Brissett, Mallett. Wentz was embroiled in QB controversies from Day 1, and was coming off a shaky season. Then he just fell apart last year.
 

I am not sure how Wentz handled everything was great, but it’s not “mind boggling,” like King suggests. Just an overall weird situation. 

 

 

Agreed. If you read the Athletic article the other day on the Eagles, titled "Paranoia, mismanagement and office politics: Inside the Eagles' downfall under Jeffrey Lurie, Howie Roseman," they make a very good case that this is a seriously dysfunctional organization. 

 

https://theathletic.com/2506187/2021/04/12/paranoia-mismanagement-and-office-politics-inside-the-eagles-downfall-under-jeffrey-lurie-howie-roseman/

 

That doesn't totally let Wentz off the hook, but even good QBs rely on good relationships with coaches, environments and management, particularly as they develop. I mean, look at Watson, look at Russell Wilson, look at Tannehill. IMO it's not coincidence Wentz was at his best when Frank Reich was working with him.

Edited April 18, 2021 by Thurman#1

[Mr. WEO]

5 hours ago, Big Blitz said:

 

 

Peter King has become one of the worst.

 

 

There are 50 people on this board that are better more interesting and informative reads then King.  

 

He's not wrong here, so what's your point?

4 hours ago, 1ManRaid said:

 

To be fair, that time NE used their 2nd for Garoppolo, was when Belichick wanted to trade Brady but Kraft put his foot down so they traded Garoppolo instead.

 

So maybe it seems 2nd/3rd round is the line between "insurance backup" and "become an Pro Bowler or you're replaced".

 

Huh? Garoppolo was traded after 3 seasons.  There was no talk of trading Brady when they drafted Garoppolo.

[Mr. WEO]

3 hours ago, Billy Claude said:

 

Also Wentz's reaction is pretty common.  I don't remember if Brady was angry at the time of the pick but clearly he was later.  Also Roethlisberger was angry about the Rudolph pick and obviously Rodgers is mad about the Love pick.  

 

I guess they felt they needed backup if Wentz failed and hope that Wentz would see it as a challenge rather than throw a hissy fit.

 

 

All 3 of those QBs channeled their "anger" in to their best football, and very late in their careers.  Wentz collapsed in a pool of tears--he responded by actually getting worse.

[Philly McButterpants]

6 hours ago, Big Blitz said:

 

 

Peter King has become one of the worst.

 

 

There are 50 people on this board that are better more interesting and informative reads then King.  

 

Agreed - his relentless Pat*s ball-washing and love, Love, LOVE of all things Phins has made him unreadable - a shame too. 

[bobobonators]

I have a problem when anyone compares player A to Tom Brady. Its not fair to player A. The argument comes off as ridiculous. 

[Saxum]

12 minutes ago, bobobonators said:

I have a problem when anyone compares player A to Tom Brady. Its not fair to player A. The argument comes off as ridiculous. 

 

Yes hard to be as great as the Greatest Cheater of All Time in NFL.

[Beerball]

16 hours ago, Rocbillsfan1 said:

Really stupid take in my book. What other teams have selected a qb in the first round when their franchise qb is in his 20s and suppose to be the franchise guy. You don’t do that if you haven’t already moved on as an organization. Maybe if your starter is getting up there in years ala Rodgers but I mean cmon man. 

Why?

[dave mcbride]

4 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Me neither. I mean just go and watch the film. The evidence is there. He was not reading coverages, he had happy feet in the pocket he was failing to take the simple throws that are the staple of the offense, he was holding the ball for eons and then trying to force balls into double coverage. He was absolutely atrocious. Nobody is trying to argue that the Eagles skill players were elite or that their oline down 3 starters was stellar but my god their Quarterback play was pathetic. 

 

EDIT: I'll say this... if Reich revives Wentz's career at this point it is one of the great coaching jobs of the last 20 years that I have been watching the league. He was beyond gone last season and he should have been benched long before he was. IF they still had a vet behind him like Foles or McCown he would have been. He only lasted so long because they were loathe to throw Hurts into the fire. 

Enh ... Wentz was an above average qb in 2018 and 2019. Him regressing to the mean is hardly a sign of miracle working.

[GunnerBill]

1 minute ago, dave mcbride said:

Enh ... Wentz was an above average qb in 2018 and 2019. Him regressing to the mean is hardly a sign of miracle working.

 

I thought he was bad for most of 2019 he just hit his straps down the stretch and he did play well the last 6 or 7 games. I think this regression has been pretty consistent now. He is fundamentally broken at the moment. Fixing him would be a hell of a job. 

[Big Blitz]

2 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

He's not wrong here, so what's your point?

 

Did you read the quote?

 

 

“He obviously responded very negatively to Jalen Hurts being drafted,” King said. “Like, ‘Oh my God, they’re bringing in somebody to take my place or to put pressure on me or to play mind games,’ whatever it is he’s thinking. He’s probably never going to say it, but we know that he’s got to be ticked off about this. "

 

 

Where is his source for this?  He is essentially pretending to read Wentz's mind and state it as fact.  

 

Let's say I've never heard about this before.  I want to know what happened.  

 

And I read this.   This tells me King on one hand states as fact he reacted terribly to the pick, then goes on to say we have to think he had to.  

 

I can't believe I have to explain this.   

 

 

We know 2 things.  And one of them is actually still an assumption.

 

When Hurts was drafted of course by human nature Wentz may have been a little irked but we have zero proof of this.  

 

What we do know is when he was benched in week 13 he was p****d.  

 

That's it.  

 

 

Here's what we also know.  The Eagles offense minus Wentz was the worst group from o line to skill guys in the league not named Goedert or Ertz.  And Sanders was hurt most of the season.  

 

I expect the Colts to win 12 games and the AFC South.  Easily actually.

 

Edited April 18, 2021 by Big Blitz

[MrSarcasm]

17 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

“I believe – and one of the reasons why I thought Jalen Hurts was a good pick – that the backup quarterback is one of the most important people on your team. Because you better be sure that if your starting quarterback gets hurt, your season isn’t over. [...]

 

 

 

This is such a stupid comment. 99% of the time if your QB is out for more than 8 games your season is over. Wentz- Foles and Bledsoe- Brady are the exceptions to the rule. More often than not its more of a Rodgers- Kizer situation.

 

A good back up QB should win you 50% of the games he plays and that is if he has a good defense/team to support him. 

[FireChans]

1 hour ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I thought he was bad for most of 2019 he just hit his straps down the stretch and he did play well the last 6 or 7 games. I think this regression has been pretty consistent now. He is fundamentally broken at the moment. Fixing him would be a hell of a job. 

The only thing going for the Colts is a weak division and a STACKED roster. 
 

Rivers looked like 2015 Manning last season. He went to the Colts and they were in the playoffs.

 

Does Carson Wentz become Wentz of old? I doubt it. Too much baggage now. Does he show some flashes as a serviceable starter and win 10 games? Easily possible imo

[Clemfield2622]

i'm more curious about Pete Wentz's opinion on King