B-Man Posted May 15, 2023 Posted May 15, 2023 (edited) The U.S. is giving court dates to migrants who crossed into the U.S. illegally but who say they are seeking asylum. Bill Melugin shared a document showing just how speedy of a process it’s going to be for many: #BidenBorderDisaster Edited May 15, 2023 by B-Man 1
Andy1 Posted May 16, 2023 Posted May 16, 2023 I’ve long thought that the porous border and broken immigration system is exactly what corporate America wants to ensure a ready supply of immigrant labor. The immigrants I’m talking about are not the highly educated or trained ones but those uneducated and struggling to escape the poverty in their former countries. These immigrants become the workers used (exploited) by industries needing manual labor across the country. Picking fruits and vegetables, cleaning hotels, stacking lumber, paving, roofing, construction, landscaping, washing dishes, cleaning factories and office buildings, butchering animals in slaughter house factories, working on pig farms, chicken farms, ranching, fishing etc. These industries are all using immigrants (legal and illegal) for cheap labor. They are doing the jobs most Americans won’t do. This is a means where corporations can keep costs low. We all vote with our wallets so by extension, we support it too. America wants and needs a large supply of immigrants so corporate America can provide us what we want at a price we will pay. It ain’t pretty but we need these people. If the powers really wanted to fix this problem, it would have been solved decades ago.
T&C Posted May 16, 2023 Posted May 16, 2023 https://www.baynews9.com/fl/tampa/news/2023/05/15/mexico-says-renewed-texas-truck-inspections-at-border-delaying-freight-shipments 1
Tommy Callahan Posted May 16, 2023 Posted May 16, 2023 15 hours ago, B-Man said: I see our great governor is talking about building housing shelters on state land. while begging the FEDS for billions. 1
SoCal Deek Posted May 16, 2023 Posted May 16, 2023 9 hours ago, Andy1 said: I’ve long thought that the porous border and broken immigration system is exactly what corporate America wants to ensure a ready supply of immigrant labor. The immigrants I’m talking about are not the highly educated or trained ones but those uneducated and struggling to escape the poverty in their former countries. These immigrants become the workers used (exploited) by industries needing manual labor across the country. Picking fruits and vegetables, cleaning hotels, stacking lumber, paving, roofing, construction, landscaping, washing dishes, cleaning factories and office buildings, butchering animals in slaughter house factories, working on pig farms, chicken farms, ranching, fishing etc. These industries are all using immigrants (legal and illegal) for cheap labor. They are doing the jobs most Americans won’t do. This is a means where corporations can keep costs low. We all vote with our wallets so by extension, we support it too. America wants and needs a large supply of immigrants so corporate America can provide us what we want at a price we will pay. It ain’t pretty but we need these people. If the powers really wanted to fix this problem, it would have been solved decades ago. Andy…all of what you said is true. We actually HAVE a system in place for migrant workers to enter the country for the kind of work you outlined above. It’s been in place for decades. Those laws/systems are currently being ignored. 1 2
Andy1 Posted May 17, 2023 Posted May 17, 2023 12 hours ago, SoCal Deek said: Andy…all of what you said is true. We actually HAVE a system in place for migrant workers to enter the country for the kind of work you outlined above. It’s been in place for decades. Those laws/systems are currently being ignored. There is an anti immigrant theme in some corners of this country. I agree. Many migrants and many employers choose to ignore the system we have. Why do American employers choose to ignore the guest worker process? I don’t know but the problem is, the whole immigration system is broken. Legal immigration, especially when people have sponsors here, should be a much easier process than it is. If America wants to solve the problem, we can. Political forces on both sides are OK with the status quo. Both parties use it as an issue to scream about. No one wants to compromise so it must not be that important in the big picture. 1
SoCal Deek Posted May 17, 2023 Posted May 17, 2023 3 minutes ago, Andy1 said: There is an anti immigrant theme in some corners of this country. I agree. Many migrants and many employers choose to ignore the system we have. Why do American employers choose to ignore the guest worker process? I don’t know but the problem is, the whole immigration system is broken. Legal immigration, especially when people have sponsors here, should be a much easier process than it is. If America wants to solve the problem, we can. Political forces on both sides are OK with the status quo. Both parties use it as an issue to scream about. No one wants to compromise so it must not be that important in the big picture. You’re right. It isn’t important to either political party. That still doesn’t make it right. But I think you know that. Our two entrenched political parties stopped thinking about the future of this country quite a few election cycles ago. Keep the electorate at each other’s throats and vacuum up money for their reelection campaigns. Rinse and repeat. 1
B-Man Posted May 18, 2023 Posted May 18, 2023 Hochul is targeting SUNY Oswego and Geneseo to house illegals. https://cnycentral.com/news/local/suny-campuses-assessing-capacity-for-housing-asylum-seekers-at-gov-hochuls-request https://www.fingerlakesdailynews.com/regional-state-congressional/tenney-speaks-out-against-hochul-plan-for-illegal-immigrants 1
ALF Posted May 18, 2023 Posted May 18, 2023 NYS closed a lot of prisons , might be ok for adult males without family. I still think Texas should bus them to DC for Congress to do their job and figure out. 1
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted May 18, 2023 Posted May 18, 2023 On 5/16/2023 at 12:12 AM, Andy1 said: I’ve long thought that the porous border and broken immigration system is exactly what corporate America wants to ensure a ready supply of immigrant labor. The immigrants I’m talking about are not the highly educated or trained ones but those uneducated and struggling to escape the poverty in their former countries. These immigrants become the workers used (exploited) by industries needing manual labor across the country. Picking fruits and vegetables, cleaning hotels, stacking lumber, paving, roofing, construction, landscaping, washing dishes, cleaning factories and office buildings, butchering animals in slaughter house factories, working on pig farms, chicken farms, ranching, fishing etc. These industries are all using immigrants (legal and illegal) for cheap labor. They are doing the jobs most Americans won’t do. This is a means where corporations can keep costs low. We all vote with our wallets so by extension, we support it too. America wants and needs a large supply of immigrants so corporate America can provide us what we want at a price we will pay. It ain’t pretty but we need these people. If the powers really wanted to fix this problem, it would have been solved decades ago. meanwhile we also pay tens of millions of ‘citizens’ not to work at all. Doesn’t make much sense does it? 2 hours ago, ALF said: NYS closed a lot of prisons , might be ok for adult males without family. I still think Texas should bus them to DC for Congress to do their job and figure out. have been https://www.newsnationnow.com/us-news/immigration/washington-mayor-declares-state-of-emergency-to-aid-migrants/ 3 hours ago, SCBills said: imagine what it must be like in the boarder towns that have been ground zero for the influx. 1
cle23 Posted May 18, 2023 Posted May 18, 2023 On 5/15/2023 at 3:42 PM, B-Man said: The U.S. is giving court dates to migrants who crossed into the U.S. illegally but who say they are seeking asylum. Bill Melugin shared a document showing just how speedy of a process it’s going to be for many: #BidenBorderDisaster You can't apply for asylum unless you are in the United States already. Doesn't matter if they came across illegally, a vast majority of asylum seekers do as the wait otherwise is typically years. Defeats the purpose of seeking asylum. I am sure there are plenty of people coming just because as well, but the asylum seekers have to come illegally, they don't have a choice.
B-Man Posted May 18, 2023 Posted May 18, 2023 2 minutes ago, cle23 said: You can't apply for asylum unless you are in the United States already. Doesn't matter if they came across illegally, a vast majority of asylum seekers do as the wait otherwise is typically years. Defeats the purpose of seeking asylum. I am sure there are plenty of people coming just because as well, but the asylum seekers have to come illegally, they don't have a choice. Living in a poor country doesn't count. Wanting a "better life" doesn't count. File for Legal immigration" ! Asylum is a form of protection available to people already present in the U.S. who are afraid of returning to their home country because of actual persecution, or who have a well- founded fear of actual persecution because of their: Race; Religion; National origin; Membership in a particular social group; or, Political views. 1
cle23 Posted May 19, 2023 Posted May 19, 2023 20 hours ago, B-Man said: Living in a poor country doesn't count. Wanting a "better life" doesn't count. File for Legal immigration" ! Asylum is a form of protection available to people already present in the U.S. who are afraid of returning to their home country because of actual persecution, or who have a well- founded fear of actual persecution because of their: Race; Religion; National origin; Membership in a particular social group; or, Political views. They are fleeing the drug war. Just in Mexico, over 20,000 people, which is almost certainly a low estimate, were killed just last year from the drug war. And that is civilians, not just the drug cartel members. Obviously there has to be some overlap of people who were counted as civilians but were involved with the cartels and the other way around, but it's still a huge number. And that number has been pretty consistent for 15+ years now. Every year. Is that not enough for asylum?
Tommy Callahan Posted May 19, 2023 Posted May 19, 2023 https://www.unrefugees.org/refugee-facts/statistics/ are they fleeing from Maras? Despite its close proximity, only about 300-800 people from Mexico are granted asylum in the U.S. each year. https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/can-i-apply-asylum-from-mexico.html#:~:text=Despite its close proximity%2C only about 300-800 people,are granted asylum in the U.S. each year.
cle23 Posted May 19, 2023 Posted May 19, 2023 15 minutes ago, Chris farley said: https://www.unrefugees.org/refugee-facts/statistics/ are they fleeing from Maras? Despite its close proximity, only about 300-800 people from Mexico are granted asylum in the U.S. each year. https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/can-i-apply-asylum-from-mexico.html#:~:text=Despite its close proximity%2C only about 300-800 people,are granted asylum in the U.S. each year. Granted. Not applied for. And I used Mexico as the main example. Maras as you listed are essentially the cartels and gangs of other South American countries. In your own link, a pile of the countries listed with high asylum seekers are countries that the USA has had direct or indirect conflict with that has caused a majority of the issues there. I am definitely not an open borders kind of person. But I believe our system as set up is wrong as well. The "correct" channels to go through take years upon years. There is no perfect answer here, but just saying "no" isn't the answer either. 1 1
Tommy Callahan Posted May 19, 2023 Posted May 19, 2023 2 minutes ago, cle23 said: Granted. Not applied for. And I used Mexico as the main example. Maras as you listed are essentially the cartels and gangs of other South American countries. In your own link, a pile of the countries listed with high asylum seekers are countries that the USA has had direct or indirect conflict with that has caused a majority of the issues there. I am definitely not an open borders kind of person. But I believe our system as set up is wrong as well. The "correct" channels to go through take years upon years. There is no perfect answer here, but just saying "no" isn't the answer either. n your own link, a pile of the countries listed with high asylum seekers are countries that the USA has had direct or indirect conflict with that has caused a majority of the issues there. agree 100% Did you see the Chile election results? the young socialist failed so hard they actually elected the "Pinochet" party back into power. thats nuts. On the second part, agree as well. humans shouldn't be treated like farm tools. temp immigration/visa program is busted. the strange part right now is how almost all reporting on this topic just implies immigrant workers and asylum is the same thing.
cle23 Posted May 19, 2023 Posted May 19, 2023 3 minutes ago, Chris farley said: n your own link, a pile of the countries listed with high asylum seekers are countries that the USA has had direct or indirect conflict with that has caused a majority of the issues there. agree 100% Did you see the Chile election results? the young socialist failed so hard they actually elected the "Pinochet" party back into power. thats nuts. On the second part, agree as well. humans shouldn't be treated like farm tools. temp immigration/visa program is busted. the strange part right now is how almost all reporting on this topic just implies immigrant workers and asylum is the same thing. ' Yes, both sides of the media portray it how they want. One side says they are all asylum seekers, which isn't true. The other side says they are all coming in as an invasion and just illegally crossing. While technically right about it being illegally, they leave out that 99.9% of asylum seekers have to cross illegally because they can't apply for asylum otherwise. 1
Tommy Callahan Posted May 19, 2023 Posted May 19, 2023 (edited) 3 minutes ago, cle23 said: ' Yes, both sides of the media portray it how they want. One side says they are all asylum seekers, which isn't true. The other side says they are all coming in as an invasion and just illegally crossing. While technically right about it being illegally, they leave out that 99.9% of asylum seekers have to cross illegally because they can't apply for asylum otherwise. Our port of calls/entry no longer accepts asylum seekers. when did that start? Edited May 19, 2023 by Chris farley
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