Combating imaginary racism with actual racism??

[SoCal Deek]

13 hours ago, BillStime said:

Why are you afraid of your kids learning about our past?

 

Who would make them feel bad about it?
 

Only those who are guilty and uncomfortable with who they are?

 

YEP

 

Hell - we don’t have to go too far back in our history to see our racist roots. 
 

Hello January 6:

 

 

 

And the point of this ‘education’ about things that every American already knows is what exactly? Please explain what you’re hoping to get out of this colossal waste of valuable instructional time? 

[oldmanfan]

12 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

And the point of this ‘education’ about things that every American already knows is what exactly? Please explain what you’re hoping to get out of this colossal waste of valuable instructional time? 

But there are things that many Americans don't know about our history.  As you know one of my daughters is Asian by descent, and when I put out some stuff about the anti-Asian hate stuff going on to the parent forum for her college, I hade about a hundred responses from parents saying they never knew Asians suffered through a lot of what they suffered through.  For me personally, I had never heard about the Tulsa uprising against blacks until just a couple weeks ago.  

 

Unless we understand all of our history we may be doomed to repeat aspects of our history that should never be repeated.

 

 

[SoCal Deek]

7 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

But there are things that many Americans don't know about our history.  As you know one of my daughters is Asian by descent, and when I put out some stuff about the anti-Asian hate stuff going on to the parent forum for her college, I hade about a hundred responses from parents saying they never knew Asians suffered through a lot of what they suffered through.  For me personally, I had never heard about the Tulsa uprising against blacks until just a couple weeks ago.  

 

Unless we understand all of our history we may be doomed to repeat aspects of our history that should never be repeated.

 

 

Not so fast. If you open up the window of history a bit wider you’ll read stories of people of every race, color and creed treating other people terribly. Some are still going on today in different parts of the world. It’s part of the human condition and experience. This recent VERY selective outrage is just another example of pushing an agenda that has very little to do with race. 

[oldmanfan]

20 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

Not so fast. If you open up the window of history a bit wider you’ll read stories of people of every race, color and creed treating other people terribly. Some are still going on today in different parts of the world. It’s part of the human condition and experience. This recent VERY selective outrage is just another example of pushing an agenda that has very little to do with race. 

The whataboutism argument never flies.  My response is simple:  teach about ALL of the parts of history where people were treated horribly.  The more light that is shined on this crap the better the chance to make meaningful change.

 

And sorry, but recent events such as Asian Americans being beat up for no reason or George Floyd and such shine a light on specific groups whether you like it or not.  When someone starts picking on the Irish or Italians again then a light will shine on how those immigrants were poorly treated when they came to the country.

 

People in this country will be treated equally when all prejudice is eliminated.  An ideal that may never be reached but a good one to strive towards.

[SoCal Deek]

5 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

The whataboutism argument never flies.  My response is simple:  teach about ALL of the parts of history where people were treated horribly.  The more light that is shined on this crap the better the chance to make meaningful change.

 

And sorry, but recent events such as Asian Americans being beat up for no reason or George Floyd and such shine a light on specific groups whether you like it or not.  When someone starts picking on the Irish or Italians again then a light will shine on how those immigrants were poorly treated when they came to the country.

 

People in this country will be treated equally when all prejudice is eliminated.  An ideal that may never be reached but a good one to strive towards.

So once again we agree but knock it off with the childish whataboutism speak. Teach about ALL of it including what’s happening now all over the world. These issues are about the human condition. They aren’t about race...no matter how much you want to simplify it down to a single factor. Just look at the tribalism on this very board. Is it about race? Nope. It’s about politics, land, creed, power and money. It always has been and always will be. Teach about THAT and we’ll be getting somewhere...but if you think it’ll end it you’re a fool (no disrespect intended). It’s in our very nature as a species. 

Edited May 30, 2021 by SoCal Deek

[oldmanfan]

8 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

So once again we agree but knock it off with the childish whataboutism speak. Teach about ALL of it including what’s happening now all over the world. These issues are about the human condition. They aren’t about race...no matter how much you want to simplify it down to a single factor. Just look at the tribalism on this very board. Is it about race? Nope. It’s about politics, land, creed, power and money. It always has been and always will be. Teach about THAT and we’ll be getting somewhere...but if you think it’ll end it you’re a fool (no disrespect intended). It’s in our very nature as a species. 

Sorry you don’t like being challenged on the whataboutism, but that form of argument is used far too often around here in my opinion.  I do agree with the issue being larger and involving power and such.  But when it comes to race, the original stain of slavery will always make the issue of race different, because unfortunately there are some in our country who to this day see nothing wrong with that concept.  Sad but true.

 

You and I could have a lot of positive influence in this country when we take office in 2024.

[SCBills]

7 hours ago, gobills404 said:

Armed black nationalists openly calling for the genocide of white people in Tulsa today.

 

Simp white liberals watching this like...👏🏼 👏🏼 PREACH 👏🏼 👏🏼 

[Big Blitz]

Nope not at all communists:

 

 

 

[SCBills]

34 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

The whataboutism argument never flies.  My response is simple:  teach about ALL of the parts of history where people were treated horribly.  The more light that is shined on this crap the better the chance to make meaningful change.

 

And sorry, but recent events such as Asian Americans being beat up for no reason or George Floyd and such shine a light on specific groups whether you like it or not.  When someone starts picking on the Irish or Italians again then a light will shine on how those immigrants were poorly treated when they came to the country.

 

People in this country will be treated equally when all prejudice is eliminated.  An ideal that may never be reached but a good one to strive towards.

There is a way to teach about injustice without incorporating demonization, neoracism and retribution.   
 

Asian Americans aren’t exactly having a light shone on what they’re facing.  Unfortunately for them, the people who determine oppression publicity deem them to be “white adjacent”.   
 

Standardized testing, which they excel at, is being attacked as problematic.  
 

They are being discriminated against in higher education enrollment.  
 

The publicity towards the attacks on them became real quiet when we saw who is attacking them, and where.    Especially given many of the attackers are people who shouldn’t be on the streets, but for liberal policies like those of Chesa Boudin that release without bail. 

[oldmanfan]

13 minutes ago, Big Blitz said:

Nope not at all communists:

 

 

 

This is reprehensible.  Political extremism is going to destroy this country

12 minutes ago, SCBills said:

There is a way to teach about injustice without incorporating demonization, neoracism and retribution.   
 

Asian Americans aren’t exactly having a light shone on what they’re facing.  Unfortunately for them, the people who determine oppression publicity deem them to be “white adjacent”.   
 

Standardized testing, which they excel at, is being attacked as problematic.  
 

They are being discriminated against in higher education enrollment.  
 

The publicity towards the attacks on them became real quiet when we saw who is attacking them, and where.    Especially given many of the attackers are people who shouldn’t be on the streets, but for liberal policies like those of Chesa Boudin that release without bail. 

My daughter is Chinese by birth.  While some of what you say here is well reasoned, she would point a few things out to you based on your thoughts.  When you say “they” you are lumping all those of Asian heritage into the same category.  They are not; Chinese culture is much different than Japanese and such.  Not all those of Asian descent excel in standardized tests.  And so on.  
 

 

[SCBills]

14 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

This is reprehensible.  Political extremism is going to destroy this country

My daughter is Chinese by birth.  While some of what you say here is well reasoned, she would point a few things out to you based on your thoughts.  When you say “they” you are lumping all those of Asian heritage into the same category.  They are not; Chinese culture is much different than Japanese and such.  Not all those of Asian descent excel in standardized tests.  And so on.  
 

 

Agreed, and noted.  Appreciate the response. 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

8 hours ago, gobills404 said:

Armed black nationalists openly calling for the genocide of white people in Tulsa today.

 

Just calling for peaceful protesting... 🙄 

[BillStime]

 

[SoCal Deek]

55 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

Sorry you don’t like being challenged on the whataboutism, but that form of argument is used far too often around here in my opinion.  I do agree with the issue being larger and involving power and such.  But when it comes to race, the original stain of slavery will always make the issue of race different, because unfortunately there are some in our country who to this day see nothing wrong with that concept.  Sad but true.

 

You and I could have a lot of positive influence in this country when we take office in 2024.

I never back away from a good challenge but the recent focus on race relations is a purely political construct. If you can’t see that I’m not sure how to have this discussion. There are people who are pushing this narrative with other purposes at heart. While your daughter may be Asian, my daughter attended a high school whose student body was extremely diverse. Everyone got along incredibly well, including the students and parents. There was NONE of this garbage. I’m sorry if we disagree here but having lived it, I’m not buying it. You’re being manipulated.

[SCBills]

3 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

I never back away from a good challenge but the recent focus on race relations is a purely political construct. If you can’t see that I’m not sure how to have this discussion. There are people who are pushing this narrative with other purposes at heart. While your daughter may be Asian, my daughter attended a high school whose student body was extremely diverse. Everyone got along incredibly well, including the students and parents. There was NONE of this garbage. I’m sorry if we disagree here but having lived it, I’m not buying it. You’re being manipulated.

The hypersensitive focus on race will not end well.   It’s why the vast majority of the public is against Critical Race Theory and its teachings.  
 

We still have a ways to go, but the growth we’ve made as a nation in terms of race relations is largely due to the focus on seeing each other for who we are beyond skin color.  
 

Reverting back to a sole focus of everything being based on skin color is archaic and divisive.   
 

Most of us see it for that, which is why you see people of all ethnicities coming out against it.  
 

Im also convinced that many who support this type of teaching, don’t even know what it truly is, because when pressed to defend it... they can’t.  

[oldmanfan]

6 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

I never back away from a good challenge but the recent focus on race relations is a purely political construct. If you can’t see that I’m not sure how to have this discussion. There are people who are pushing this narrative with other purposes at heart. While your daughter may be Asian, my daughter attended a high school whose student body was extremely diverse. Everyone got along incredibly well, including the students and parents. There was NONE of this garbage. I’m sorry if we disagree here but having lived it, I’m not buying it. You’re being manipulated.

I think kids such as yours and mine give us hope that things will change.  I have given up on my generation.  And no, I am not being manipulated and I suspect you know that.

1 minute ago, SCBills said:

The hypersensitive focus on race will not end well.   It’s why the vast majority of the public is against Critical Race Theory and its teachings.  
 

We still have a ways to go, but the growth we’ve made as a nation in terms of race relations is largely due to the focus on seeing each other for who we are beyond skin color.  
 

Reverting back to a sole focus of everything being based on skin color is archaic and divisive.   
 

Most of us see it for that, which is why you see people of all ethnicities coming out against it.  
 

Im also convinced that many who support this type of teaching, don’t even know what it truly is, because when pressed to defend it... they can’t.  

There is a big controversy in my community right now because the school district hired a diversity, equity and inclusion coordinator.  People are up in arms about it being CRT, when the district has explicitly stated they are not and will not teach CRT.  I disagree with the concept of CRT but for the life of me cannot understand how promoting inclusion and acceptance of all regardless of defining characteristics such as skin color, economic status, gender identity and such can be thought of as negative.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

2016 snap shot. Someone please Explain how this demonstrates a racist country. This is murders. 

Edited May 30, 2021 by Over 29 years of fanhood

[SCBills]

11 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

I think kids such as yours and mine give us hope that things will change.  I have given up on my generation.  And no, I am not being manipulated and I suspect you know that.

There is a big controversy in my community right now because the school district hired a diversity, equity and inclusion coordinator.  People are up in arms about it being CRT, when the district has explicitly stated they are not and will not teach CRT.  I disagree with the concept of CRT but for the life of me cannot understand how promoting inclusion and acceptance of all regardless of defining characteristics such as skin color, economic status, gender identity and such can be thought of as negative.

Because that’s not what they teach.  
 

The left has branded things like anti-racism and Black Lives Matter as if “how on earth could anyone be against these things”, when the underlying teachings are bonkers different than the branded slogan.  
 

They know CRT is wildly unpopular and are now rebranding as other terms and phrases, but it’s all the same.   
 

Chris Rufo was on with Marc Lamont Hill and asked to define what he liked about being white.  He wouldn’t answer and instead pushed back on the ascribed positive characteristics given to white people.   Organizational skills, being on-time, etc.. 

 

In reading the responses on Marc Lamont Hill’s twitter account, half the people were mocking Rufo for saying those are White people characteristics.... until the other half responded with graphics and links of that being what’s taught in CRT/Anti-Racist teachings. 
 

Most don’t understand it.  I’d highly suggest reading up on it and not falling for the psy-op branding. 
 

Edited May 30, 2021 by SCBills

[BillStime]

 

 

[SoCal Deek]

55 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

I think kids such as yours and mine give us hope that things will change.  I have given up on my generation.  And no, I am not being manipulated and I suspect you know that.

There is a big controversy in my community right now because the school district hired a diversity, equity and inclusion coordinator.  People are up in arms about it being CRT, when the district has explicitly stated they are not and will not teach CRT.  I disagree with the concept of CRT but for the life of me cannot understand how promoting inclusion and acceptance of all regardless of defining characteristics such as skin color, economic status, gender identity and such can be thought of as negative.

Unfortunately you are being manipulated...and you clearly don’t see it. This country is less racist than at any time in its history. Not sure where you live but here in Southern California it looks like the United Nations, almost everywhere you go. This sudden focus on varying races is nothing more than political messaging hoping to isolate the Right as anti-everyone so the Left can say ‘join up with us’ and we’ll protect you and avenge you...all in the effort to attain and keep power. It’s utterly shocking that you don’t see that. I don’t expect more of the race batters like Billstime, Tibs and others but I’ve come to expect more of you.