Henry shot himself in the foot

[EC-Bills]

I do agree, and I'm certain that TD knows that better than me. But he won't have to cut him for a very long time. My understanding is that he simply will cost us $1.25M in this year's cap, which is chump change...relatively speaking. Meanwhile, TD is given the one thing he needs to unload Henry: Time. Because in due time, any number of things can happen.

 

(1) A RB can get hurt in the preseason, and TH can be had cheaply.

 

(2) He can still be traded for a pick for next year.

The same, by the way, could be said about Shelton. He offers a significant cap hit to the Cardinals, and likely will be cut June 1. Assuming that happens, how great to have picked up Shelton, and still be sitting on Henry?

 

Time and options is all TD can ask for. Believe me, if a year goes by and he can't get anything of value for Henry, not a Bills fan will really care because they'll have a whole new list of things to B word about.

318331[/snapback]

 

I agree on everything except the Shelton pickup. I don't see how he would be an upgrade over what we already have.

[IDBillzFan]

I agree on everything except the Shelton pickup.  I don't see how he would be an upgrade over what we already have.

318345[/snapback]

I don't know whether he'd be an upgrade or not because I don't know how to really evaluate lineman talent like many here. But if he's cut and we pick him up, he'd probably be worth good depth, if nothing else. And let's face it...we need depth.

 

Granted, you couldn't do that if it were a trade. It's been pointed out here that at $3M+, he'd be a starter. But picked up on June 1? You won't be paying him starter money, that's for certain.

[GG]

I agree on everything except the Shelton pickup.  I don't see how he would be an upgrade over what we already have.

318345[/snapback]

 

And that's the main point that the cacophony, insisting on this trade, is missing.

 

Bills looked at Shelton, and didn't like what they saw. Granted he looked good on paper, and handled the RT spot well for Cards, but Bills did not see him as a sure fire bet at LT. Thus, if a trade happened, Bills would give up Henry & take on a $3mil obligation to a backup. The only way to get out of that $3mil is by cutting Shelton in preseason, meaning that Henry was dealt for nothing. This is the main reason that TD insisted on swapping picks, because he wanted to move up in Rd. 2 and get the kicker.

 

The question to be answered, can TD still get a pick in next year's draft, and will you get a better player with a 4th - 5th round pick in '06 than you would with a 4th round pick in '05?

 

By not panicking, TD still kept most of his options, because no trade offer beat his downside option of holding on to Travis.

[jarthur31]

I like Travis Henry and have always respected his toughness and tenacity, especially after suffering a  broken leg in 2003 and still having multiple 100 yard games.

 

I give hime credit for correcting his fumbling problems. Unfortunately, the that's one reputation that's hard to shake, even if the problem is minimized. Henry has had some great games and let's not forget a few awesome stiff-arms.

 

Henry IS a good back. The idea of giving him away for anything less than a 2nd round draft choice or other comparable NFL talent is unthinkable.

 

BUT...Henry may have shot himself in the foot with all of his pouting and whining.

If Henry had simply been a standup guy, kept a smile on his face, supported the team's decision to stick with McGahee, stated in the press that he would do whatever it took to help the Buffalo Bills, etc...he might have gotten the trade and interest he was hoping for.

 

Now, along with his fumbling reputation, he'll have the reputation of malcontent as well. There may be some team out there who was willing to make a mutually acceptable trade with Donahoe, but if they couldn't guarantee a starting role, they would have only inherited the same situation of having an unhappy reserve pouting player infecting the sidelines.

 

Henry should have just kept his mouth shut.

I mean, what the hell is his big gripe anyway? He's not "playing" as much as he'd like. Gee....we should all have such worries. At some point a few years ago, he took someone else's job in order to become a starter. Now the shoe's on the other foot. Waaaaaaaaaahh!!!! Get over it. That's life in the NFL. Even if he never plays another down, he's already had more glory than any of us could ever dream of.

 

Grow up Travis.

318129[/snapback]

 

 

I don't think it's all Travis. He should fire that stupid agent of his! Maybe then the NFL will think he has made amends. Clearly, he's been getting some very bad advice lately.

[IDBillzFan]

I don't think it's all Travis.  He should fire that stupid agent of his!  Maybe then the NFL will think he has made amends.  Clearly, he's been getting some very bad advice lately.

318418[/snapback]

I agree, but remember: getting advice and taking advice are two different things. With our luck, Henry will fire is agent and hire Rosenhaus.

[jarthur31]

[EC-Bills]

I agree, but remember: getting advice and taking advice are two different things. With our luck, Henry will fire is agent and hire Rosenhaus.

318432[/snapback]

 

Actually I think that would be a good move for Travis. Drew has a good rep with a lot of the GM's in the league. It might actually improve Travis' chance of getting traded.

[Kelly the Dog]

I agree, but remember: getting advice and taking advice are two different things. With our luck, Henry will fire is agent and hire Rosenhaus.

318432[/snapback]

How funny would it be if Rosenhaus turned him down because he thought Travis was too much of a jerk.

[EC-Bills]

I don't know whether he'd be an upgrade or not because I don't know how to really evaluate lineman talent like many here. But if he's cut and we pick him up, he'd probably be worth good depth, if nothing else. And let's face it...we need depth.

 

Granted, you couldn't do that if it were a trade. It's been pointed out here that at $3M+, he'd be a starter. But picked up on June 1? You won't be paying him starter money, that's for certain.

318364[/snapback]

 

True, depth is always good/needed. Just not sure he would be the player for us though. But we'll see

[Bill from NYC]

I do agree, and I'm certain that TD knows that better than me. But he won't have to cut him for a very long time. My understanding is that he simply will cost us $1.25M in this year's cap, which is chump change...relatively speaking. Meanwhile, TD is given the one thing he needs to unload Henry: Time. Because in due time, any number of things can happen.

 

(1) A RB can get hurt in the preseason, and TH can be had cheaply.

 

(2) He can still be traded for a pick for next year.

The same, by the way, could be said about Shelton. He offers a significant cap hit to the Cardinals, and likely will be cut June 1. Assuming that happens, how great to have picked up Shelton, and still be sitting on Henry?

 

Time and options is all TD can ask for. Believe me, if a year goes by and he can't get anything of value for Henry, not a Bills fan will really care because they'll have a whole new list of things to B word about.

318331[/snapback]

 

It depends on what you mean by "a very long time." He is only under contract for 1 more year. How much more time do you think remains to rid the team of this miscreant and get something in return?

 

In a way, we are in a similar situation with Clements, the difference being that Nate is a very good football player and DOES have value.

You think that people are bitching now? What happens if TD loses TH AND NC and gets zero in return? Would you think that this is OK and continue to defend him?

[EC-Bills]

It depends on what you mean by "a very long time." He is only under contract for 1 more year. How much more time do you think remains to rid the team of this miscreant and get something in return?

 

In a way, we are in a similar situation with Clements, the difference being that Nate is a very good football player and DOES have value.

You think that people are bitching now? What happens if TD loses TH AND NC and gets zero in return? Would you think that this is OK and continue to defend him?

318568[/snapback]

 

Maybe I am splitting hairs, but can you define what you mean buy getting zero in return? Depending how you look at value or ROI, I could make an argument that we have gotten exceptional value/ROI from NC and his current contract. Same with TH. While it definitely would be nice to get something in return (ie draft picks, players), I realize that's not always possible. Maybe I am being too pragmatic at the moment...

[Bill from NYC]

Maybe I am splitting hairs, but can you define what you mean buy getting zero in return?  Depending how you look at value or ROI, I could make an argument that we have gotten exceptional value/ROI from NC and his current contract.  Same with TH.  While it definitely would be nice to get something in return (ie draft picks, players), I realize that's not always possible.  Maybe I am being too pragmatic at the moment...

318673[/snapback]

 

No, your question is quite valid.

I agree that NC has given us more than our moneys worth. Wrt to Travis, I feel that he has been a liability and a loser.

That said, they are still under contract. In essence, we own their rights. I would have liked to have seen the Bills salvage anything for Travis.

Nate is a different story. He is worth a great deal. Imo, it comes down to whether or not Mr. Wilson will give him 55 million or so with a 20 million dollar bonus. Do you think that RW will cough up this kind of cash for a corner?

I do not, and I would rather get something in return for him than lose him to free agency and get nothing whatsoever. That, or sign him now, if in fact he would be willing.

[IDBillzFan]

It depends on what you mean by "a very long time." He is only under contract for 1 more year. How much more time do you think remains to rid the team of this miscreant and get something in return?

 

In a way, we are in a similar situation with Clements, the difference being that Nate is a very good football player and DOES have value.

You think that people are bitching now? What happens if TD loses TH AND NC and gets zero in return? Would you think that this is OK and continue to defend him?

318568[/snapback]

You're confusing me with someone who spends all day defending TD. Let me repeat: I am not defending TD as a whole but rather his handling of the TH situation. And for what it's worth, outside of the fact that they each have a year left on their contracts, there is virtually NO similiarities between Nate and Travis. None.

 

- Nate didn't say he felt we slapped him the face when we drafted Eric King.

 

- Nate didn't say he will absolutely NOT being playing for the Bills this year.

 

- Nate does not trip over his own shadow or have a terrible time picking up a blitz.

 

- Nate doesn't have the mental capacity of a mop.

 

Look...you don't like TH and you don't like TD. I get it. But your argument here is a terrible, terrible stretch. If and when the time comes to deal with Nate Clements, should TD get nothing for him, then I would think he should be schittcanned. But he has yet to get nothing for anyone of value so I'm not quite sure where you're getting this creativity.

[Bill from NYC]

You're confusing me with someone who spends all day defending TD. Let me repeat: I am not defending TD as a whole but rather his handling of the TH situation. And for what it's worth, outside of the fact that they each have a year left on their contracts, there is virtually NO similiarities between Nate and Travis. None.

 

- Nate didn't say he felt we slapped him the face when we drafted Eric King.

 

- Nate didn't say he will absolutely NOT being playing for the Bills this year.

 

- Nate does not trip over his own shadow or have a terrible time picking up a blitz.

 

- Nate doesn't have the mental capacity of a mop.

 

Look...you don't like TH and you don't like TD. I get it. But your argument here is a terrible, terrible stretch. If and when the time comes to deal with Nate Clements, should TD get nothing for him, then I would think he should be schittcanned. But he has yet to get nothing for anyone of value so I'm not quite sure where you're getting this creativity.

318685[/snapback]

 

Just one correction.....if you read my posts, I like and respect TD.

[Kelly the Dog]

Where does this we need to get something for them come from? Did the Bengals get anything when we signed TKO? Did the raiders get anything when we signed Sam Adams? Did the Eagles get anything when we signed Troy Vincent? Did the Patsies get anything when we signed Lawyer Milloy? TD happened to make one move, one time, that few other GMs can do or even try to do, and now all of a sudden we need to get something for these players. Frankly, I would rather have Nate Clements for one guaranteed year than a high #1 pick for the simple fact that I know he is going to play at a high level and the rookie is likely going to have a learning curve (we certainly had one with Nate) and then with the 20-30 million I'm going to have to pay for a 50-50 shot top draft pick, I can sign one of the top free agents who has already proven himself in this league.

[EC-Bills]

No, your question is quite valid.

I agree that NC has given us more than our moneys worth. Wrt to Travis, I feel that he has been a liability and a loser.

That said, they are still under contract. In essence, we own their rights. I would have liked to have seen the Bills salvage anything for Travis.

Nate is a different story. He is worth a great deal. Imo, it comes down to whether or not Mr. Wilson will give him 55 million or so with a 20 million dollar bonus. Do you think that RW will cough up this kind of cash for a corner?

I do not, and I would rather get something in return for him than lose him to free agency and get nothing whatsoever. That, or sign him now, if in fact he would be willing.

318684[/snapback]

 

I agree NC is worth a lot. That being said, no I don't see RW paying NC a huge contract. Nor would I want him too. Nothing against Nate, but I don't believe in tying up a good portion of our cap to one player. Just my opinion.

[JoeF]

Where does this we need to get something for them come from? Did the Bengals get anything when we signed TKO? Did the raiders get anything when we signed Sam Adams? Did the Eagles get anything when we signed Troy Vincent? Did the Patsies get anything when we signed Lawyer Milloy? TD happened to make one move, one time, that few other GMs can do or even try to do, and now all of a sudden we need to get something for these players. Frankly, I would rather have Nate Clements for one guaranteed year than a high #1 pick for the simple fact that I know he is going to play at a high level and the rookie is likely going to have a learning curve (we certainly had one with Nate) and then with the 20-30 million I'm going to have to pay for a 50-50 shot top draft pick, I can sign one of the top free agents who has already proven himself in this league.

318700[/snapback]

 

Agree with this Kelly. The fact is we do get something if/when we lose Nate after this coming season. We will get compensatory picks the next draft (Nate could be worth a 3rd rounder) if we don't sign an equal value replacement(s) and we get flexibility on cap space to sign not just one core veteran player but probably two or three.

 

I am a big proponent of balancing the cap...having a "cap budget" for each position and sticking to that. When a guy like Nate comes around, you may have to sacrifice him sometimes to make sure you balance positions like LB, WR, OL, QB...

 

The Bills are in really good shape from this perspective right now. We are a little heavy on OL with Teague, Chris V and Mike Williams all pretty good sized hits--but Bennie Anderson was mid-tier and the rest are pretty much vet minimum guys.

 

At QB--we are probably a bit below average cap hit with JP at the lower end of starter pay but Holcombe at the upper end of back-up pay and Matthews at vet minimum...

 

TD and Jim Overdorf have done a good job creating balance on this roster...we have the flexibility to replace parts as we need them. The Winfield for Vincent swap is an example...we traded down in cap hit--but didn't appreciably hurt the D and lo and behold a 2nd year guy developed and stepped up--I know that's a shocker to some folks who post who believe young players can't improve and we have to sign a vet to fill every role.

 

This year there are virtually no LT's in the draft or FA..which is why Jonas got what he did..so we upgraded the interior of the line (Anderson is a substantial upgrade at LG) and will sacrifice a bit on the edge--at DT we need Edwards or Anderson to step up -- Pat W. only played 58% of the snaps last year--one of those guys needs to take that majority role and the other the 42% role....we'll see how it works out--but we stay in balance....

 

This team is coming together nicely...we added two potential breathtaking playmakers this weekend at positions where we needed to add them. We have a RB who is just rounding into 100% shape.. and we continue to add depth to an OL that sorely needed some coaching...add to this the fact that we have totally remade the QB position which means it could evolve from caretaker to difference maker and that we have 10/11 returning starters on D and virtually the same special teams core as a year ago...how can you not be a bit optimistic about where we are....I just don't get it....