Bferra13 Posted March 8, 2021 Posted March 8, 2021 23 minutes ago, st pete gogolak said: I started a topic a week ago posing a hypothetical trade between Houston and JAX (Watson straight up for Lawrence). (I know, I know, it's not going to happen. Teams aren't going to trade within the division). I got a lot of grief from folks saying "how can you trade Lawrence; he's going to be generational!" But look at this list. Ten best ranked QB's coming out of college and still a 20% bust rate. If Houston did propose the trade, JAX would be crazy not to jump on it. You also need to think about the money. Personally, I'm unsold on Sunny, but if he is what everyone says he is, that's invaluable. Getting a stud qb on a rook contract for 4 years. Watson already on his second. Think about the guy making the moves.. the gm... he now drafts a big tim qb. He has years to build the team around him. Trade for Watson... yep, ya better win now or you're fired. Gotta think about that aspect.
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted March 8, 2021 Posted March 8, 2021 Clearly likes the prototype size and cannon arms.
ganesh Posted March 8, 2021 Posted March 8, 2021 12 hours ago, Boxcar said: For all his foibles, I'll always appreciate that Mel Kiper was a Josh Allen Guy before almost anyone else. One of Mel's arguments in favor of Josh is that his (Allen's) stats in college are skewed (especially the completion percentage). He mentioned that (on the draft day when Allen was picked) Allen's completion % is lower because he was asked to throw less than 25 time. For rhythm passers, the 25 number is not sufficient., He says that if Allen had an opportunity to throw 30+ times in a real offense, his % would have automtaically increased with the extra check downs to RB/TEs and to slot receivers
machine gun kelly Posted March 8, 2021 Posted March 8, 2021 6 hours ago, Rubes said: A little weird that Marino didn't make the list, but I have no sense of his college career. Marino like Sapp (dude is such a tool) dropped due to the wacky tabaccy. Even more than Kelly, Marino is the best QB I’ve ever seen. I loved Manning, but that release of Marino was something I’ve never seen. Him singlehandedly winning over the 85 Bears was incredible. 1
Buffalo716 Posted March 8, 2021 Posted March 8, 2021 22 minutes ago, ganesh said: One of Mel's arguments in favor of Josh is that his (Allen's) stats in college are skewed (especially the completion percentage). He mentioned that (on the draft day when Allen was picked) Allen's completion % is lower because he was asked to throw less than 25 time. For rhythm passers, the 25 number is not sufficient., He says that if Allen had an opportunity to throw 30+ times in a real offense, his % would have automtaically increased with the extra check downs to RB/TEs and to slot receivers Yeah when you don't throw a lot every incomplete pass has more effect on your completion percentage If Allen had one more completion a game over his 11 game season, AKA 11 more completions... his last year at Wyoming he would have been over 60%
machine gun kelly Posted March 8, 2021 Posted March 8, 2021 I loved Kiper’s interview on Josh stating the number of players at Wyoming were drafted, and the lack of volume of throws. Kipper stated this before and after the draft. He was spot on with his evaluation. 1
Freddie's Dead Posted March 8, 2021 Posted March 8, 2021 Amazing that people were actually debating Peyton Manning vs. Cryan' Leaf.
Alphadawg7 Posted March 8, 2021 Posted March 8, 2021 20 hours ago, Coach Tuesday said: Fun to wonder about what Andre Ware could do in the modern NFL. Dude I was just going to say the same thing. I will never understand why he didn’t get more of a chance either. I always said I feel like his career might have gone different had he not been drafted by the Lions and he was grossly mismanaged and never really given much chance to succeed or even play. 15 hours ago, Charles Romes said: they did also get to draft Jeff George #1 overall who was considered near generational - he would make many top 10 lists in terms of rating coming out. Honestly Jeff George was probably one of the 10 most talented QBs to ever play the game. He just had the personality, likability, and mental game of Jay Cutler. If he was less of a douche he would have probably had a HOF career. 1 1
chongli Posted March 8, 2021 Posted March 8, 2021 (edited) 23 hours ago, The Jokeman said: and the Bills drafted Tony Hunter before Kelly. Good point. The only thing I can say in Buffalo's defense is they had picks 12 and 14. They planned to take Jimbo at 14 and knew Detroit at 13 was all set at QB, with Eric Hipple leading them to the NFC North crown the previous year (although, technically, there were no divisions that strike-shortened season, only two conferences). I suppose Detroit could have traded with a team who needed a QB though, like New England, who took Tony Eason at 15. It was a risky move by the Bills, although they still had franchise QB Joe Ferguson. Edited March 8, 2021 by chongli
Kelly the Dog Posted March 8, 2021 Posted March 8, 2021 1 hour ago, chongli said: Good point. The only thing I can say in Buffalo's defense is they had picks 12 and 14. They planned to take Jimbo at 14 and knew Detroit at 13 was all set at QB, with Eric Hipple leading them to the NFC North crown the previous year. I suppose Detroit could have traded with a team who needed a QB though, like New England, who took Tony Eason at 15. It was a risky move by the Bills, although they still had franchise QB Joe Ferguson. The Bills also had Kelly and Marino rated even. If one of them was gone they would have been just as happy with the other. But it wasn't like they thought Hunter was better. They wanted both Hunter and a QB so they took Hunter first. 1
chongli Posted March 8, 2021 Posted March 8, 2021 33 minutes ago, Kelly the Dog said: The Bills also had Kelly and Marino rated even. If one of them was gone they would have been just as happy with the other. But it wasn't like they thought Hunter was better. They wanted both Hunter and a QB so they took Hunter first. I did not know that. Great info you posted.
DrDawkinstein Posted March 8, 2021 Posted March 8, 2021 (edited) On 3/7/2021 at 3:48 PM, The Jokeman said: and the Bills drafted Tony Hunter before Kelly. Only because both Kelly and Marino were still available, and our next pick was only 2 picks away, so we were guaranteed one of them. Crazy to think about if KC drafted Kelly, which would have forced us to pick Marino with our first pick. Which then opens up a whole new history and timeline. How many Super Bowls does Marino lead us to? How many does he win? etc etc 37 minutes ago, chongli said: I did not know that. Great info you posted. Good info about it in the 30 For 30: Elway to Marino. They go through every pick of the 83 draft, with a focus on every QB pick. Lots of good behind the scenes stuff. Edited March 8, 2021 by DrDawkinstein 2
The Jokeman Posted March 8, 2021 Posted March 8, 2021 1 minute ago, DrDawkinstein said: Only because both Kelly and Marino were still available, and our next pick was only 2 picks away, so we were guaranteed one of them. Crazy to think about if KC drafted Kelly, which would have forced us to pick Marino with our first pick. Which then opens up a whole new history and timeline. How many Super Bowls does Marino lead us to? How many does he win? etc etc Yep I think we benefitted getting Kelly because him going off the USFL allowed us to be worse and then add guys like Bruce and Andre and Reich etc in later drafts. Yet to me Marino was a better QB then Jim by quite a bit. Yet Elway will be the best of that class. 4
Bubba Gump Posted March 8, 2021 Posted March 8, 2021 Todd Marinovich and Jamarcuss Russell were both sposed to take the league over. These guys miss on their rankings more than they hit on them. 1
NoHuddleKelly12 Posted March 8, 2021 Posted March 8, 2021 37 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said: Only because both Kelly and Marino were still available, and our next pick was only 2 picks away, so we were guaranteed one of them. Crazy to think about if KC drafted Kelly, which would have forced us to pick Marino with our first pick. Which then opens up a whole new history and timeline. How many Super Bowls does Marino lead us to? How many does he win? etc etc Good info about it in the 30 For 30: Elway to Marino. They go through every pick of the 83 draft, with a focus on every QB pick. Lots of good behind the scenes stuff. 3 less than Kelly, and none. I do get your point though, and pound for pound we did have stronger rosters than the 'Phins in those years, but they certainly weren't exactly slouches either. Miami was always a consistent playoff team coached by a legendary HOFer, so it's not like he was never put in a position to win, imho.
BillsCuse Posted March 8, 2021 Posted March 8, 2021 On 3/7/2021 at 3:48 PM, The Jokeman said: and the Bills drafted Tony Hunter before Kelly. They did that intentionally, knew the team in between their 2 picks didn't need a QB, so made sure they got Hunter 1st
DrDawkinstein Posted March 8, 2021 Posted March 8, 2021 38 minutes ago, Bubba Gump said: Todd Marinovich and Jamarcuss Russell were both sposed to take the league over. These guys miss on their rankings more than they hit on them. Neither of which were or are on Kiper's list. 9 minutes ago, NoHuddleKelly12 said: 3 less than Kelly, and none. I do get your point though, and pound for pound we did have stronger rosters than the 'Phins in those years, but they certainly weren't exactly slouches either. Miami was always a consistent playoff team coached by a legendary HOFer, so it's not like he was never put in a position to win, imho. I dunno. It was a good point that not having a QB between 83-86 did help us build out the roster. We almost certainly dont get the #1 pick and Bruce with Marino playing QB. But... Marino never had help from the run game like Kelly did, and I'm not sure Marino parties like Kelly the week before which lead to some subpar SB performances.
eball Posted March 8, 2021 Posted March 8, 2021 On 3/7/2021 at 12:29 PM, Coach Tuesday said: Fun to wonder about what Andre Ware could do in the modern NFL. You and I have different definitions of the word “fun.”
Rico Posted March 8, 2021 Posted March 8, 2021 Drew Bledsoe in the modern NFL would be fun, good for lots of laughs.
Charles Romes Posted March 8, 2021 Posted March 8, 2021 9 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said: Dude I was just going to say the same thing. I will never understand why he didn’t get more of a chance either. I always said I feel like his career might have gone different had he not been drafted by the Lions and he was grossly mismanaged and never really given much chance to succeed or even play. Honestly Jeff George was probably one of the 10 most talented QBs to ever play the game. He just had the personality, likability, and mental game of Jay Cutler. If he was less of a douche he would have probably had a HOF career. Yes with all the Jeff George hype and the arm that spoke for itself I thought it was just a matter of time the colts would take over the division in the mid 90s 1
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