HardyBoy Posted March 3, 2021 Posted March 3, 2021 Will watch the video later, but Lawrence's pocket awareness concerned me a lot in the national championship game. 1 1
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted March 3, 2021 Posted March 3, 2021 2 hours ago, costrovs said: Chris Simms Has Zach Wilson Ahead Of Trevor Lawrence? Are you asking a question or making a statement? it’s a rhetorical question to express disbelief. a lovely tool in the literary tool box.
mannc Posted March 3, 2021 Posted March 3, 2021 18 minutes ago, HardyBoy said: Will watch the video later, but Lawrence's pocket awareness concerned me a lot in the national championship game. I think he’s far from a risk-free pick. 2
DCOrange Posted March 3, 2021 Posted March 3, 2021 (edited) It's draft season. I for one am thoroughly enjoying all the Wilson > Lawrence and Fields > Lawrence takes lately. I saw a few people over the past few days say that they've charted all of the prospects passes and determined that Fields is the most accurate passer in the class, with one of them saying Fields is the best prospect he's scouted since at least the Andrew Luck draft if not further back than that. Edited March 3, 2021 by DCOrange 1
costrovs Posted March 3, 2021 Posted March 3, 2021 3 hours ago, H2o said: It's question asked in more like a "wtf" manner. Ok. So you're asking everybody on this forum if Chris Simms has Zach Wilson ahead of Trevor Lawrence. Well if you look at the link you posted, then you'd already know the answer to it. Also, You'd want to start the sentence with "Does" We use do/does or is/are as question words when we want to ask yes/no questions. If you're letting everyone know that Chris Simms has Zach Wilson ahead of Trevor Lawrence, then you don't need a question mark. because you're making a statement. 1 hour ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said: it’s a rhetorical question to express disbelief. a lovely tool in the literary tool box. Look up. 3 pages and 4 hours into your post, I'll go ahead and answer your "question". Yes, it appears that Chris Simms has Zach Wilson ahead of Trevor Lawrence. Here's a link that answers your question. https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2021/03/03/zach-wilson-over-trevor-lawrence-chris-simms-says-yes/ 2 1
Hebert19 Posted March 3, 2021 Posted March 3, 2021 I agree with him 100 percent. Lawrence will not be the pro most think. Imo
CincyBillsFan Posted March 4, 2021 Posted March 4, 2021 Funny this topic came up. Driving around town today and listening to the NFL station on Sirius radio the guys doing the show were BOTH saying that after studying Zack Wilson film over the last week they were willing to put him ahead of Lawrence! I'm not ready to go there as it seems like sacrilege to question TL. But I'm seeing more of the so called "experts" saying that Wilson is a lot closer to Lawrence then people think. It would explain why all of a sudden the Jets GM says he'll answer the phone if someone calls about acquiring Darnold. And in the same announcement he praises Darnold through the roof. If the Jets have come to the conclusion that Wilson is an outstanding, elite prospect then it makes more sense to take him in the draft then give up all those picks for Watson or try to get Darnold to work out. 2 hours ago, HardyBoy said: Will watch the video later, but Lawrence's pocket awareness concerned me a lot in the national championship game. In the last two national championship games.
mannc Posted March 4, 2021 Posted March 4, 2021 11 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said: Funny this topic came up. Driving around town today and listening to the NFL station on Sirius radio the guys doing the show were BOTH saying that after studying Zack Wilson film over the last week they were willing to put him ahead of Lawrence! I'm not ready to go there as it seems like sacrilege to question TL. But I'm seeing more of the so called "experts" saying that Wilson is a lot closer to Lawrence then people think. It would explain why all of a sudden the Jets GM says he'll answer the phone if someone calls about acquiring Darnold. And in the same announcement he praises Darnold through the roof. If the Jets have come to the conclusion that Wilson is an outstanding, elite prospect then it makes more sense to take him in the draft then give up all those picks for Watson or try to get Darnold to work out. In the last two national championship games. Excellent point. If the Jets and other teams view Wilson and Lawrence as 1 and 1a, or vice versa, then Jets would be much less likely to enter the D Watson sweepstakes.
ghostwriter Posted March 4, 2021 Posted March 4, 2021 We fall into these traps mentally where we think that cause a player is the #1 prospect he must be better than somebody taken 40th or 50th overall, but history shows, that’s clearly not the case. Surely your higher rated players will typically bear more fruit, but look at Josh, both Mayfield and Darnold were taken before him. If you like a guy that is 10-15 spots lower on McShay’s, Kiper’s or Jeremiah’s big board, take him! To hell with it! I feel this way about Carlos “Boogie” Basham Jr.... He is the 50th overall prospect on most folks big boards, I want him at 30! To hell with these arbitrary numbers and rankings, get your damn guy! 3
dave mcbride Posted March 4, 2021 Posted March 4, 2021 (edited) 6 hours ago, GunnerBill said: Fields 2020 season if extrapolated over 14 games was more than okay. Fields >>> Fromm and it isn't close. I think Fields is fool's gold. Heaving it up vs. bad Clemson DBs who were regularly beaten like a drum deep is not a sign that a qb is good. Matt Barkley is excellent at the deep air ball too as long as the receiver beats his man. Fields is inaccurate and runs a super-simplified scheme. 5 hours ago, Mr. WEO said: He has come up a little small the past two end-of-season playoff games. Hard to say. So did Payton Manning in college. It's not always the QB's fault. In the LSU game, Clemson faced a once-in-a-lifetime offensive-talent juggernaut. And on the other side, Lawrence needed to put up 50 just to have a chance in a game against a defense in which 9-10 starters were going to end up as NFL draft picks. Edited March 4, 2021 by dave mcbride 1 1
Mr. WEO Posted March 4, 2021 Posted March 4, 2021 (edited) 37 minutes ago, dave mcbride said: I think Fields is fool's gold. Heaving it up vs. bad Clemson DBs who were regularly beaten like a drum deep is not a sign that a qb is good. Matt Barkley is excellent at the deep air ball too as long as the receiver beats his man. Fields is inaccurate and runs a super-simplified scheme. So did Payton Manning in college. It's not always the QB's fault. In the LSU game, Clemson faced a once-in-a-lifetime offensive-talent juggernaut. And on the other side, Lawrence needed to put up 50 just to have a chance in a game against a defense in which 9-10 starters were going to end up as NFL draft picks. In the 2 close out games of those seasons, he threw a total of 2 TD passes (zero vs LSU, completing 49% of his passes) Edited March 4, 2021 by Mr. WEO
Andy1 Posted March 4, 2021 Posted March 4, 2021 I hope Wilson doesn’t end up on the Jets. He looks a lot like a Mahomes type QB. 1 1
GunnerBill Posted March 4, 2021 Posted March 4, 2021 4 hours ago, dave mcbride said: I think Fields is fool's gold. Heaving it up vs. bad Clemson DBs who were regularly beaten like a drum deep is not a sign that a qb is good. Matt Barkley is excellent at the deep air ball too as long as the receiver beats his man. Fields is inaccurate and runs a super-simplified scheme. Indeed but he didn't only play well vs Clemson. I do agree about the super simplified scheme and that is why I think for him to succeed early he needs to be in an offense that simplifies his reads. Reading the field and processing quickly are weaknesses I feel.
MJS Posted March 4, 2021 Posted March 4, 2021 4 hours ago, Andy1 said: I hope Wilson doesn’t end up on the Jets. He looks a lot like a Mahomes type QB. I hope he doesn't end up on the Jets because I actually like him and want him to succeed. Either he will be good, and therefore make it tougher for the Bills, or (more likely) the Jets will ruin him and he will be a backup or out of the league in a few short years. Both bad outcomes.
GunnerBill Posted March 4, 2021 Posted March 4, 2021 44 minutes ago, MJS said: I hope he doesn't end up on the Jets because I actually like him and want him to succeed. Either he will be good, and therefore make it tougher for the Bills, or (more likely) the Jets will ruin him and he will be a backup or out of the league in a few short years. Both bad outcomes. While I like Wilson too, I'm not convinced I love the fit with the offense the Jets are going to run. They brought Mike LaFleur in to run the Shanahan WCO off the stretch zone concept with lots of boots and roll outs. I like Wilson better in a spread the field, heavy shotgun offense where he can read the whole field and get the ball out of his hands. He is a gamer he has a bit of that gunslinger mentality in him and those guys don't tend to be great fits in that Shanny style. To me the absolute ideal fit for Wilson is Carolina with Joe Brady. I think he'd be perfect there. He won't last to #8 and the Panthers may well not own that pick anyway by draft time..... but that is the ideal fit IMO. To me, if I am running the stretch zone I prefer Fields, if I am running a spread concept offense I prefer Wilson. 1
ProcessTruster Posted March 4, 2021 Posted March 4, 2021 12 hours ago, mannc said: That is the last thing Chris Simms is trying to do. He's got a great record when it comes to evaluating college QBs. yeah, Simms is a straight shooter; doesn't really seem to be one of those to say things to just stir up views and clicks. I've never seen Wilson play so there's that, so there will be a bias towards Lawrence bc of his exposure, but Josh had no exposure and he turned out better than all in his draft class.
machine gun kelly Posted March 4, 2021 Posted March 4, 2021 13 hours ago, RobbRiddick said: I love this time of year. Even though I don't watch college ball I love hearing all the talking heads giving their opinions on different guys. I also love looking back on drafts a few years later, seeing how guys have changed. Before the divisional round this year I saw some clips of Josh and Baker at the combine and it was funny seeing how young they looked despite it only being a few years. It must be weird to be a college player who knows he's going in the first round, wondering where he'll go and how that might effect his career. Sorry, what was the question again? I watch some college ball, but not to the level of acting like a prognosticator of future success. I do agree with Simms to stop fantasizing about a chance to get Wilson or Watson. I’m at the point of being sick of hearing about these ideas. If it happens fine (although I still doubt it), but these franchises would be fools to let these generational QB’s go. I don’t think it’s crazy Simms likes one QB over another. I can see the Jets pulling the trigger on one of these QB’s and give up on Darnold. I don’t see many teams giving up much draft capital for him.
Doc Brown Posted March 4, 2021 Posted March 4, 2021 Looked up his pre draft rankings from 2018 on. Not too shabby so far. He went along with the consensus number one in 2019 and 2020 so I can't say he's putting Wilson in front of Lawrence just for attention. Still continuing hope that the Jets will screw the pooch and keep Darnold. 2018 Lamar Jackson Josh Allen Baker Mayfield Sam Darnold Josh Rosen 2019 Kyler Murray Drew Lock Dwayne Haskins Ryan Finley Jarrett Stidham Daniel Jones Clayton Thorson Will Grier 2020 Joe Burrow Justin Herbert Jordan Love Tua Tagovailoa
GunnerBill Posted March 4, 2021 Posted March 4, 2021 2 minutes ago, Doc Brown said: Looked up his pre draft rankings from 2018 on. Not too shabby so far. He went along with the consensus number one in 2019 and 2020 so I can't say he's putting Wilson in front of Lawrence just for attention. Still continuing hope that the Jets will screw the pooch and keep Darnold. 2018 Lamar Jackson Josh Allen Baker Mayfield Sam Darnold Josh Rosen 2019 Kyler Murray Drew Lock Dwayne Haskins Ryan Finley Jarrett Stidham Daniel Jones Clayton Thorson Will Grier 2020 Joe Burrow Justin Herbert Jordan Love Tua Tagovailoa 100% Simms isn't doing it for attention. That isn't his style at all. If he says he has Wilson #1 then I completely believe he thinks that. I think Lawrence suffers a bit from "evaluation fatigue" he has been playing so well for so long in college that teams are kind of used to him. Wilson is the exciting guy who has come from nowhere this year and I do think that plays in a bit. 2
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