Only 2 teams put in requests to interview Daboll

[Freddie's Dead]

WWG (Wrong White Guy).

[Nihilarian]

40 minutes ago, auburnbillsbacker said:

I can't believe Dabol is getting killed in this thread.  This was one of the Bills best offenses ever.

Mostly because of the QB himself.

 

Daboll is getting credit for developing Allen... when in his rookie year (2018) this same OC thought QB Nathan Peterman was ready to start that Baltimore Ravens opener over Allen. 

 

In case anyone has forgotten how bad things were with good ole Nathan behind center...5 of 18 for 24 yards passing, 2 INTs, 3 sacks a QB rating of 0.0. and he played until midway into the 3rd quarter!!!!

 

What happened to Nathan Peterman's development??? Where is the miracle evolve / development with "that" QB? 

 

 

That first season (2018) Allen had no actual QB coach that was an actual QB coach, as he had a past of coaching WRs. He had no journeyman QB on the roster to help guide him and show him the NFL ropes until partway through the season. 

 

It wasn't Daboll who has been working with Allen on his mechanics every offseason. It was, and still is Jordan Palmer who should get the most credit for Josh Allen's development. QB coach Ken Dorsey also gets credit from Allen himself on helping his development. 

 

Let's also not forget that in that first season (2018) the Buffalo Bills (due to cap restraints and injuries, Woods and Incognito gone) had one of the very worst offensive lines in the NFL!

This, with the Bills OC calling for more deep throws then any other NFL team. Deep throws usually require a 5-7 step deep drop back for the QB... when Allen was constantly under pressure to get rid of the ball. 

So much so, that Allen was constantly running for his life...and when this OC saw how good he was at escaping the rush, he installed some QB run plays. 

 

Brian Daboll has had a past history of sucking as an NFL OC and up until this season his passing offenses have been 32nd, 29th, 23rd, 32nd, 31st in 2018 for Buffalo, 26th in 2019 for Buffalo. 

 

Come to think of it...where was the passing innovation in Bills the passing game for the playoffs?

 

Pass happy, one trick pony...

 

[FireChans]

4 hours ago, Nihilarian said:

Now, take away 109 attempts, 510 yards rushing, 9 TDs by the QB and see where that puts the Bills RB production?

 

317 attempts 1374 yards from Singletary and Gore. Those numbers put the Bills last in rush attempts and 31st in rushing yards.

 

IMO The problem isn't the line or the RBs as Singletary averaged 5.1 YPC in 2019, which was the same as Titans RB Derrick Henry...who led the NFL in rushing the past two seasons.

Singletary still averaged 4.4 YPC in 2020. 

 

The difference that I see is the innovation that we saw in the Buffalo Bills passing game each week vs the lack of innovation we saw in the Bills run game.

 

The 2020 Buffalo Bills had the #2 offense in the NFL. 11th in passing attempts, 3rd in passing yards. 4th in net yards per passing attempt!

 

Yet, 17th in rushing attempts, 20th in rush yards. 20th in yards per rushing attempt. 

 

Notice the difference?

 

 

QB Josh Allen was a top five QB in 2020, with 4544 passing yards, 37 TDs and a 69.2 completion percentage. Yowzah! 

 

I get that the fact that Allen can break free from the pocket for a big gain like he did in some playoff games as he was the Buffalo leading rusher in that Colts playoff game.

Led with 7 rush attempts against the Ravens along with Singletary in the division playoff game. Allen was again the leading rusher for the Bills in the AFC championship game. 

 

The very last thing this franchise should want to see going forward... is their elite pocket passing QB being the leading rusher in any game ever again!! As he is simply far to valuable throwing the ball in the pocket vs ending up like Cam Newton, RG3 because of injuries from running. Eff that! 

 

Allen has evolved into an elite pocket passer...which we all saw in 2020. 

Why would you eliminate the QB’s rushing yards to accurately judge an offense?

 

Why would you point to 2019 running game production as bad without Allen, then talk about how good Singletary is by pointing to his 2019 rushing averages?

 

Did you make your conclusion first and then figure out your supporting arguments later?

[Gugny]

Generally speaking, I think people tend to give OCs too much credit when a QB has a great season.  Did Allen have a breakout year because of Daboll or despite him?

 

Still too many head-scratcher play calls/game plans.

 

I'm not in the "fire Daboll," camp, but his career is what his career is.

 

The Bills' offense was awesome last year primarily because Josh Allen was awesome; not because Daboll is a great OC.

[Nihilarian]

25 minutes ago, FireChans said:

Why would you eliminate the QB’s rushing yards to accurately judge an offense?

 

Why would you point to 2019 running game production as bad without Allen, then talk about how good Singletary is by pointing to his 2019 rushing averages?

 

Did you make your conclusion first and then figure out your supporting arguments later?

To show that although the stats say the Bills offensive run game is looking somewhat generally overall decent in comparison to other NFL teams. It's not because of the running backs themselves. It's because of the Bills QB being the teams third leading rusher in adding a lot of yardage. Context.

 

The 13-3 Green Bay Packers were 12th in attempts in rushing, 8th in rush yards, 15th in TDs. While QB Aaron Rodgers was their 4th leading rusher, he had 38 attempts for 149 yards, 3 TDs. While their main RB was Aaron Jones with 201 attempts for 1104 yards, 9 TDs.

 

Bills QB Josh Allen alone had 2x the rushing TDs over Zack Moss and nearly as many rush attempts 102 to 112, rush yards 421 to 481. 

 

 

My conclusion was it wasn't just the RBs or the line. It was the fact that this OC simply doesn't work the offensive run game with the same regard as he does the passing game. 

[FireChans]

31 minutes ago, Nihilarian said:

To show that although the stats say the Bills offensive run game is looking somewhat generally overall decent in comparison to other NFL teams. It's not because of the running backs themselves. It's because of the Bills QB being the teams third leading rusher in adding a lot of yardage. Context.

 

The 13-3 Green Bay Packers were 12th in attempts in rushing, 8th in rush yards, 15th in TDs. While QB Aaron Rodgers was their 4th leading rusher, he had 38 attempts for 149 yards, 3 TDs. While their main RB was Aaron Jones with 201 attempts for 1104 yards, 9 TDs.

 

Bills QB Josh Allen alone had 2x the rushing TDs over Zack Moss and nearly as many rush attempts 102 to 112, rush yards 421 to 481. 

 

 

My conclusion was it wasn't just the RBs or the line. It was the fact that this OC simply doesn't work the offensive run game with the same regard as he does the passing game. 

Allen has lots of designed runs called for him. Prior to 2020, he was used as a weapon in the running game pretty frequently. Even then, a big part of his game is his mobile ability, especially in the red zone.

 

It’s not shocking that Allen has a lot of rushing TD’s. 
 

If you are eliminating his numbers out of hand, you are simply ignoring a part of our running production to support your argument.

[BADOLBILZ]

5 hours ago, DaggersEOD said:

Defend his whiteness???
 

W T actual F is that BS?!

 

Defend hiring a person because of the color of their skin?? I thought bigotry had no place in this country. 

 

Go back to the 50’s and people are saying the same disgusting things (oddly enough the same group of people), just different a target. 
 

Why perpetuate something disgusting?

 

 

 

Yes there is a perception in the media that the % of black HC's should mirror the % of black players in the NFL and that anything less than that is a sure sign of systemic racism.

 

I entirely disagree with the concept because players earn spots thru physical competition while coaches are "chosen" rather arbitrarily by some measure of intellect........which would be racist in itself to say therefore disqualifies any person who isn't black.   If that % of NFL players mattered Mike Tomlin and Sean McDermott wouldn't be in the NFL they'd just be William and Mary alumnus probably working in finance or something.

 

But the reality is that there is racism involved.........and there would be regardless of who the majority race of ownership was............and teams know there are bridges too far now when dealing with the public with regard to hirings.    

 

Oft-fired, middle aged white coaches with no history of success as a HC on any level are toxic candidates right now.

 

That's not to say some team wouldn't hire Daboll..........it only takes one........but look at the hirings that just took place.   The way to skirt discomfort with black candidates without mass criticism is to hire a young guy and say he's the next McVay..........an inspired young genius with a clean record.     

 

And teams are willing to go that route because at their core I believe most owners think there are an absolute TON of candidates for any HC job that could do the job well if given the resources.......so they will hire the person they feel they can relate and communicate the best with.   They really don't think they are passing on better candidates.  

[Don Otreply]

Not surprised, with his body of work being what it is, that and the belichick coaching tree being what it is...

 

If Daboll can put together several more high win. Count seasons he will have a real chance, but not before then, jmo. 

[BADOLBILZ]

5 hours ago, 2020 Our Year For Sure said:

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/bills-denied-eagles-permission-to-interview-brian-daboll-prior-to-philadelphia-hiring-nick-sirianni/amp/

 

How many teams inquired, found out he wasn't interested, and moved on before submitting a formal request form? Probably closer to 7 teams interested than to 2, I'd say.

 

This thread is deceptive and is a non-story but it's funny to see how desperate @BADOLBILZ and @BillsVet are to push a narrative.

 

 

There is nothing desperate about it.........he's a good enough NFL OC and paid top dollar so staying an OC is still a profitable option.

 

His fit with Josh has been great and I am very pleased that taking the risk in exposing Allen to a complex offense has really put him in a position where he has now moved ahead of a fast starter like Lamar Jackson in the QB pecking order.     It was a risk but I believe in taking risks and trying to be the best.

 

I just don't believe that Daboll is a generational talent as an OC.    He has holes in his game that he needs to figure out just to be consistently excellent in that job.   He's a local guy and I hope he takes his game to yet another level this year..........but this was only the first time in 6 years as an NFL OC that he's had a good offense......and teams already showed they adapted to it in the playoffs.......so it's not a given that he will be as good or better this season.

 

For all I know he could be a great HC...........it's an entirely different skillset than being a coordinator...........but most of the data teams have to work with to evaluate him is as an OC and he's had more downs than ups in that job.    That's not a good look in this HC hiring environment.   

[Nihilarian]

2 hours ago, FireChans said:

Allen has lots of designed runs called for him. Prior to 2020, he was used as a weapon in the running game pretty frequently. Even then, a big part of his game is his mobile ability, especially in the red zone.

 

It’s not shocking that Allen has a lot of rushing TD’s. 
 

If you are eliminating his numbers out of hand, you are simply ignoring a part of our running production to support your argument.

Screw the designed runs!

 

Here is why I don't want my "elite" superstar QB that took nearly 30 years to find running the darn ball!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

 

Josh Allen has already had one concussion against the Patriots. 

 

 

Another reason I don't want to see Josh Allen in designed QB runs. Yes, he can run and is very good at it. However, how easy will it be to replace him when he is gone??

 

 

Running QB's don't last in the NFL...period!  SUPERMAN...is...no...longer...superman! 

[GunnerBill]

5 hours ago, auburnbillsbacker said:

I can't believe Dabol is getting killed in this thread.  This was one of the Bills best offenses ever.

 

It is what we do. Blaming offensive coordinators is a hobby around here. 

[FireChans]

14 minutes ago, Nihilarian said:

Screw the designed runs!

 

Here is why I don't want my "elite" superstar QB that took nearly 30 years to find running the darn ball!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

 

Josh Allen has already had one concussion against the Patriots. 

 

 

Another reason I don't want to see Josh Allen in designed QB runs. Yes, he can run and is very good at it. However, how easy will it be to replace him when he is gone??

 

 

Running QB's don't last in the NFL...period!  SUPERMAN...is...no...longer...superman! 

So you don’t agree with the philosophy of designed runs and that means they don’t count toward offensive production? 
 

Is anyone else following here

[Hapless Bills Fan]

3 hours ago, Gugny said:

Generally speaking, I think people tend to give OCs too much credit when a QB has a great season.  Did Allen have a breakout year because of Daboll or despite him?

 

Still too many head-scratcher play calls/game plans.

 

I'm not in the "fire Daboll," camp, but his career is what his career is.

 

The Bills' offense was awesome last year primarily because Josh Allen was awesome; not because Daboll is a great OC.

 

I'm trying to stay out of this thread for the most part, but I'll put in my $0.02 here with an analogy with full intention to offend Josh Allen were he to read this LOL.

 

I think figuring out the contribution of the QB and the players on offense relative to the offensive coordinator is like figuring out the contribution of a musical performer relative to the composer of a musical piece.    You can have a song with potential (Leonard Cohen's Hallelujah, for example), and it's going to splutter with a mediocre performer like Cohen singing it and be transcendent/send chills down your back when Pentatonix take it up.  Then you can have a totally mediocre bland song like Justin Bieber's "Yummy" and have a top-quality professional video production with top-quality mic'ing and mixing, and yeah the guy has a decent voice, and it's still distinctly "meh".  I believe even Pentatonix couldn't save that song, though I daresay they'd improve it.

 

If the question is "Did Allen have a breakout year because of Daboll or despite him", the answer is "yes".  Allen obviously put in a lot of work to improve his passing and elevate the mental level of his game.  Diggs was an amazing addition, Davis was quality, and overall all our receivers seem to have "leveled up".  But like a musician given a lousy piece of music to perform, if Daboll weren't designing plays that generally took full advantage of the personnel we had and worked to create mismatches and defender confliction, the offense wouldn't have worked very well.

 

So I don't believe you can separate the two of them so neatly and say "primarily because Josh Allen was awesome".  It took both.

 

I saw very few head-scratcher play calls or game plans relative to 2018 and even 2019.  If you feel you did, care to cite a few examples?

[Boxcar]

Wow, Bieniemy interviewed for every team and no one hired him.

[Don Otreply]

10 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

It is what we do. Blaming offensive coordinators is a hobby around here. 

BD has had a few less than stellar seasons as an OC, and it is fair to suggest that those performances may have been part of why only two teams asked for interviews for head coaching positions. 

 

We all want him to have more success, for very obvious reasons. For all any of us know BD may have his ducks in a row, and be on his way to pro football coaching stardom, I for one hope so. 

[Eastport bills]

I think the notoriety of the Bills breakthrough season is generally being attributed to Josh's incredible talent and the awesome chemistry with Diggs,Beasley and Davis. The playoff game planning and play calling didn't distinguish him as special. Having said that, JA17 seems to trust him and another year with better backs and a productive TE might get him a HC look-see. He'll find out after he leaves how easy it was calling plays for a talented freakish athlete like Josh. 

 

 

[GunnerBill]

18 minutes ago, Don Otreply said:

BD has had a few less than stellar seasons as an OC, and it is fair to suggest that those performances may have been part of why only two teams asked for interviews for head coaching positions. 

 

We all want him to have more success, for very obvious reasons. For all any of us know BD may have his ducks in a row, and be on his way to pro football coaching stardom, I for one hope so. 

 

I am not saying Daboll is on his way to stardom. But Bills fans want to give him all the blame for 2019 and none of the credit for 2020. It is intellectually illogical. 

[Process]

Remember , before this year he was awful, and most people wanted him fired after houston, rightfully so. 

 

Even this year vs the colts, it was like he was trying to blow the game.

 

I was much less concerned about losing Daboll than most.

Edited February 27, 2021 by Process

[Don Otreply]

1 hour ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I am not saying Daboll is on his way to stardom. But Bills fans want to give him all the blame for 2019 and none of the credit for 2020. It is intellectually illogical. 

I can see your view, I was just pointing out that it was not wholly surprising that only two teams interviewed him. 

[GunnerBill]

39 minutes ago, Don Otreply said:

I can see your view, I was just pointing out that it was not wholly surprising that only two teams interviewed him. 

 

And he turned one down.