Possible cap casualties from other teams [EditedTitle]

[Doc]

2 hours ago, TheBeaneBandit said:

Throughout all this I wonder if Star has thought about retirement. In a way I kind of hope it happens and that saves the Bills all that cap space and they can go after a true monster like Williams from the Giants. He could be our Chris Jones with Oliver free to kill on top of it.

 

Maybe not retire but opt-out again.  But unless they make players announce it before the FA period, the money isn't saved in time for the FA period and leaves a hole on the team without a good way to fill it.

[scuba guy]

Good thing is all teams get 18mill more for rev sharing

 

I known its not much better than nothing

Edited February 16, 2021 by scuba guy
Typo

[Thurman#1]

On 2/15/2021 at 7:47 PM, BillsFan1988 said:

I wouldn't stop there we need to blow up this line especially from the edges. I would cut Jefferson, Hughes, Addison and Butler as well as Star. This opens up nearly 35 mil in cap space. None of these guys have earned there money. Hughes is a great leader on this team i would offer him a pay cut to stay.

 

Opening this cap space allows us to go after players like JJ Watt, Trey Hendrickson, Haason Reddick, Yannick Ngakoue & Shaq Barrett if he's available. Any combination of these 2 would be a massive upgrade over those other players that we cut. 

 

The only guys I would keep are Epenesa, Oliver, Phillips and Zimmer.  There's a ton of good players in free agency on the Defensive side of the ball. We can't miss on a opportunity to reload on Defense. 

 

 

First, that would open up nothing like $35M. You're leaving dead cap out entirely.

 

In fact, cutting Star (which makes no sense in the first place because if we found out one thing this year it's that he's extremely valuable) would actually cost more than it would save.

 

Second, cutting Hughes doesn't make sense. He's the only guy getting consistent pressure and he's doing it at a very high rate. They will not do this, nor should anyone with an ounce of sense. Nor will they ask him to take a pay cut. Extend his contract and re-negotiate some money down the road with him, without asking him to take a pay cut? Yeah, possible. That could save us maybe $3 mill or so.

 

Third, if you cut all those guys, you do open up some cap space .... and create holes which if you want to fill them only with players just as good, no improvement at all, would cost pretty much all of that cap space to replace them.

 

They'll do some cutting. But they're very unlikely to be able to bring in any more than one of the guys you are thinking of, and even one would probably be difficult. It would prevent us from re-signing guys like Milano, Feliciano and Darryl Williams, which would leave yet more holes. And it would eliminate any sense of continuity going forward, in a season when we are likely to yet again have problem with getting enough off-season workouts in.

 

Are one or two of those guy likely to go? Sure. Not Star or Hughes, but yeah one or two of the others. It won't open up enough to bring in tons of high-priced FAs, though.

Edited February 16, 2021 by Thurman#1

[Thurman#1]

7 hours ago, BillsFan1988 said:

I respect the dialogue that's what boards like this are all about. I think u bring up some very valid points. What I was basically saying is we need to consolidate on the line we have bkups getting starters money to play 30-40 percent of the snaps.

 

I realize Mcd likes to have a rotation but there's other ways to get this done then spending over 50mil on the dline and getting poor results in return. We need some studs that play 60-65 percent mixed in with some cheap vets or draft pks rotating in on occasion. Last yr I was dumbfounded by all the money spent on DTs in free agency . Murphy was inactive all yr with his 10 mil salary. I mean Norman and Murphy got 16 mil basically to do nothing. We should of signed James Bradbury instead . The Giants got him for 3yrs - 45 mil and that was steal. Imagine Bradbury and Tre on opposite sides .  

 

 

You don't quite seem to get this, but what you're saying is that McD is going to leave behind his system and go to yours.

 

And good luck on that.

 

He doesn't "like" to have a rotation. It's how his defense works and always has, including his time in Carolina. You don't like it? Fine. But you'd better learn to deal with it, unless you can persuade the Pegulas to fire McD and put you in his place.

[Green Lightning]

17 hours ago, BillsFan1988 said:

I wouldn't stop there we need to blow up this line especially from the edges. I would cut Jefferson, Hughes, Addison and Butler as well as Star. This opens up nearly 35 mil in cap space. None of these guys have earned there money. Hughes is a great leader on this team i would offer him a pay cut to stay.

 

Opening this cap space allows us to go after players like JJ Watt, Trey Hendrickson, Haason Reddick, Yannick Ngakoue & Shaq Barrett if he's available. Any combination of these 2 would be a massive upgrade over those other players that we cut. 

 

The only guys I would keep are Epenesa, Oliver, Phillips and Zimmer.  There's a ton of good players in free agency on the Defensive side of the ball. We can't miss on a opportunity to reload on Defense. 

Well that's just cracker-dogs. Jerry has been our only source of QB pressure. Better have some better plans in place before you blow everything up.

[Thurman#1]

12 hours ago, BillsFan1988 said:

So instead of giving a reasonable rebuttal to what I was saying u rather try to insult and be humerous. There's nothing Madden about what I was saying. I gurantee we cut at least 3 of them. Beane signed these guys with easy outs from there contracts with little to no cap hit when it comes to Jefferson, Addison and Butler. 

 

 

I have to admit, you live in a different world than I do if you consider the $7.5M in dead cap debt we'd acquire by cutting Jefferson, Addison and Butler as "little to nothing." Perhaps you're independently wealthy? Or perhaps you're thinking of a year like 2018 when we were tens of millions below the cap. This year, to me, that's not small money, and the money we'd have to spend to replace them also won't be all that small.

 

I do expect one or two of them to go, possibly even three, or some re-negotiations. But it won't open up as much as you're thinking, and we already need that money to re-sign guys like Corey Bojorquez, Andre Roberts, Levi Wallace, Ike Boettger, Yeldon, and Matt Barkley (or their replacements who would cost pretty much the same) not to mention Feliciano, Darryl Williams and Matt Milano, not to mention the $5 - $7 mill or so we'll need to sign our rookie draft class. We won't re-sign all of these folks. But if we lose many we'll just have to spend the money to replace them.

Edited February 16, 2021 by Thurman#1

[machine gun kelly]

It’s not that hard to just think through extensions, cap space, cuts, cap savings vs. dead cap, and the impact on the team.  The other is cost of improvements.

 

They can maneuver some $ for Watt, but they would need to be creative.  Blowing up the team on defense and changing the fundamentals of what McD learned under Jimmy Johnson in Philly is crazy.  He’s not going to do it.

 

Nor should he.

Edited February 16, 2021 by machine gun kelly

[Da webster guy]

I'm starting to wonder about the rotational approach McD seems to love.   I'd rather have 4 studs that play most of the time than 8 average guys.

 

Its hard to blame Beaner for the Dline he put together considering Jefferson, Butler and Addison all had stretches where they were playing very well.   If I had to keep one of the three I'd take Jefferson simply because my foggy memory seems to recall him balling out more than the others.

 

I like the OP's general idea, maybe not as extreme like cutting Jerry who is starting to become like the Tom Brady of edge guys, but the concept of cutting Murphy, Butler and Addison to add one monster like KC did with Clark is appealing.  

 

Also we need some leaps from Eppy and Big Ed next year, these dudes were our first picks the past two years come on boys you have the talent lets keep getting better we need ya !

 

KC has one more year until Mahomes 50M blows their team up.   We have two more before Josh's cap hit will take a toll, lets go Bills!

[BillsFan1988]

You guys are flat out amazing . We spent 51 mil on our Dline last season. Was that money well spent ? Did we return value on our investment? I can say with resounding confidence that was a horrible way to spend 50 mil . Do u realize that was 1 or 2 in the NFL on money spent on the Dline? 

 

So with a straight face who wants to sign up for that again. I gurantee u that if we bring back the same players we won't get better results. We were winning most of our games by big margins and these guys still couldn't muster pressure consistently with the front 4 . We needed to blitz to get pressure. These are the facts . 

 

For those who want to use the lack of off-season excuse your even more amazing . Everyone had to deal with that every player , coach, front office, everyone. Did that stop Josh Allen from growing as a player and leading our offense to a record 502 pts? Did that stop Daryll Williams from allowing 0 sacks on the season? Imagine what he can do with a full off-season ? If anything the Oline needs to have them reps way more then the Defensive line. 

 

So stop putting words in my mouth I didn't say blow up the whole Defense I said blow up the edges and get rid of the bkups that are getting paid 7-8 mil per yr. That's ridiculous no team in the NFL is spending that much money on rotational players. Justin Zimmer came in and stole some of these guys reps with his beautiful min salary. We need to find more guys like him to work into Mcd rotations.  

 

So keep saying I'm wrong if it suits u but u know damn well that we need to make major changes at the DE spots. So yes I would cut the fat on this line and build around Oliver, Harrison & Epenesa. Btw Harrison Phillips was the 2nd best DT in the NFL the last 6 weeks vs the run . He finally got fully healthy and we seen the results . Oliver got better this last season also and I'm looking forward to full breakout season from him in 2021 and hopefully we can add some players that can muster some consistent pressure on the edges without having to blitz . Last but not least we can get this all done without spending 50 plus mil on the Dline. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 16, 2021 by BillsFan1988
Duplicate message

[Thurman#1]

16 minutes ago, BillsFan1988 said:

You guys are flat out amazing . We spent 51 mil on our Dline last season. Was that money well spent ? Did we return value on our investment? I can say with resounding confidence that was a horrible way to spend 50 mil . Do u realize that was 1 or 2 in the NFL on money spent on the Dline? 

 

So with a straight face who wants to sign up for that again. I gurantee u that if we bring back the same players we won't get better results. We were winning most of our games by big margins and these guys still couldn't muster pressure consistently with the front 4 . We needed to blitz to get pressure. These are the facts . 

 

For those who want to use the lack of off-season excuse your even more amazing . Everyone had to deal with that every player , coach, front office, everyone. Did that stop Josh Allen from growing as a player and leading our offense to a record 502 pts? Did that stop Daryll Williams from allowing 0 sacks on the season? Imagine what he can do with a full off-season ? If anything the Oline needs to have them reps way more then the Defensive line. 

 

So stop putting words in my mouth I didn't say blow up the whole Defense I said blow up the edges and get rid of the bkups that are getting paid 7-8 mil per yr. That's ridiculous no team in the NFL is spending that much money on rotational players. Justin Zimmer came in and stole some of these guys reps with his beautiful min salary. We need to find more guys like him to work into Mcd rotations.  

 

So keep saying I'm wrong if it suits u but u know damn well that we need to make major changes at the DE spots. So yes I would cut the fat on this line and build around Oliver, Harrison & Epenesa. Btw Harrison Phillips was the 2nd best DT in the NFL the last 6 weeks vs the run . He finally got fully healthy and we seen the results . Oliver got better this last season also and I'm looking forward to full breakout season from him in 2021 and hopefully we can add some players that can muster some consistent pressure on the edges without having to blitz . Last but not least we can get this all done without spending 50 plus mil on the Dline. 

 

 

 

You say you guarantee some things, and what you have there is certainly not a guarantee. Buy the team and you'll be in position to have power over the situation and at that point you can guarantee things. What you have there is a guess.

 

A guess which might be correct. But a guess.

 

And you really kind of did suggest things that would be blowing up the defense. Our coach, who is wildly successful at putting a very good defense on the field year after year, is committed to a platoon at the D-line. You say he shouldn't. Fine, again, buy yourself a football team and put your ideas into play. But he's not going to change because there's a guy on the internet who thinks he should.

 

We're going to need 8 DLs who will all play very significant snaps. They're likely to cut one or very possibly two. Three might be stretching it, but it's a possibility, but more than that? Please. But the guys who are cut will have to be replaced somehow and that will cost money. Your idea about cutting many and thus having tons of money available for outsize spending isn't realistic, money-wise. If they cut a lot, they'll have to replace a lot.

[BillsFan1988]

4 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

You say you guarantee some things, and what you have there is certainly not a guarantee. Buy the team and you'll be in position to have power over the situation and at that point you can guarantee things. What you have there is a guess.

 

A guess which might be correct. But a guess.

 

And you really kind of did suggest things that would be blowing up the defense. Our coach, who is wildly successful at putting a very good defense on the field year after year, is committed to a platoon at the D-line. You say he shouldn't. Fine, again, buy yourself a football team and put your ideas into play. But he's not going to change because there's a guy on the internet who thinks he should.

 

We're going to need 8 DLs who will all play very significant snaps. They're likely to cut one or very possibly two. Three might be stretching it, but it's a possibility, but more than that? Please. But the guys who are cut will have to be replaced somehow and that will cost money. Your idea about cutting many and thus having tons of money available for outsize spending isn't realistic, money-wise. If they cut a lot, they'll have to replace a lot.

Where did I say Mcd shouldn't use a rotation? Or that he should change his scheme. Didn't we lose 4 guys from the previous yr from our front , Shaq, Star, JP and basically Murphy since he only played in 6 gms and his snap percentage was very low at that. Wouldn't u say we got worse at the Dline without those players? We downgraded and overspent. That's the truth.  

 

The point is now to realize the mistakes we made and make good with them. Jefferson, Addison and Butler did not earn there salaries. Hughes is on the downside of his career and Star is coming off a full season out. Obviously 

 just my opinion but i predict that we will move on from at least the 3 I mentioned Addison, Butler and Jefferson.