Watson vs Allen.

[Chaos]

3 minutes ago, Augie said:

 

It’s still a team game, and SO MUCH depends upon what surrounds them. Part of the reason Watson wants out of Houston, I’m sure. he’s been surrounded by talent and has had abundant success. I’m good with that! 

If, at the end of his career, Josh is viewed as the better QB that means Josh was the better QB.   

[Buffalo_Stampede]

I think they're both pretty equal. Both sitting right behind the elites of the the league. Mahomes, Rodgers, Wilson. Mostly just consistency being what seperates them. Those 3 have done it over multiple years. Allen just needs to keep doing it he'll be there. Watson has been a better passer than Allen for longer but Allen has taken his team further in the playoffs.

 

I wouldn't know how to pick which will be best. They are both the future of the NFL. 

[Augie]

1 hour ago, Chaos said:

If, at the end of his career, Josh is viewed as the better QB that means Josh was the better QB.   

 

Sorry, you went from a declaration, “Allen is better”, to a supposition, “If, at the end of his career....”.  Can’t have it both ways and pretend you proved your point. 

 

If Peyton Manning played his entire career with the Jags, they might have been slightly better as a team, but he would NOT have had the same career or be seen as the sure fire HOF QB he was. 

 

What surrounds a QB matters (players, coaches and FO), and can help define a career.  I don’t blame Watson for wanting out, or at least better talent (on and off the field) surrounding him.  Russell Wilson said it himself on Dan Patrick this week.....his “legacy” rides on what surrounds him. 

 

EDIT: I am NOT saying Josh isn’t better. I’m just making a bigger point about how important surrounding talent and coaching is. You have also omitted part of my quote, which could possibly lead to being misleading. 

 

 

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Edited February 12, 2021 by Augie

[CincyBillsFan]

3 hours ago, Marvlevydraftdaygenius said:

To all you fans out there that want to explore if Watson is better than Allen and if the Texans offered  Watson for Josh Allen the Bills should think about it.  Little guy Ricco on Bills Fanatics said Watson is better than Allen look at the Stats.    Here is the Major reason why Allen is better than Watson. Josh is  throwing in Buffalo, Watson is throwing in a Dome.  Has  Watson, ever in his career played in the cold?  He played at Clemson I don't recall their weather being blizzard like and in the pros he plays in a division with the Colts dome team, Tennessee warm weather team, and Jacksonville Warm weather team no where near the Weather Josh plays in.   Be thankful Buffalo you found the prototype QB to play in Buffalo's weather.

 

I don't know about the rest of you but I've lost all patience in so called Bills fans like "Ricco".  IMO these kinds of hypothetical situations prove that they're idiots.  There's only one QB in the NFL I would even think of trading straight up for Allen and that's Mahomes. And even there I would likely stick with Allen.

 

And in addition to your point on the weather Watson this year probably faced soft prevent defenses on almost half his snaps.  His team trailed by two or more scores in the 2nd half frequently.  The only games where Allen actually faced an extended period of prevent defense was against KC in the championship game.  Even against TN the Bills fumble on the KO return robbed Allen of facing the Titans prevent.

 

There are a small minority of dead enders who will never accept that Allen is a great QB.  They predicted doom in 2018 and they will never admit that they were wrong. But they know they'll look like even bigger fools if they attack Allen's play straight on so they slink around in the shadows throwing out hypothetical nonsense like the Bills should consider trading Allen for Watson.

 

 

 

 

3 hours ago, Marvlevydraftdaygenius said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

2 hours ago, Albany,n.y. said:

Josh is better than Watson & always will be.  Watson was 4-12 this past season.  No team with Josh Allen as the starting QB would ever go 4-12.  Even in Josh's rookie year, with no offensive line or WRs, Josh willed the team to 5 wins out of the 11 games he started.  Watson loses, Josh wins.  Wins are the most important statistic because a QB makes everyone around him better.  Josh does that, Watson doesn't.  

 

Spot on!  Allen went 5 - 6 as a rookie QB with a dumpster fire of an offense.

Edited February 12, 2021 by CincyBillsFan

[BruceVilanch]

3 hours ago, JoPoy88 said:

who is little guy Ricco? 
 

I love Watson but I’m still taking Allen.

I have never heard of him reffered to as "Little guy" Rico, I think he just goes by Rico. He has a podcast called the Rico Report, he is pretty funny and super high energy, he's definitely worth checking out during the season, he has some good content.  If you have little kids I would make sure they are out of the room, he gets pretty explicit.

[BullBuchanan]

As a longtime Watson fan who was pissed that the bills passed on him, it would be absolutely pointless. He doesn't get us any closer than we already are. You need a QB to routinely compete in this league, but as every playoff team showed you usually need a complete team that is healthy and plays mistake free football when it matters most. Unless Watson is coming here to play linebacker or tight end, he doesn't solve our problems

[LeGOATski]

If they wanted to swap last year, sure.

 

Josh became The Guy this year, though. No one swaps The Guy....

 

....except the Texans.

[bobobonators]

Watson was better out of the gate and was definitely more NFL ready; however, Allen’s season last year was better than anything Watson has done. Allen’s ceiling is higher. Allen’s ceiling is as high as any QB in the NFL right now. I wouldnt trade Allen for anyone. 

[Charles Romes]

Most underrated stat, sack percentage:

 

Watson 9.1 playing with franchise left tackle

Allen 6.4 (4.3 in 2020)

 

all time career leader, Rob Johnson with a staggering 14.8

 

 

[Buffalo716]

2 hours ago, Augie said:

 

Sorry, you went from a declaration, “Allen is better”, to a supposition, “If, at the end of his career....”.  Can’t have it both ways and pretend you proved your point. 

 

If Peyton Manning played his entire career with the Jags, they might have been slightly better as a team, but he would NOT have had the same career or be seen as the sure fire HOF QB he was. 

 

What surrounds a QB matters (players, coaches and FO), and can help define a career.  I don’t blame Watson for wanting out, or at least better talent (on and off the field) surrounding him.  Russell Wilson said it himself on Dan Patrick this week.....his “legacy” rides on what surrounds him. 

 

EDIT: I am NOT saying Josh isn’t better. I’m just making a bigger point about how important surrounding talent and coaching is. You have also omitted part of my quote, which could possibly lead to being misleading. 

 

 

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Honestly to play devil's advocate, Indianapolis was a joke when they drafted him, and Jacksonville was actually a very good young expansion team.. 

 

Went to two conference championships within their first 4 years.. something tells me if they got the draft Peyton Manning they would have been all right

 

 

[Ethan in Cleveland]

3 hours ago, Southern_Bills said:

The actual answer is its not worth giving up anything because they are both good.

 

I personally like Allen better, probably biased, but always be weary of QBs who put up huge numbers but it doesn't actually net wins for the team.

 

Dak Prescott is a stats monster but I wouldn't trade for him.

Watson has one less playoff win than Allen. Watson was a one man show in Houston this year.  

Dallas without Prescott was one of the worst teams in the NFL.  With him they are a playoff contender.  

You should have stopped after saying they were both good. 

 

[Augie]

33 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Honestly to play devil's advocate, Indianapolis was a joke when they drafted him, and Jacksonville was actually a very good young expansion team.. 

 

Went to two conference championships within their first 4 years.. something tells me if they got the draft Peyton Manning they would have been all right

 

 

 

Due to Jax ownership, a dumpster fire would have ensued. I’m fully aware of the meteoric rise of expansion Jax and Charlotte. 

 

I’m NOT talking about specific teams, I talking about the quality of a franchise. If the team sucks (which starts with the owner, then FO then HC) the QB doesn’t stand a chance. A QB is needed to elevate a team, but they can only do so much.  Do you think Watson would LOVE to trade places with Josh?

 

Yeah, me too. 

 

 

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Edited February 12, 2021 by Augie

[machine gun kelly]

8 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

This. I have never heard of little guy Ricco. 

 

Deshaun Watson is great but I wouldn't swap Josh Allen for him. 

GB, pay not attn.  This is just a troll trying to stir things up.  No one is saying they want Watson over Allen, and for that matter Watson isn’t going anywhere, nor is Wilson.  QB’s like these two will never get released, and they certainly aren’t leaving $25-35 mil. on the table sitting out.

 

This happens every off-season.  Some person floats we should trade for Rodger, P. Manning back in the day, and so on.  The worst part is solid Bills fans fall for it and starts a never ending thread.

 

Have fun guys on scenarios that will never happen.

[Doc Brown]

Both are top five franchise QB's so I'm fine with either.  Both are winners (made the playoffs two of their first three seasons) who play with moxie and their team loves playing for them.  I'll take Allen just because he seems to embody Buffalo more than Watson.  Plus, Watson has taken more of a beating than Allen with 174 sacks in four seasons (Allen had 92 in three).  It's just nice having the most vital part of a franchise secured.  

[GETTOTHE50]

Allen is the best QB in the league so obviously him and Watson is about 5th. 

[KGun12TD]

12 hours ago, Draconator said:

I like Josh better. I can see him getting drunker than Brady at a Bills Superbowl parade. That's the mark of a great QB!

This thread should have ended here! 😂

[stosh64]

12 hours ago, Marvlevydraftdaygenius said:

To all you fans out there that want to explore if Watson is better than Allen and if the Texans offered  Watson for Josh Allen the Bills should think about it.  Little guy Ricco on Bills Fanatics said Watson is better than Allen look at the Stats.    Here is the Major reason why Allen is better than Watson. Josh is  throwing in Buffalo, Watson is throwing in a Dome.  Has  Watson, ever in his career played in the cold?  He played at Clemson I don't recall their weather being blizzard like and in the pros he plays in a division with the Colts dome team, Tennessee warm weather team, and Jacksonville Warm weather team no where near the Weather Josh plays in.   Be thankful Buffalo you found the prototype QB to play in Buffalo's weather.

rico has always been an Allen hater, I unsubbed them over a year ago.

[SinceThe70s]

So Watson can't win in the cold weather and the proof is he's never played in a cold weather game? I heard the same thing about Michael Vick up until he went up to Green Bay and won a playoff game.

 

For the record,  I wouldn't swap Josh out with any other QB right now, including Mahomes. But cold weather isn't a factor for me.

 

 

 

[Jobot]

14 hours ago, MJS said:

Both are good. I don't really know why we have to compare all these guys. It's ok to like all of them, or dislikes all of them, for that matter.

 

We have Josh Allen as our QB. He took his first steps into the elite realm of QB's. He is going to be the face of the franchise for a long time.

 

Agreed. Either guy is capable of winning a super bowl. It's a team sport... continuity, experience, teamates, coaching, and yup quarterback all go into the equation...

 

Unless you're Tom Brady, and can elevate every aspect of a franchise and convince all star free agents to come on board for cheap.

[C.Biscuit97]

19 hours ago, MJS said:

Both are good. I don't really know why we have to compare all these guys. It's ok to like all of them, or dislikes all of them, for that matter.

 

We have Josh Allen as our QB. He took his first steps into the elite realm of QB's. He is going to be the face of the franchise for a long time.

If you asked before the season, it was a no brained who was better. But then Allen became the most improved player I have ever seen. 
 

I do agree it’s insane how we try to constantly try to compare and knock players. I could have never imagined that Watson and now Allen are both top 5 qbs, who both have the ability to win a super bowl on the right teams. 
 

it’s really weird that some fans have to knock other qbs to build up Allen. Allen is now good enough where he doesn’t need that. Watson is awesome in his own right.

1 hour ago, SGA50 said:

 

Watson played in 1 game with inclement weather: Week 10 @ Cleveland. 

 

Watson, predictably, was an abject disaster. He led his offense to 7 points. His defense allowed 10 points, and he still lost. He lost 10-7. 

 

I repeat: 10 to 7. If Josh's defense gives up 10 points, is Josh scoring just 7 points and losing? Of course not! Unlike Watson, Josh is a winner. He finds a way to win that game - period.

 

Watson's 45mph throwing velocity is among the weakest arms (arm strength wise) in the entire NFL. 

Watson = 45 mph velocity

Josh = 62 mph velocity

Noodle Arm vs Cannon

 

There is no comparison here whatsoever. Josh Allen is leaps and bounds a better QB than Deshaun Watson. There is 0 argument to be made that Watson is better. It is a statement of fact that Josh is much better QB.

Yeah, this isn’t true at all.