So a super fast, physical, and aggressive front 7 is the key...

[TheFunPolice]

I don't think we are that far away on the front. 

 

Additions: (very little to no cap cost to speak of) 

Slayton, the monster 340+ pound DT in the draft

Star comes back, hopefully having added a few pounds

 

That alone helps the DL. Then we need to figure out edge pressure. 

 

Epenesa made some plays this year, and with an offseason of NFL training should add a little size and strength. 

Oliver showed some flashes, but he need a big monster at DT to swallow up blocks. Star did that pretty well, and we can draft a guy as well.

 

People forget that DL tend to need a season or two before they really come into their own. I think both Oliver and Epenesa are talented guys who can make strides next year. 

 

At LB we need some speed and ferocity. Tampa's LBers hit hard and nasty. Edmunds is big put doesn't play with that edge that makes you fear him. That's a huge need, and the biggest question mark. 

[PrimeTime101]

10 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

that's the key ,, not the front 7 but pressure from front 4.

Start with getting a one tech DT

Aggressive LB on Kelse pushing him back EVERY SNAP then have help by a FS on deeper balls.

Bump Hill on the line of scrimmage with help later in the rout.

Zone out the side Hill is not on.

 

On the other side of the ball?

Better OG's, Williams will come at a price but what he did on the right side this year is worthy of a second look.

Devin is not a starting RB in this league.. period.. if we can not find a DEFINATE FA RB that is with out a doubt way better then round 1 is a RB. 

 

By making it to the AFC Conf. game and then being able to sit back and watch a team dismantle KC, not just us but EVERYONE learned from it. For the first time someone figured out the formula to beat KC and the whole NFL knows about it..

 

I think a run is going to happen in round 1 of the draft this year... IT won't be WR's.. IT will be DT, Edge players.

 

Knowing is half the battle..  KC will not have it as easy next year.. they going to be running into cap hell 

[TheBeaneBandit]

After all the well thought out responses from the best board in football I have come to the conclusion that keeping the offense top notch maybe should be the priority. The D just needs way to much work to aquire the necessary players in one cap strapped offseason. Besides maybe a 1st round DE, all other moves should probably focus on offense. Go D heavy next year but for now just try and out score keep other offenses off the field as best as you can. The games will at least be exciting that way, although rough on our internal organs.

[hjnick]

13 hours ago, Niagara Dude said:

After watching David shut down Kelce tonight i think Milano's agent just lost a tone of leverage,  i have no problem seeing him walk.  Both LB'S from Tampa Bay including David are free agents.  We need more play makers in the front 7 and a real RB.  Fournette is also a free agent,

100% totally agree. David did a very good job containing Kelce. 
 

We need fast LBs to cover TEs.

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

32 minutes ago, PrimeTime101 said:

that's the key ,, not the front 7 but pressure from front 4.

Start with getting a one tech DT

Aggressive LB on Kelse pushing him back EVERY SNAP then have help by a FS on deeper balls.

Bump Hill on the line of scrimmage with help later in the rout.

Zone out the side Hill is not on.

 

On the other side of the ball?

Better OG's, Williams will come at a price but what he did on the right side this year is worthy of a second look.

Devin is not a starting RB in this league.. period.. if we can not find a DEFINATE FA RB that is with out a doubt way better then round 1 is a RB. 

 

By making it to the AFC Conf. game and then being able to sit back and watch a team dismantle KC, not just us but EVERYONE learned from it. For the first time someone figured out the formula to beat KC and the whole NFL knows about it..

 

I think a run is going to happen in round 1 of the draft this year... IT won't be WR's.. IT will be DT, Edge players.

 

Knowing is half the battle..  KC will not have it as easy next year.. they going to be running into cap hell 

 

Kelce had to swim off the line every single snap.  And if he didn't, it was a simulated pressure so there was likely a corner or LB blitzing from somewhere else (they looped some of these LB and corner blitzes inside which i thought created more confusion). 

 

David + White are also a really poor matchup for Kelce too - There's nowhere to motion him to get an easier matchup.  They tried stacking him behind hill to create more of a free release, but then they were struggling with protection since you didn't have Kelce to chip.  

 

Essentially it was light boxes, and better pass rush.  But while CEH made some plays - them being in a hole/getting away from the run, and being unable to execute on 3rd down doomed them. Mahomes hurt them in man coverage a few times in the 1st half, but in the 2nd half he was absolutely shellshocked.

[Niagara Dude]

23 hours ago, DCOrange said:

This absolutely is not true. David is a free agent (though he'll almost certainly be back in Tampa), but White is in Tampa for at least 3 more years if not more.

 

Fournette is a free agent but he was legitimately bad all year. No doubt he came up with some big runs in the playoffs though, but his issues were still on display too. One of Brady's INTs against Green Bay was entirely on Fournette; he's a terrible pass protector for a RB. He also had many runs during this playoff run where it basically just looked like a lucky version of Trent Richardson. He'd stare directly at huge holes and instead run square into the defense before regaining his balance and bouncing it outside for big chunks of yardage.

 

Fournette isn't a good RB and would not be an upgrade over our current guys IMO, but he can be productive if the OLine gets as much push as this one does. He is undoubtedly a better athlete than Singletary/Moss, but he's not the guy we need. Ronald Jones was legitimately good this year, but he's another year away from free agency.

 

Sorry these two below are both free agents,  i would take either one and that would upgrade the play making at the LB position. Barrett seem like the better pass rusher and David seems like the better at covering backs & TE'S.  As for Fournette,  just a name i threw out there and the main point being is we need to bring in someone new as our #1 RB .  Singletary is both slow and too small,  not a good combination to have.  He game is all about trying to juke out defenders and  that may work in college but not happening in the NFL. Moss i would keep around as a solid #2 RB

 

Shaquil Barrett

OLB

 

 

Lavonte David

OLB

 

[DCOrange]

35 minutes ago, Niagara Dude said:

 

Sorry these two below are both free agents,  i would take either one and that would upgrade the play making at the LB position. Barrett seem like the better pass rusher and David seems like the better at covering backs & TE'S.  As for Fournette,  just a name i threw out there and the main point being is we need to bring in someone new as our #1 RB .  Singletary is both slow and too small,  not a good combination to have.  He game is all about trying to juke out defenders and  that may work in college but not happening in the NFL. Moss i would keep around as a solid #2 RB

 

Shaquil Barrett

OLB

 

 

Lavonte David

OLB

 

Ah gotcha. Yeah Shaq is purely an edge but if you still roll with the OLB vs. ILB designations I get it. I wouldn't really consider Shaq a LB by the modern definitions.

 

I think both of them will return to Tampa but we'll see. It's going to be pretty tight. They can get up to around $50-60 mil in cap space through restructures and some cap casualties but they have a lot of key guys to sign this offseason.

 

Fortunately for them I think Gronk will take a paycut to return, Evans has already said he'll take a paycut to help re-sign other guys, Brady and Antonio Brown could theoretically do the same as well.

[SoCal Deek]

Football is a game of leverage. If you can rush the passer with only four defenders you’ve won the leverage battle. If you can’t, like the Bills couldn’t, you have to get leverage in the back. Unfortunately our defense effectively sat back both up front and in the back. The result: Bad Things Man!

[SectionC3]

21 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

 

Curious if you agree with this.  I watched the game with my kids (very small and very distracting), so maybe I'm off here.  But I though TB's safeties were diagnosing quickly and flying downhill.  Saw it a bit from Poyer against KC, but not as much from Hyde.  I thought that helped.  (Of course, the big difference was a couple of game wreckers on the TB DL and linebackers that played out of their minds.) 

 

Also, looking at that heat map makes me miss Jordan Phillips.  Better interior DL would have really helped us against them. 

[Richard Noggin]

21 hours ago, ScottLaw said:

Faster, younger, more athletic.... aka stop wasting cap space on old, washed up ex Carolina Panthers...

You've made this point at least a...few times.

[ALF]

On 2/7/2021 at 10:23 PM, Brianmoorman4jesus said:

How did those guys just completely erase Hill?

 

Put pressure on Mahomes

[BuffaloRebound]

55 minutes ago, ALF said:

 

Put pressure on Mahomes

Let’s call it a front 6 since almost everybody plays with 5DB’s now.  Looking at the 2020 salary cap, Tampa used $59m on its top 6 DL and LB’s (Barrett, JPP, David, Suh, White, Vea).  Bills used $50m on their top 6 highest paid DL and LB’s (Addison, Murphy, Hughes, Butler, Jefferson, Klein).  

[TheBeaneBandit]

25 minutes ago, BuffaloRebound said:

Let’s call it a front 6 since almost everybody plays with 5DB’s now.  Looking at the 2020 salary cap, Tampa used $59m on its top 6 DL and LB’s (Barrett, JPP, David, Suh, White, Vea).  Bills used $50m on their top 6 highest paid DL and LB’s (Addison, Murphy, Hughes, Butler, Jefferson, Klein).  

Murphy and potentially 2 others by release should knock us back down. The question is....go after 1 big name or maybe 2 solid but unspectacular guys?....I wouldn't mind big game hunting a Leonard Williams ot even the other big DT on the Giants. 

Edited February 9, 2021 by TheBeaneBandit
Add

[ghostwriter]

Todd Bowles got demolished in the regular season against KC. Why? Because he played a soft defense against them. They were not aggressive, they did not attack, they sat in bubbles waiting just as we do. Once Bowles allowed his players to attack and be aggressive, his defense thrived. He was very aggressive, blitzed quite often, from various places all over the field. Rushed one, dropped one, sometimes dropped everyone and yet his front four still got pressure. Another thing I noticed as well was that when Clyde Edwards Helaire, Travis Kelce and Tyreek Hill got the ball they’d pay for it. Sometimes 2 if not 3 defenders would lay a nasty hit on them just to let them know what was coming every time they got the ball. They also took Hill away, even when Hill went into motion Tampa’s back seven automatically adjusted and mirrored his movements, quickly. You can’t passively sit back against good QBs like Mahomes, you have to create pressure, otherwise they’ll pick you apart.

[HeHateMe]

18 minutes ago, Victory Formation said:

Todd Bowles got demolished in the regular season against KC. Why? Because he played a soft defense against them. They were not aggressive, they did not attack, they sat in bubbles waiting just as we do. Once Bowles allowed his players to attack and be aggressive, his defense thrived. He was very aggressive, blitzed quite often, from various places all over the field. Rushed one, dropped one, sometimes dropped everyone and yet his front four still got pressure. Another thing I noticed as well was that when Clyde Edwards Helaire, Travis Kelce and Tyreek Hill got the ball they’d pay for it. Sometimes 2 if not 3 defenders would lay a nasty hit on them just to let them know what was coming every time they got the ball. They also took Hill away, even when Hill went into motion Tampa’s back seven automatically adjusted and mirrored his movements, quickly. You can’t passively sit back against good QBs like Mahomes, you have to create pressure, otherwise they’ll pick you apart.

They barely blitzed in the Superbowl... their front 4 got pressure almost as soon as the ball was snapped.  That and their LBs are 10x better than Edmunds and Milano..  I think they sent 5 guys a handful of times but that was it.  Injury and reshuffling on the Oline really hurt KC.

 

Bills blitzed a few times and Mahomes would just avoid pressure and complete passes to wide open Hill or Kelce everytime.  Milano had a great opportunity again and whiffed.  

[BuffaloRebound]

1 minute ago, HeHateMe said:

They barely blitzed in the Superbowl... their front 4 got pressure almost as soon as the ball was snapped.  That and their LBs are 10x better than Edmunds and Milano..  I think they sent 5 guys a handful of times but that was it.  Injury and reshuffling on the Oline really hurt KC.

 

Bills blitzed a few times and Mahomes would just avoid pressure and complete passes to wide open Hill or Kelce everytime.  Milano had a great opportunity again and whiffed.  

This.  
They played 3 deep safeties and had Mahomes running for his life rushing 4.  The running game was how to beat that defense but KC’s O-Line fit man-handled and Edwards-Helaire is a slightly better version of Singletary.  

[ghostwriter]

5 minutes ago, HeHateMe said:

They barely blitzed in the Superbowl... their front 4 got pressure almost as soon as the ball was snapped.  That and their LBs are 10x better than Edmunds and Milano..  I think they sent 5 guys a handful of times but that was it.  Injury and reshuffling on the Oline really hurt KC.

 

Bills blitzed a few times and Mahomes would just avoid pressure and complete passes to wide open Hill or Kelce everytime.  Milano had a great opportunity again and whiffed.  

From my end I saw lots of blitzes, not to discredit you in any way, maybe their blitzes were simply just more effective than ours. I will also agree with you very strongly that their LBs are are 10x better than ours. I think the main lesson that should be learned here is that you must allow your guys to attack. They can’t simply sit back and be passive. You must be aggressive and physical on defense. The offense must be punished, whomever has the ball, not just their WRs, TEs and RBs but more importantly the QB. They must be hit hard, preferably by multiple defenders every time they get the ball. In my mind that’s the only way to stop a good offense. Finesse defenses don’t work, must be violent and physical. Whomever gets the ball must pay a tax. Take note how Kansas City moved the ball in garbage time effortlessly late in the 4th qtr. Tampa Bay’s defense was playing prevent at that point, which is pretty much what the Bills have run all year. They started to get gashed up pretty bad. Our Bills defense has some quality players, but the philosophy and scheme is clearly diminishing any talent we have on this roster. 

[babulator]

We really need a stud DE or/pass rusher. I think Jerry is still serviceable if he has a young stud on the other side (His PFF numbers were good). 

 

Beane's 2020 hodge podge approach isn't gonna cut it in the big games. I don't think Lawson or Phillips would have made a difference either.

 

The more I think of it the Oliver pick is going to haunt us for a couple more years. He's never gonna be big or strong enough to hold the line, he doesn't have the burst to be a fearsome pass rusher, and apparently he needs a complimentary big man next to him to be worth anything. He's just sort of... good enough to start.

 

I wonder if Clowney would have made a difference for Hughes last year, or Yannick or whoever else we flirted with?

[NewEra]

44 minutes ago, Victory Formation said:

Todd Bowles got demolished in the regular season against KC. Why? Because he played a soft defense against them. They were not aggressive, they did not attack, they sat in bubbles waiting just as we do. Once Bowles allowed his players to attack and be aggressive, his defense thrived. He was very aggressive, blitzed quite often, from various places all over the field. Rushed one, dropped one, sometimes dropped everyone and yet his front four still got pressure. Another thing I noticed as well was that when Clyde Edwards Helaire, Travis Kelce and Tyreek Hill got the ball they’d pay for it. Sometimes 2 if not 3 defenders would lay a nasty hit on them just to let them know what was coming every time they got the ball. They also took Hill away, even when Hill went into motion Tampa’s back seven automatically adjusted and mirrored his movements, quickly. You can’t passively sit back against good QBs like Mahomes, you have to create pressure, otherwise they’ll pick you apart.

tampa rushed more than 4 pass rushers exactly 5 times.  Bowles blitzed almost 40% of the time during the regular season.  He did the exact opposite vs K . Bowles was exotic with his looks and where he brought pressure from......but he had 8 in coverage on all but 5 plays. That’s not aggressive at all.  Their 4 guys were winning their matchups on almost every play.  

[ghostwriter]

4 minutes ago, babulator said:

We really need a stud DE or/pass rusher. I think Jerry is still serviceable if he has a young stud on the other side (His PFF numbers were good). 

 

Beane's 2020 hodge podge approach isn't gonna cut it in the big games. I don't think Lawson or Phillips would have made a difference either.

 

The more I think of it the Oliver pick is going to haunt us for a couple more years. He's never gonna be big or strong enough to hold the line, he doesn't have the burst to be a fearsome pass rusher, and apparently he needs a complimentary big man next to him to be worth anything. He's just sort of... good enough to start.

 

I wonder if Clowney would have made a difference for Hughes last year, or Yannick or whoever else we flirted with?

We need help on the DL for sure.. Also think we need to add some really physical press corners. DBs that can completely annihilate WRs within that 5 yard window at the LOS. Completely throws off the timing of the offense and it forces QBs to hold onto the ball longer than they’d like. Also need DBs that can lay the lumber down. Obviously no defense will ever be able to step every completion, but every WR or RB that gets the ball must pay a tax.

2 minutes ago, NewEra said:

tampa rushed more than 4 pass rushers exactly 5 times.  Bowles blitzed almost 40% of the time during the regular season.  He did the exact opposite vs K . Bowles was exotic with his looks and where he brought pressure from......but he had 8 in coverage on all but 5 plays. That’s not aggressive at all.  Their 4 guys were winning their matchups on almost every play.  

But did they switch up whom was rushing? Perhaps they were dropping some of their DL into coverage because it seemed like they blitzed Barrett every play.